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**Reel Slots** Gaming Machines => Bally Electromechanical => Topic started by: Herbie21 on July 27, 2020, 10:33:56 AM
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Hi I am working on a 809, finally sorted my shorts out and stopped the bell from ringing, but my coin accpeted lamps gives around 20volts when activated, any idea what to do thanks, Herbie
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I would check again for shorts. With door open look for voltage when you touch case with 1 probe and with other check blue wire then yellow then orange feed wires.
You should have ZERO volts. If you do have V, pull out each subunit one at a time until it disappears. Then that one is the culprit.
Also check V off your transformer at the source. Should be 6v and 50v and 56 measuring between blue and orange iirc
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if the other lamps are ok (winner paid, odds lights, insert coin), then the problem is probably not on the 6V supply side of the circuit.
the coin accepted light turns on via yellow/black wire 38-1 on the coin relay.
look for an issue with that wire at the coin relay and plug connections. If that looks ok, you'll need to follow the wire between the lamp and coin relay looking for a problem.
make sure the switch blades aren't shorting on the coin relay due to misadjustment or missing fish paper insulation between blades.
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Boys first a picture of the beauty, found somewhere in Switzerland for $250, from LV! OK some mechanical things are broken, but I have the parts and done it before, only the voltage is bugging me now
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Dear Old Reno,
thanks for your reply I checked for shorts your way with OHM meter all are 0, When I check the volt way you describe above I get volt on all colours and the don't go away when opening the subunits?
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thx Wolftalk, I found an other short at the payout reset pal, the further I go the worse it gets I still have volt on 'insert coin' and 'coin accepted' of around 23 but with the odd set up the chanhge to 7 volt and then with the next step again 23v also I lost the general ilumination in the door which will flash when setting up the odds?
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the odds unit diagram is below ... probably correct for your machine.
it's possible to install the wipers onto the shaft two ways ... only one is right. The diagram shows the wipers in the reset position. Verify yours are on the unit correctly.
post a picture with unit at reset if not sure.
also, what does it say on the plate below the handle? Top number is the full model number.
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Attached 809 schematic
[/size]
[/size]Check out the payout relay top left on back of the hopper.
[/size]Any abnormality may cause current to seek another path.
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Hi Boys, two more pictures @ Old Reno, I think odds unit is OK?
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you have the odds unit used on later 809 games. See below (the drawing is the wiring side of the contact plate).
since your problem depends on the position of the odds unit, I'd step the unit to a place where you see the 20+V and then stick paper under each wiper finger one at a time to see if the voltage drops back down to 6-7V.
the only wiper in the 6V circuit is the one pointing to position 0 at reset, so you can just lift that up with your fingernail and see what happens.
make sure that wiper finger is not touching other fingers, and also make sure that black stuff on the rivets isn't bridging to rivets on the middle ring and has metal flakes in it. You should just clean that black stuff off ... alcohol and a green scrub pad will work. You want shiny rivets with no gunk in between them.
a really thin smear of contact cleaner/lube, lightweight mineral oil, silicone lube, CV joint grease, or whatever on the rivets will help. Make sure whatever you use doesn't cause the wipers to slow down at reset ... they should whizz back to the reset stop without dragging.
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Dear Old Reno, it is getting worse and worse, now he is not paying the multiple prices accepting coins and stepping up the odds unit. I have added a photo of my set up luckyly I have extention cables. I mapped the voltage in the different stages of the proces maybe this gives you a clue where to look.
machine at rest after payout insert coin (IC) 7volt and coinaccepted (CA) 20 volt
fist coin IC 7V ca 7v
second IC 7V CA 7V
tird coin IC 7V CA 7V
fourt coin IC 7V CA 7V
fift coin IC 30V CA 7V
after coin relay lever pushed back IC 7V CA 20V
habdle release pushed up IC 7V CA 20V
during payout IC 38V IC 7V
after payout IC 7V CA 20V
I never had such stuff and this is my 12th machine
hope you can help
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dear Wolftalk,
i did what you sugested but saw now changes, will do it again through the different stages i mentioned above, thanks for the odds unit picture
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dear all, i realize that there is no voltage on the general illumination in the door anymore, and with every coin drop and advance of the odds unit the flash short only during step up
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got a high resolution picture of the entire coil side of the odds unit? You can email to slotpics@cdyn.com if it's too big to post and I'll try to downsize it and post it.
there is an "end of stroke" switch on the odds unit that opens when the step up coil plunger is pulled in. If you open that with your finger, do the GI lights turn on?
since you have problems when the odds unit is reset and at the top step, I'd guess you have an issue with the "pin switches" ... the ones that are operated by pegs sticking out of the white plastic ratchet. Seems like some switch blades are touching that shouldn't be and shorting things in the 6V and 50V circuits together.
when you have the high voltage, stick paper between any blades that are touching on the pin switches and see what happens. Definitely check the blades with yellow/brown wire 36-1 and grey/red wire 91-2 (if the schem I'm looking at for a 809-8ZP is close enough to your game) as those are the most likely way to affect the coin accepted and insert coin lights.
