New Life Games LLC
**Reel Slots** Gaming Machines => IGT S and S-plus Reel Games => Topic started by: 76Brougham on September 17, 2017, 04:04:43 PM
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Hi,
I'll apologize in advance for my ignorance and greatly appreciate any guidance. I'm trying to help a friend who is a complete technical novice who bought a Hot Peppers slot from a gentleman a couple of years ago. That gentleman has been trying to help but he switched hobbies shortly after selling my friend the machine and his memory is fuzzy. It has a SS4709 chip. No bill unit. I've been reading lots of stuff here and am now thoroughly confused and not sure what to try next.
I'll start with where we are now and then how we got there.
Paid display flashing 240/1897. Credits = blank, coins = blank. Blue light flashing rapidly. Wheels are where the last jack pot was hit (they do move and then return to the jackpot when turning machine on and off).
My friend was dusting and accidentally hit the cash out button with something under 2,000 credits on the machine. He generally only plays credits and rarely uses coins. At some point, it stopped dispensing tokens. He can't remember now what the displays said. He opened it and put more tokens in the hopper although the hopper wasn't empty.
When I first arrived, I unseated and reseated the hopper with machine off, several times. Also completely emptied hopper and turned machine back on. At some point it started with a 3100 code. I read here that the lever on the motor housing could be dirty and it if sticks at all it could be a culprit. Yes, it was sticking so I cleaned it and then reseated hopper. No more code and back to the flashing 240/1897 in the paid display. Open/close/power off/power on/reseat hopper multiple times.
The gentleman he bought it from suggested resetting the jackpot which I tried to do with the door open and turning the reset key all the way to the right. There was an internal click. Closed the door and back to the alternating flash of 240/1897.
Tried turning reset key again and then multiple times. Attached is a jpg of what each display window showed with subsequent turns of the key.
At some point play credits displayed and the spin wheels button was illuminated and I hit spin. The wheels did their thing but there was no sound.
Any guidance on where to go from here would be helpful.
Thank you.
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Welcome to NLG. Sounds like a hand pay situation. Try shutting and latching the door then turning the reset key. The key needs the door to be shut and latched for the hand pay to clear. After the hand pay is cleared, the insert coin light should come on and 0 credits.
Put in coins and start again.When it started going to different displays may have been the menu after pushing the test button. If you get back to the flashing display try turning the key with the door shut and latched. If this doesn't work, we're still here.
Dave
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Try lifting the hopper brake and see if you can turn the hopper by hand. Sounds like maybe it's jammed. If it wont turn one way turn it the other. Many times people empty their pocket change and a nickel or dime gets in and can cause trouble. At the top of the hopper where the coins come out is where it usually gets jammed. Once it is able to turn it will need to be filled again and again until the payout is satisfied.
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Thanks, Dave.
To address your comments. Initially, I did try turning the key with the door closed and machine on. The same series of displays occurs with the door open or closed. I went back to the forum archives and did more reading and found that the door should be open, or so I thought, so I tried that again. I also saw a caution of only turning the key 1/4 way but my key only turns 1/4. Should it go farther? Is there a detente at something less than a quarter turn?
Thanks, too, therockinelvis. Again, my apologies for being ignorant, but is the lever I cleaned earlier the brake? If so, then the wheel doesn't turn with that lever depressed. I saw reference to a red piece and that spins freely when the lever is depressed. Is there a picture somewhere of what the brake looks like specifically? I thought I looked through it pretty well to see if there was anything jammed but I didn't see anything. And specific places to look for something jammed?
Thanks!
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Here is a link to the parts of the Hopper brake. Maybe this will help you out. And don't apologize for not knowing, we all started there.
Dave
http://newlifegames.com/nlg/index.php?topic=16845.msg89834#msg89834 (http://newlifegames.com/nlg/index.php?topic=16845.msg89834#msg89834)
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Awesome. That helps greatly. I was in the right place. When I pressed the pawl release, it sometimes did stick. After cleaning, not at all and moves freely. On this unit, the clutch is red as well. When pressing the release, that spins freely, otherwise, just a half turn or less until it catches. Does the brake pawl itself move? If the clutch spins freely when the pawl release is pressed should the coin wheel in the hopper also spin? Perhaps it is jammed? Thanks.
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Maybe I should have looked first. What is the proper way to clean the brake?
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My concern is that it is possible the hopper and or brake may not be working correctly, I'm not sure that is what caused the original problem. Elvis said if the brake is released you should be able to turn the hopper by hand. In the first post you said:
"My friend was dusting and accidentally hit the cash out button with something under 2,000 credits on the machine. He generally only plays credits and rarely uses coins. At some point, it stopped dispensing tokens. He can't remember now what the displays said. He opened it and put more tokens in the hopper although the hopper wasn't empty."
