New Life Games LLC
**Video Poker, Keno, Slots, 21** Gaming machines => IGT PE and PE Plus Poker Games => Topic started by: bohdi on December 16, 2015, 10:58:44 AM
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Hello all. This is my 1st post, and hopefully it gets me some help. Recently bought my 1st IGT Poker machine. Dated 1987, and is a Double Bonus Poker machine. This is my 1st "slot" machine. I own pinballs and work on them some, but these are new to me. Having trouble with the settings and options. CANNOT get the paytable to show up on the screen, and cannot find a way to adjust the sounds. Finally did get an overpriced manual for it locally, but it's not helping. I've trying adjusting the dipswitches etc. Was able to disable the Double Up/ Down however, but that's about it. I've tried the test button with no credits on the machine and still nothing. Can adjust cards dealt speed, background, hopper test, buttons tests etc. But have no idea how to get the paytable on the screen, and really want the music sounds when winning a hand (countup), and not the click, click, click. Any help or suggestions? Thanks in advance
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Welcome to NLG! I'm sure you'll find the help here you are looking for.
But to make sure we know what machine model you have can you post a photo or two of it? One showing the outside, and another one with the main door open showing the inside. It is easy to attach photos, when entering a comment message just look under the comment message box for the "Attachments and other options" link to click on. It sounds like you may have an IGT PE+, or the previous model PE. But IGT made other video poker models too. [plus, we love seeing pictures of machines!]
Since you've tried adjusting the dipswitches it means you are ok with removing the main circuit board, called the "mpu" board. If you can take a photo of it showing the eproms (ic chips) with labels it will let us identify which game software you have in the machine. Sometimes a particular version of game software does not have certain features.
Just so you know, for a one-time (or continuing) donation to this site you get access to the NLG library which often has manuals and other documentation for a slot machine, but sounds like you have the manual already.
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It's "Danger 86"s Double Bonus machine who started some posts here in August. I believe he posted some pics. I will get some pictures posted hopefully by the weekend.
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It's "Danger 86"s Double Bonus machine who started some posts here in August. I believe he posted some pics. I will get some pictures posted hopefully by the weekend.
ok, here is that previous thread about the machine for folks that want to reference it. I think it was identified as a slant top PE+ machine. EDIT-there are 2 machines pictured in that other thread, the machine being asked about here is the upright.
http://newlifegames.com/nlg/index.php?topic=7723.msg41328#msg41328 (http://newlifegames.com/nlg/index.php?topic=7723.msg41328#msg41328)
Since there are photos of the machine in the other thread there probably isn't a need for you to post more, unless there is something in particular you want to show or something has changed.
Here is a photo from that other thread of the mpu board:
EDIT- this mpu is from the slant top machine in the other thread, not the upright machine
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It's "Danger 86"s Double Bonus machine who started some posts here in August. I believe he posted some pics. I will get some pictures posted hopefully by the weekend.
Just wanted to add a quick note also. The CRT has burn-in of the 5 cards in a much lower position, so it's obvious the cards were much lower on the screen for years, so I assume the paytable was displayed on the screen for many years also, but there is no burn-in of the table, just the 5 cards
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If you can carefully pull that pink tape off the top of the two eproms we can see the labels saying exactly what game software it has. May help if you heat the tape with a blow dryer to soften the adhesive.
From what I remember, on the PE+ machines the dipswitches on the mpu board don't do anything (except for switch #1 which sets the line power frequency selection 50hz/60hz, OFF = 60hz). On PE+ the user preferences are set thru software in the setup screens. When you go thru the setup screens is there a choice for showing the paytable on screen enable/disable? If you didn't see a preference setting for MUSIC on/off or for PAYTABLE on/off then it's possible that game software you have does not have those features.
If it is a PE machine then the dipswitches do set features, although the features may not be implemented, it can depend on the game software.
Also, someone in the past may have changed the game software, the machine may have had different eproms at one time and that accounts for the screen burn you see. Or maybe the video screen was replaced with another used one from a different machine to do a repair. We'll see what ideas others here have.
If it turns out your game software does not have the paytable feature you could look into getting a set of chips called Multi-Poker, it would run on what is called a superboard and it offers 5 different poker games, and has the features you want. EDIT- some machines won't work with a superboard.
