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Author Topic: Need some guidance on testing S+  (Read 4825 times)

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Offline ATXFire

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Need some guidance on testing S+
« on: January 28, 2018, 09:38:18 AM »
I recently aquired an S+ and need some help getting her going. I’ve combed the forums here and haven’t found anything that has worked yet. Background: previous owner said that the machine was working before moving the machine across the state. Movers moved it on it’s back, with the hopper still full. He plugged it in and does what it’s doing now so he sold the machine.
Issue: At power up, the machine top and front lights up. The “25 cent” light also lights up. The reels do energize and nudge when it’s turned on. But this is all I can get it to do.
What I’ve done so far: I pulled the hopper and cleaned out all the coins that were strewn throughout the machine. I pulled the power supply out, cleared all coins from behind and checked for any that got inside. One was inside but was in the bottom dead space. There was no burn mark on it so I’m assuming it didn’t hit the transformer. I checked the fuses with a vom, all are good. I cleaned both ends of the mou power connector with contact cleaner. They didn’t show any signs of burning. Looking at the mpu, there isn’t anything obviously burned or blown. The chips still have their casino tape across them. The battery was tested as good at the board solder joints (3.95v) and had been replaced. It looked like a 5year old soldered it on though, and it’s not the correct leads. They used a short flat lead battery and rigged the old leads, cold soldered it. I’m replacing it if the mpu is good.


Any ideas of what I should look for here?

Offline rokgpsman

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Re: Need some guidance on testing S+
« Reply #1 on: January 28, 2018, 09:49:50 AM »
Is anything showing on the front displays?
Did you pull the motherboard and look under it for loose coins?
If you press the white TEST button inside the machine does anything happen?
Do you have another similar machine or some spare parts so you can swap some things for troubleshooting purposes?
There are people here on NLG that you can send your mpu to for testing to see if it is working ok.

Due to the large number of coins rattling around and the machine was powered up (probably several times) with the loose coins all over the place you may want to try another power supply. Or verify the power supply voltages are all ok by using a meter. Can you measure the voltage at the fuseholders to see if it is correct?

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Offline ATXFire

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Re: Need some guidance on testing S+
« Reply #2 on: January 28, 2018, 10:11:13 AM »
Thank you for the reply and welcome! In my haste of posting, I did forget to mention that the displays are all blank, all the time. The candle is also not lit at all, just the 2 fluorescent lights, and the coin bulb are all that are lit up. I didn’t pull and check the bottom board that the mpu plugs in to. It still has the sealing foam under it and I figured if a coin got in there, it wouldn’t go far enough for me to not see it. Is there a pin out diagram somewhere for power supply testing? Unfortunately, I sold my last pair of S+ machines years ago. So at this time, I don’t have a way to swap parts, but I’m looking to buy another working machine soon. I can tinker and learn on this one, and don’t really mind acquiring spare parts in the process.

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Re: Need some guidance on testing S+
« Reply #3 on: January 28, 2018, 10:34:50 AM »
Maybe door optics or cash can optics? Just a thought.

Dave
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Offline ATXFire

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Re: Need some guidance on testing S+
« Reply #4 on: January 28, 2018, 10:45:03 AM »
Thanks for the reply Dave, but the BV was removed prior to the last owner, and I’m not getting any display on the front. No test button changes. I was able to find the voltage output values to the mpu. I’m in the machine now about to test that. If this checks out, then my guess is the mpu is bad?

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Re: Need some guidance on testing S+
« Reply #5 on: January 28, 2018, 11:02:25 AM »


Its unusual to have blank displays but the reels powered up.....
With the machine off:


A: Remove the hopper
B: Pull the the MPU
B: Unseat and reseat all of the connectors into the mother board (the motherboard is the small one that the MPU plugs into.
C: While you have everything out use a flashlight and look under the motherboard for loose coins. It is possible they went between the foam and the mother board.
D: Examine the MPU - the Reel and Game Chip need to be there. I would reseat those two chips.
E: I would leave the hopper out - worst case this creates a 3100 or 3200 error - of course that would be displayed on the main displays and at this time that would be a good thing.
F: Plug in the MPU and power up


Let us know.