It sounds like it either hit the hopper limit or the hopper has a coin or something jammed in it somewhere. Maybe at the bottom of the wheel a coin could've got jammed or underneath the knife at the top? At one time you mentioned the 3100 error. That error can occur if the hopper is inserted while the machine is on. So it doesn't necessarily mean an extra coin was dispensed. Always have the machine off to remove or replace parts, just good policy. Now can you turn the hopper with the brake released? If not, empty all coins and check carefully for anything stuck inside. Let's start there and we'll tackle one thing at a time.
Dave
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If not the hopper wheel then the motor can be spun by finger while holding the brake open.
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I've just looked more closely at the hopper's coin wheel. I can't see anything that appears to be blocking it or is stuck or wedged anywhere. While depressing the brake, the motor will spin freely, in either direction. The big coin wheel will move, maybe about 1/4" in either direction but something is blocking it. Are there disassembly instructions? Is there anything internally that would stop the wheel from moving?
Thanks!
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here is how the hopper works, when power is applied to the motor, the pivot arm on the motor will pull in, this action will move the red ratchet pawl out of the way so the motor can turn, the motor will now turn counter clockwise, pull the coins onto the pinwheel, rotate them to the top and onto the knife which is laying on the shelf wheel and firmly against the pin wheel, the coins continue on the knife until they go through the optics and roll out of the hopper into the coin tray.
to test the hopper:left hand on the pivot arm of the motor, depress and hold in, with the right hand, put your fingers on the star agitator inside the hopper and turn ccw, this may take alot of force , you should be able to rotate the wheel all the way around.
you can also use a test. in the machine to test the hopper . you can also test it out of the machine.
Jim
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Thanks, Jim. That is what I've done, with the hopper out of the machine. Using more force this time the wheel does spin and the motor shaft spins with it.
Which take me back to the winner paid display alternately flashing 240/1897.
What next?
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I have a question. When you turn the machine on with the door open, after the reels spin, do the displays stay blank or do they come on? If any stay on and you close the door and latch it (door has to be latched), do they go off, reels spin again and then the displays come back on?
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It will be Friday before I can check. Stay tuned!
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sounds as if you have to let the hopper finish paying out the 1897 coins before the game will get back to normal operations. in order to do that, the hopper has to be working. I can't remember if your in a pay cycle if you can get into the machine diagnostics to test the hopper and see what it is doing. you can put 10 coins in the hopper, and move it manually and see if the coins are taking the path I described in the previous post. the coins have to take that path, if not the optic will not see the coin and not count it!. the only other option to get rid of the credits is to clear the machine, which could cause some other minor inconveniences, such as re programming certain options and settings. regardless of which way you go, the hopper still has to be working properly.
Jim
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When you turn the machine on and close the door, does the hopper start spinning? Any noise from it? Remember you have to put the latch all the way down for the optics to see the door as closed.
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I will check that. Is there any way to make the hopper spin with the door open?
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It depends on your SP chip. There is a hopper test, where every time you turn the key it pays 10 coins. Not near my S+ notes right now.
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If there are no credits remaining (you said the credit display is blank), it likely could just be waiting for a coin to be inserted and the next paid game to be played. It doesn't sound like there's an error code being displayed, and the bottom light on the candle flashing rapidly is typical behavior after the machine is first turned on, until a paid game has been played.
You said the Winner Paid display is alternating between 240 and 1897. That says to me that the last game paid 240 coins (does that match the pay combo displayed on the reels right now?), and it paid a total of 1897 coins out of the hopper since the "Cash Out" button was pressed.
I really, really think that it's just waiting for a coin to be inserted and a new game started. Ensure that there's a good sample coin seated properly in the comparator, and adjust the sensitivity down to make it more likely to accept coins if all coins inserted are being rejected to the tray.
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Hi.
Thanks for suggestions. I'm back at the machine after verifying that the hopper coin wheel does spin manually when the brake is released.
When turned on, with hopper in, the winner paid display still flashes 240/1897. Coins played shows 3. The last "winning spin" is still displayed. It always goes back to that. I do not hear any noise/hum from the hopper like it is trying to run. At the moment, there are no coins in the hopper. When I turned the machine on, the wheels did their normal spins. Blue light flashing fast. Cash out button lit and when pressed it turns back off and repeats. Nothing happens when pressing other buttons.