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You should have a 5 game multi poker set. The CG2174 + CAPX2174 (in the photo posted) is for the multi poker set that has Bonus Poker, Bonus Poker Dlx, Deuces Wild Poker, Jacks or Better & Dbl Bonus Poker as selectable games.
Which would mean your DATA rom "should" be 1 of 4 known roms:
XM00001P
XM00002P
XM00003P
XM00006P
And no known XMP000xx PROGRAM rom has an option do disable the paytables. If by some chance you don't have the multi poker DATA + PROGRAM rom, the good news is you only need to swap 2 roms to change into one. So if possible let's try to see what's under the red tape. Or if you actually have a different board, please take a hi-res photo of it and post here.
BrianT
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Looking at the other thread as linked to by rokgpsman it looks like you have the upright that's a Double Bonus Poker machine and the MPU (PCB) posted there and here is from the slant top which is indeed a Multi-Poker machine. So yes, in order for us to help you out, you'll need a pic of the MPU in your machine with a high enough resolution that we can read the chips information. Sounds like if you switched the DIPs and turned off the Double Up then you have a standard non-plus board and you have PK0xxx game rom.
That being said the dipswitches are as follows:
1: Monitor Frequency On 50Hz (Euro) Off=60Hz (Standard US setting)
2: Credit On=Credit, Off=Coin
3: Coin Accepter On=Mechanical, Off=Optical
4: Double Up On=On, Off=Off
5: Progressive On=On, Off=Off
6&7 Max Hopper size (4 settings)
8: Show Pay Table On=On, Off=Off
Not all chipsets enable Dip 8, even when set to Show Pay Table the actual game simply doesn't which is common for Joker Poker and some Bonus style games.
The speaker issue (if you're just getting "clicks") is 1 of 3 things: 1 Bad speaker, 2 Bad connection to speaker or 3 the sound chip and or connections to it is bad.
Hope that helps, but do post a pic of the MPU anyways.
BrianT
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Ok. Took some pics last not knowing what had been posted since I left work. I am RARELY online outside work hours 6-3pm. Not sure how well any of you will able to read what your looking for. If there is any more specific you'd like better closeups of, maybe edit the pic and circle what you need to see. Here are the pics
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A couple more pics
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Looking at the other thread as linked to by rokgpsman it looks like you have the upright that's a Double Bonus Poker machine and the MPU (PCB) posted there and here is from the slant top which is indeed a Multi-Poker machine. So yes, in order for us to help you out, you'll need a pic of the MPU in your machine with a high enough resolution that we can read the chips information. Sounds like if you switched the DIPs and turned off the Double Up then you have a standard non-plus board and you have PK0xxx game rom.
Dang- looks like I got on the wrong track when you said your machine was pictured and mentioned in Danger86 postings in another discussion thread. That other thread was about his slant top video poker machine and the mpu photos were from it. So I thought you were referring to it.
The photos you just posted show part of the mpu board you have, need to see a photo of the entire board so we can see what game software is in it. Those eproms with yellow labels are part but not all of the game software. But as BrianT said, you likely have the older mpu that only runs one game (at a time) and your preference choices are limited by the game software itself. You can remove and replace the game software chips to change games if you want to.
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Danger86 had posts for both his poker machines. Guess maybe I didn't specify which? My fault. I will try and take a "good" pic of the entire MPU tonight. Think it will be a bit hard to read, but i'll try and take some good pictures.
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Danger86 had posts for both his poker machines. Guess maybe I didn't specify which? My fault. I will try and take a "good" pic of the entire MPU tonight. Think it will be a bit hard to read, but i'll try and take some good pictures.
I should have made sure which machine you were asking about, thought I knew from reading thru the other Danger86 posts. Anyway, if you can post a photo showing the entire mpu board it will nail things down.
The photos you just posted of the mpu are very good and clear, but they don't show the game software chip/chips on the other side of the board. If you see a chip or two on that side of the board with labels that is what we need to see.
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The photos you just posted of the mpu are good but they don't show the game software chip/chips on the other side of the board. If you see a chip or two on that side of the board with labels that is what we need to see.
I will take more pics tonight. Try and get a closeup of each side of the MPU and 1 of the whole board. Hopefully that will help. Thanks for the input so far.