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Offline ATXFire

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Re: Need some guidance on testing S+
« Reply #6 on: January 28, 2018, 11:10:31 AM »
I checked the power supply at the connector that plugs into the board, it all checks out. I’ll pull the motherboard next and report back. Thank you for the steps!

Offline rokgpsman

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Re: Need some guidance on testing S+
« Reply #7 on: January 28, 2018, 11:33:24 AM »
That board at the bottom of the machine is the motherboard, the mpu plugs into it and stands vertically. On the motherboard is the power supply connector that often causes a problem, like a partially dead machine. The classic problem is shown in the photo below, but the darkened area can also be on the backside of the power supply connector. And sometimes the connection is bad even if there isn't a darkened area. So while you are doing the other suggested things closely inspect the power supply connector and the motherboard pins that it connects to. With the machine turned on you can wiggle this connector to see if the machine comes to life.

Also attached is a document about the motherboard power supply connector voltages (thanks elvis!)
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Re: Need some guidance on testing S+
« Reply #8 on: January 28, 2018, 12:23:32 PM »
Update. I pulled it apart, completely. I had it powered up for a while, when I was checking the power supply, and noted that the mpu tray was warm, as was the transformer on it, so I know the power supply to motherboard connection is passing power. There were no coins under the motherboard, so while it was out, I vacuumed it out. I used contact cleaner on the sockets and checked all the pins. All were straight and no discolored traces on the board. I reassembled and double plugged all the connectors. Next, I pulled the casino tape off the chips on the mpu. I did find that the casino that had this machine, didn’t have techs that gave a crap about their equipment. The reel chip had a couple bent up legs, so obviously they don’t have a chip puller. Now the game chip was all effed up. I would assume a bad chip would still throw some sort of error but need to confirm with someone that knows. Basically there are at least 2 legs that I don’t know how they’re still on there. I’m afraid to straighten the legs they’re so thin and bent up.

Offline rokgpsman

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Re: Need some guidance on testing S+
« Reply #9 on: January 28, 2018, 12:34:27 PM »
That chip with the bent legs is probably the problem. Post a photo of it, there is a number on it's label. In fact, post a photo of both eproms, they are next to each other on the mpu board. That way we can make sure you have the correct chips for your machine.
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Offline ATXFire

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Re: Need some guidance on testing S+
« Reply #10 on: January 28, 2018, 02:19:17 PM »
The game chip is the really jacked up one. Label on it is sp1048. There is a repair on one of the legs where it had broken off and was a soldered wire. The reel chip had the original hit label that was stuck to the casino tape and pulled away from the chip window. SS4705 on it. I’m going to straighten the legs as best I can and see if I can get the game chip back in with the solder leg straight. You can see the battery with bird crap solder job.

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Re: Need some guidance on testing S+
« Reply #11 on: January 28, 2018, 04:00:47 PM »
The SS4705 chip is for a 2 coin Double Red, White & Blue game. That chip has a payback percentage of about 93%. If you end up replacing that SS chip you can install an SS4703 if you want to boost the percentage to make it a little more fun playing at home. The SS4703 would take it up to a little over 97% payback percentage. We probably have someone here on NLG that has a replacement SS chip for you. If not there are other places online to get them, just ask if you decide to do that.

Here is the NLG IGT S+ info page for your machine and a chart showing the choices of SS chips it can use. Your upper and lower glass should look like what is shown on this page:

http://www.newlifegames.net/igtbible/IGT%202CM/Game%20Library%20-%20S-Plus%20-%20Double%20Red,%20White%20&%20Blue%20(2%20Coin%20Multiplier).htm


The SP1048 chip controls some of the operating features of the machine. Below is a list of SP chips, you can see that SP1048 is specific to the 10mhz version of mpu boards. So if you were to replace the mpu board you'd want to get another 10mhz mpu so you could move your SP and SS chips to it, or get a new SP chip that is compatible with a 16mhz mpu if that was what you got. Your game is called a "TYPE 0" game, so you need to use an SP chip that is TYPE 0 compatible, but there are plenty of them to choose from. Also, your SP1048 uses ID-023 for communicating with the bill acceptor. So keep that in mind if you ever install a different SP chip, you'd want one that also uses ID-023. (most of them are ID-023 compatible).