When I then unlock the machine while on, the displays go blank and coins played goes to zero. Blue light remains flashing fast. When I open the door with the machine still on the displays stay blank and the coins played says zero. Pressing cash out turns that button light on and off. No other buttons do anything.
If I turn the machine on with the door open the wheels spin and the display remains blank.
I know I've read elsewhere that there is a way to get the chip number but don't have time to search right now. Will be back at the machine on Sunday.
I put coins in the hopper and turned it manually with the door open. As the coin passed through the optic sensor it rang and then 3100 showed up on the winner paid display. Turning the hopper further to "pay" more coins doesn't result in any additional chimes or changes in the display.
Closing door and locking display goes back to flashing 240/1897.
I need to read to find out how to find my chip number so I can try to test the hopper. Will do later today. No time left right now.
Or maybe the information above will give one of you another idea.
I have tried to reset the jackpot by turning the reset key but it does not clear it. Perhaps I'm doing something wrong. I'm still not clear if there are detents while turning the key. The key turns only 1/4 of a turn.
Thanks for all your suggestions!
I think I've answered the latest round of suggestions and questions.
What next?
<smile>
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An easy way to get your chip number is to remove the mpu board and look at the chip. It has a label on top with the number written on it. This will also give you the chance to inspect the mpu board, to make sure there isn't any battery leakage or beverage spills on it. Removing the mpu is easy. It is mounted to a metal tray and located in the bottom of the machine near the cabinet wall, not far from the coin hopper. The outside of the tray has a round black knob. Just pull upward on the knob and the mpu assembly will disconnect from the motherboard below.
When you get the mpu out of the machine you can look it over to make sure no battery leakage is slowly damaging the circuit board. Post a photo of the mpu for us to see. There are 2 larger chips in sockets that have labels, one chip is your SP chip and the other is the SS chip. The SP chip is also called the GAME chip, the SS chip is the REEL chip, that will be written on the board itself near the chips. The SS chip contains the software for your particular game. The SP chip contains the overall operating software for your machine.
If someone has replaced the SS and SP chips in the past they may have used software copies they made or bought. In that case there may not be a label on them and you will have to get the chip numbers by using the other method, going thru the TEST menus. This method isn't hard to do and getting familiar with the TEST menus is something that is good for any S+ owner.
Anytime you get a machine that is new to you it is important to inspect the mpu board. Otherwise you don't know if there is something like battery leakage or water contamination on it.
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To find out the game (SP) chip and Reel (SS) chip numbers on your S+, you'll need to push the white test button. On the early S+ if the MPU board is on the left wall at the front, the little white button will be about ½ way down just under some connectors. On the later models it will be either on the front of the power switch housing or on the back side of it. Where you can't see it but can reach back and feel it. With the machine on and the door open, push the test button until a 4 shows in the credits played window. Usually about 10 times. You should see 2 sets of numbers, one will be the Game chip and the other will be the Reel chip.
If there are no credits remaining (you said the credit display is blank), it likely could just be waiting for a coin to be inserted and the next paid game to be played. It doesn't sound like there's an error code being displayed, and the bottom light on the candle flashing rapidly is typical behavior after the machine is first turned on, until a paid game has been played.
You said the Winner Paid display is alternating between 240 and 1897. That says to me that the last game paid 240 coins (does that match the pay combo displayed on the reels right now?), and it paid a total of 1897 coins out of the hopper since the "Cash Out" button was pressed.
I really, really think that it's just waiting for a coin to be inserted and a new game started. Ensure that there's a good sample coin seated properly in the comparator, and adjust the sensitivity down to make it more likely to accept coins if all coins inserted are being rejected to the tray.
Is the insert coin light on when the door is closed? If so put a coin in and see if the spin reels button lights up. If it does push the button and see if it will play a game.
Dave
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Do you have a coin in the comparator. Many people see this coin as a free coin. It needs to be there. With the door open you can check the comparator by pushing the small button on it to get pseudo credits and keeping the door open push spin reels.
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Hello, again. Sorry to be so long in following-up on this. Turns out it just needed to have a coin dropped through the comparitor. After doing that, all is well.
That said, the comparitor needs some adjusting. Sometimes the coins get stuck. Is there a guide?
Thanks.
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And, THANK YOU for all the suggestions and hints. Very much appreciated!
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Check the plastic mounting clips for the comparitor. Make sure that none are broken and that the comparitor iis snapped in tight on all 4 clips. If your using quarters or tokens, then make sure that all 4 clips are in the forward position on the bracket. If you were running large coins or tokens, then it would be in the back position of the mounting bracket..