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So you definitely have the older non Plus PE MPU board. So with the machine on, door closed and idle mode (IE: no coin in or mid hand) turn the Jackpot Reset key. Turns 2 through 4 should show something similar to the attached pics below.
In the first pic above the IGT copyright and year is the CG set your board has, CG534 in this case.
The second pic on the bottom portion shows the supported settings. In this case it shows the Line Freq (for the Monitor), Credit type, Coin mech type, Double up state, Progressive state, the Hopper settings but the "PAYTABLE ONSCREEN" is missing. These values match up to the dipswitch settings as listed above in my other posting. So the paytable setting is ignored by this game.
The third pic shows stats but the second to last line show the "personality" chip ID number. In this case it's PK1069 which happens to be a Double Bonus Poker set. The other value listed shows PC088 which is the build version. Builds have different features like no progressive, no paytable ect....
The final pic shows the setting page from a standard draw poker that does support the payable option as you see the line that states "PAYTABLE ONSCREEN"
I tested 2 Bonus Poker and the shown Double Bonus Poker and none of them allows for the paytable to be shown. Sorry.
BrianT
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BTW: The game chip is right below the battery just out view in your picture you posted. It should be silkscreend "U58" on the MPU board. Likely it doesn't have a label on it or I guess you would have included it. So you can use the Jackpot Reset key to figure out the actual PKxxxx number. Let us know.
BrianT
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Very nice info BrianT!
As far as his sound problem with no music or tones then he likely has a bad speaker, wiring or audio amp on the mpu board?
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So you definitely have the older non Plus PE MPU board. So with the machine on, door closed and idle mode (IE: no coin in or mid hand) turn the Jackpot Reset key. Turns 2 through 4 should show something similar to the attached pics below.
In the first pic above the IGT copyright and year is the CG set your board has, CG534 in this case.
The second pic on the bottom portion shows the supported settings. In this case it shows the Line Freq (for the Monitor), Credit type, Coin mech type, Double up state, Progressive state, the Hopper settings but the "PAYTABLE ONSCREEN" is missing. These values match up to the dipswitch settings as listed above in my other posting. So the paytable setting is ignored by this game.
The third pic shows stats but the second to last line show the "personality" chip ID number. In this case it's PK1069 which happens to be a Double Bonus Poker set. The other value listed shows PC088 which is the build version. Builds have different features like no progressive, no paytable ect....
The final pic shows the setting page from a standard draw poker that does support the payable option as you see the line that states "PAYTABLE ONSCREEN"
I tested 2 Bonus Poker and the shown Double Bonus Poker and none of them allows for the paytable to be shown. Sorry.
BrianT
Thanks Brian. Appreciate the help. I will check later what comes up on mine to make sure. Either way, if the Paytable is not able to be displayed, IS there a way to change it? change a ROM etc.? Also, still need to know if there is a way to adjust the sounds. Get the "music" tones when cashing out, but not when winning a hand. Speaker should be fine if it works on the payout. Just cannot stand the "click" "click" "click" when adds up your winning hand. used the jackpot key to change that, but the Tones it uses are more annoying than the clicking by far. Thanks again for all the help. Do some more checking tonight.
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I'm not sure there is a PKxxxx Double Bonus or Bonus poker that will show a paytable. Just like 95% of Joker Poker games don't show paytables. So if you REALLY want a paytable display you can change out to Standard Draw poker set. The one that I know of that has the best payout is PK0719 at 99.5% for optimal play.
BrianT
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I like the Double Bonus poker as does the wife. One reason I looked for one vs a standard Jacks or Better. Prefer the different 4 of a Kind payouts. So, since my monitor has burn in with the cards much lower than there current state, I'm guessing it has a monitor from a different machine. What would it take to change it to a Standard Draw Poker set If I wanted to do that?
Thanks again and I will see what I come with and report back tomorrow.
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.....What would it take to change it to a Standard Draw Poker set If I wanted to that?
Possibly just changing one chip, the one on the board marked "GAME" or "GM0". The other socketed game chips are for the onscreen graphics (like images of playing cards) and those chips are often the same on a variety of different poker games. So hopefully you'd just have to remove the Game chip and insert a new one.