http://newlifegames.com/nlg/index.php?topic=303.msg847#msg847

« Last Edit: January 28, 2018, 04:41:48 PM by rokgpsman »
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Offline ATXFire

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Re: Need some guidance on testing S+
« Reply #12 on: January 28, 2018, 06:07:14 PM »
Awesome info! Thank you for sending. This one has the double black tie glass and reel strips in it, and I can confirm this was the game on it when it was at the casino. I also found a tablet with the JP wins for the machine logged as well as a running ticket of service history while it was at that casino. Those things, along with the chip tape says this was pulled and resold. The previous owner sent me the receipt from when he purchased it. Looks like he bought it without the BV in it based on what he paid, and the cash box switch leads were crimped together. The dates match up with each other. Since I am still looking around for machine #2 and don’t have anything solid on a working doner, I picked up a 10 MHz mpu. I am looking for another game right now and suspect I’ll find one this week when folks get back to their shops and can reply. I’ll probably grab replacement chips too for black tie. I’m kinda anal about game swaps and need the whole thing (glass, strips, and chips. I used to buy from la slots when I lived there since they flash what you want, rather than just recycled pulls. I had an eprom programmer and eraser back in time, but that got lost in a move, so no home copy flashing for me.


If there’s anyone closer to Austin, tx that can test this mpu, give me a shout. I don’t want to toss a board if it’s salvagable, they’re getting harder to come by.

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Re: Need some guidance on testing S+
« Reply #13 on: January 28, 2018, 06:16:47 PM »
I think you have the problem solved with just the SP chip. Not having all the legs plugged in could prevent it from having display. I think that is all you need to replace. I bet he changed the battery and needed to do a clear, but tried to ground the legs instead of getting a clear chip then bent them putting it back in. And your MPU is a 10mh as seen from the blue volume pot.
Thank Ya Thank Ya Very Much.

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Re: Need some guidance on testing S+
« Reply #14 on: January 28, 2018, 06:19:12 PM »
I guess Double Black Tie is a clone of Red, White & Blue. IGT did that sometimes.

Here is the 2 coin Double Black Tie page (you probably found this but just in case you didn't or for others that are following along):

http://www.newlifegames.net/igtbible/IGT%202CM/Game%20Library%20-%20S-Plus%20-%20Double%20Black%20Tie%20(2%20Coin%20Multiplier).htm

The 2 wires twisted together are a way to avoid security errors due to cash box not installed or not seated properly. A lot of home owners do that, even if the cash box and bill validator are installed. It cuts down on nuisance errors. It would be nice to know if your mpu is good or bad, and if good it is always nice to have a spare one. Maybe someone here can have you send it to them for testing. (I don't have a way to do that)
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Re: Need some guidance on testing S+
« Reply #15 on: January 28, 2018, 06:25:05 PM »
ianmcneil68 lives in Hurst TX. Maybe close to you. I'm sure he can help.
Thank Ya Thank Ya Very Much.

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Re: Need some guidance on testing S+
« Reply #16 on: January 28, 2018, 06:29:14 PM »
.......I think you have the problem solved with just the SP chip.....

I'm thinking that too, so I'd replace the SP chip and see if the mpu works. And the new SP chip can be used on a replacement mpu, so it wouldn't be a waste to get it.
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Re: Need some guidance on testing S+
« Reply #17 on: January 29, 2018, 10:03:00 AM »
Thanks guys for helping me out. I was able to get the legs pretty straight, and found a couple issues on the mpu socket for the game chip. A couple legs were inserted at one point between the outer plastic and contact. I put it all back together with the same result. There is no way for me to see if the EPROMs are good so I ordered 2 new ones, just in case. While I’m waiting, I have to check the pins from mpu to motherboard, I overlooked that one. I did find on google a couple other folks that had haywire machines doing exactly the same thing but those posts were on ‘05 with no resolution. Soon as I get this figured out, I’ll post what the fix was.

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Re: Need some guidance on testing S+
« Reply #18 on: January 29, 2018, 11:19:12 AM »
Where are you located
Thank You
  Mark

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Re: Need some guidance on testing S+
« Reply #19 on: January 29, 2018, 11:47:03 AM »
North Austin Texas

 

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