Some machines have the ability to do an extra-nice upgrade by removing the mpu board and installing a newer version mpu that would allow you to run what is called "Multi Poker". That game software has 5 different poker games, you easily select from the on-screen menu which of the 5 games you want to play. These "superboard" mpu's are available from different sources. But I don't know if that superboard would work in your machine. EDIT- not likely, since your machine is the older PE, not a PE+
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If you want a Standard Draw Poker you just replace the single chip at U58. For Deuces wild you'd need to change out game chip, all 4 CG roms (with CG690) but there again none of the sets I've checked show a paytable either. So far the only sets that I can verify that show the pay table is just standard poker. And it shows only after the 1st coin is inserted and looks like the attached pics, with 1 coin and MAX coin showing 4000 coin bonus for full bet.
BrianT
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I think I found the other NLG discussion thread started by Danger86 about this upright PE poker machine back when he owned it. It has lots of details asked and answered that are also coming up in this thread. One of the photos in that thread shows the idplate, it matches the idplate shown in this thread.
http://newlifegames.com/nlg/index.php?topic=7678.0 (http://newlifegames.com/nlg/index.php?topic=7678.0)
One of the things Danger86 asked about was not being able to display the game's paytable on screen. If you haven't already done so bohdi I'd recommend you read that thread completely and see if there is some useful info there.
The machine is a Player's Edge (non-plus model), this is the mpu shown in that thread for this machine. The 2nd photo is the same mpu with notes (thanks knagl!):
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..... Also, still need to know if there is a way to adjust the sounds. Get the "music" tones when cashing out, but not when winning a hand. Speaker should be fine if it works on the payout. Just cannot stand the "click" "click" "click" when adds up your winning hand. used the jackpot key to change that, but the Tones it uses are more annoying than the clicking by far. Thanks again for all the help. Do some more checking tonight.
With that info I'd say your speaker and associated sound system is ok. You're hearing the sounds offered by that game software, you can't change the sounds to anything else without changing chips to a different game. Remember, this was back in 1986, IGT didn't put a lot of emphasis on elaborate game sounds then.
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For some reason, NOW, I am having trouble with my phone sending pics to my email so I can't upload them here. May be a moot point anyways. But I am going to keep trying. Screen said PK1069 with the jackpot key, and did not list a Paytable option. Still curious about some of the 'chips' etc on the MPU. Try and get those pics up when I can.
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For some reason, NOW, I am having trouble with my phone sending pics to my email so I can't upload them here. May be a moot point anyways. But I am going to keep trying. Screen said PK1069 with the jackpot key, and did not list a Paytable option. Still curious about some of the 'chips' etc on the MPU. Try and get those pics up when I can.
The photo posted above is your mpu board, right? Here is another one of it with notes, was posted in the other thread about this machine. Which chips are you wondering about?
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For some reason, NOW, I am having trouble with my phone sending pics to my email so I can't upload them here. May be a moot point anyways. But I am going to keep trying. Screen said PK1069 with the jackpot key, and did not list a Paytable option. Still curious about some of the 'chips' etc on the MPU. Try and get those pics up when I can.
The photo posted above is your mpu board, right? Here is another one of it with notes, was posted in the other thread about this machine. Which chips are you wondering about?
Yes, I believe that is my MPU. Just curious about what I would maybe need to change if I wanted to switch over to a standard Jacks or Better Poker, or something else. Or, if it is possible to go to a Multi-Poker game even though it's as old as it is. I can live with it as is, just wondering what options I MAY have, and where do you get different "chips" , eproms etc. Just new to the Poker machine world an curious what you can do to them to make them more to your liking if possible.
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As BrianT said earlier you can change to some other video poker games by just replacing the GAME chip eprom, I think it is at board id U58, should be marked "GM0" or "GAME" on the board near the chip. It is the one near the battery circled in yellow in the photo. It doesn't have a label on your board, probably because it has been changed in the past and someone put in an eprom they made or had made. These game software files are commonly available on the MAME gaming websites, anyone can download them and make an eprom. You just carefully pry the old chip out and install the new chip. May have to then do a short setup on your machine the first time powering it up after a game change but it is easy.
For other games, especially ones like keno & slots, you may need to replace the associated software eproms (MR0, MG0, MB0, MX0) and sometimes the nearby Color Prom chip) that are located on the other part of the board. These are the graphics chips, they often work with several but not all GAME chips. These chips contain the info for the on-screen images like playing cards, keno board, etc and their colors. Some video poker games use a different design for their playing cards. So there are different graphics eproms. If you don't change these chips the game will usually run but may display some oddball looking colors or graphics. Doesn't hurt the machine, just your eyes. :garfield:
The list of Player's Edge games is long, click here to see the excellent list BrianT put together:
http://newlifegames.com/nlg/index.php?topic=2547.0 (http://newlifegames.com/nlg/index.php?topic=2547.0)
By matching the numbers on your graphics chips (the eproms with the labels) to the ones on this list you can see what games you could switch to by only replacing the GAME chip. If you have any specific questions about that just contact BrianT, he's a helpful guy and very well informed on the Player's Edge software.
Unfortunately I don't think you can install a Superboard in your machine so that you can get the Multi-Poker game set. I think the Superboard has a different type of board connectors that are made to slide into connectors mounted on a motherboard in a PE+ machine. Look at the photo below and see how your mpu board gets connected to the wiring in your machine. It has a couple of large wiring cables with plugs that connect to the connectors on your mpu board. The Superboard does it differently, it plugs into another circuit board called a motherboard. Your machine does not have this motherboard so the Superboard can't be installed. This was just the way the Player's Edge Plus (PE+) machines were built different from the Player's Edge (PE) non-plus machines. Someone here will correct me if I'm wrong about this. I don't know if you can convert your PE machine to a PE+ by adding a motherboard and a Superboard, that would an interesting project and may be possible.
This is why some owners with machines like yours will buy a few extra mpu boards as they come along at a good price. They keep different game sets of chips in each mpu and can quickly swap mpu boards to change the game. But if you are going to just be changing one chip that probably isn't worth getting another mpu board. They make a ZIF socket that you can plug into your GAME chip socket, it lets you easily and safely swap eproms. If you do this be sure to get the right size ZIF socket, they are made in a wide range of sizes and widths. And it will add a little height to your mpu so make sure there is some headroom above it.
The blank eprom themselves are easily found everywhere like ebay, electronics stores and slot machine dealers. You or a friend can download the game software, then to load it into an eprom you use what is called an eprom burner or eprom programmer.
Here is one popular model, but there are dozens of different ones. You can find this same eprom programmer for sale on ebay and other places, new and used. Most low cost programmers connect to your computer and comes with software to operate it.
http://www.mcumall.com/comersus/store/comersus_viewItem.asp?idProduct=4282 (http://www.mcumall.com/comersus/store/comersus_viewItem.asp?idProduct=4282)
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For some reason, NOW, I am having trouble with my phone sending pics to my email so I can't upload them here. May be a moot point anyways. But I am going to keep trying. Screen said PK1069 with the jackpot key, and did not list a Paytable option. Still curious about some of the 'chips' etc on the MPU. Try and get those pics up when I can.
BriantT's list shows PK1069 to be a Double Bonus Poker game, 99.1% payback, uses CG534 game roms and the CAP435 Color Attribute Prom. The 4 graphics roms are 27128 or equivalent eproms. Other video poker games on his list that use the same graphics roms are:
Standard Draw Poker, PK0719, 99.5% payback
Four of a Kind Bonus Poker, PK1030, 98.0% payback
(there are a few other versions of these 2 games that have a lower payback percentage)
Other poker games that would require swapping all the board eprom chips are:
Joker Poker
Deuces Wild Poker
Aces & Faces 4 of a Kind Poker
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bohdi has a Player's Edge (PE), not a Player's Edge Plus (PE+). None of the multi-poker games will work on a PE.
Also, for clarification, the PE MPU board is different from the standard PE+ MPU board, which also different from the PE+ superboard MPU.
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bohdi has a Player's Edge (PE), not a Player's Edge Plus (PE+). None of the multi-poker games will work on a PE.
Can a PE be converted to a PE+ by adding the PE+ motherboard and a PE+ mpu, plus some wiring cables, or is there more to it than that? The machines are so similar I was wondering if a conversion could be done for a reasonable amount of effort and cost.
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The short answer to that is, no.
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The short answer to that is, no.
ok, thanks.