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dear all.
I can't measure the voltages now as my meter broke down, will get a new one.
Dropping a coin, setting up the oddsunit the general illumination flashes shortly, it doesn't do this when I put paper in th EOS of the odd unit.
Also the odds unit steps up but the payout multiplier is not working anymore.
I checked the voltage on th transformer and is fine, even the voltage in the door plug blue and yellow showed 7 volt.
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it may be easier to solve the GI problem first as it's a big hint that something is wrong with the main power wiring.
if your yellow wire 30 or blue wire 20 has a problem someplace, you can get odd side effects as DavidLee mentioned.
was the coin switch ever replaced? If so, you may want to verify it's wired correctly with wire 30 on the common terminal first.
do this:
1] cycle game once via coin and verify the handle switch tripped to enable the handle to be pulled
2] hold down the coin switch. Do the GI lights come on?
3] if yes, stick your paper in the EOS switch on the odds unit and repeat. GI lamps stay off?
if yes, wire 30 is probably broken some place.
easiest thing when you have a meter is to put one probe on a power wire - wire 20 for the 6V or wire 70 for the 50V, take your pick - and use the other probe on wire 30 anywhere you want. If you don't get the correct voltage, then wire 30 is not connected back to the transformer at that point.
there's no way to tell how wire 30 is routed around the game, but it won't be on multiple plug pins going to the same game unit area (hopper, reel mech, door or top compartment). i.e. it doesn't go "into" the top compartment on one plug pin and come "out" on a different pin.
if you machine is like a 809-5ZB, wire 30 is on pin 5 of the 24 pin plug for the top shelf stuff and also on pin 5 of the 12 pin door plug. There may be a double wire at either/both of those places. Look for a wire breaking off.
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Speaking of door molex plugs. Burned or very discolored plugs could indicate internal problems.
Internal heat and or corrosion can cause problems. All 3 voltages travel through the door plugs.
A thorough inspection and eliminating these as a cause would be in order.
Photo showing a problematic plug that needed attention to correct intermittent 6 volt lightning.
Compared to bottom photo.
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Dear both,
I did the test:
1] cycle game once via coin and verify the handle switch tripped to enable the handle to be pulled2] hold down the coin switch. Do the GI lights come on?3] if yes, stick your paper in the EOS switch on the odds unit and repeat. GI lamps stay off?answer yes, so my wire 30 is probably broken at some place.
I will start the search when I get my new multimeter as you discribed and will keep you posted! Thanks a lot!
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Do the insert coin, coin accepted and winner paid lights work?
A jumper from a common yellow else where in the door to the common yellow on the light circuit.
May narrow the search or prove the yellow in the door is open.
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Hi All,
in the mean time the machine is not taking coins and stepping up.
When I put a jumper from the top unit and connect to the coin switch coins ARE accepted and the machine is stepping up!!!
When I connect the jumper to the coin lockout coil it gets engined
But when I connect to the GI lamps nothing happens,
strange
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if you jumper 30 to a door GI light and it doesn't come on, then the wire 20 side has no power, the lamp is burned out, or the lamp socket is bad. If the outer/barrel part of the socket spins easily, you often get a bad connection.
did you check the molex plugs per david post above? Pull the plugs apart and look for burnt pins or pins that are push back in the housing so they don't connect when the plug is put together.
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SORRY referring to last message the GI lamp worked as well (lamp was broken!)
So the is a 30 broken some where now to find it where, we are getiing close!!!!
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The GI lights are working now, lamp was broken, when I jumper 30 to the coin switch.
the 30 between the attendant switch and the coin switch has no continuity!!
I will jump and see!!
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found the 30 with no continuity
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Thoroughly inspect all the switches.
Especially the coin relay switch.
If it doesn’t mechanical reset, the machine will not operate.
Test all contacts of every switch, especially the coin relay switch for continuity.
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Machine works as before with the jumper to the coin switch also the GI lights.
I wonder if the voltages on the insert coin and coin accepted lights will will correct now.
I will know on Tuesday when my meter will be in and will let you know!!
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PROBLEM SOLVED, thanks All!!!
To summerize the issue:
My insert coin and coin accepted lights blew and it seems that there were strange voltages on these lights changing when the odds unit steps up.
I was recommeded to check on the continuity of the yellow(30) and found that in the door there were two loops op 30 one connected to the 30 and one not, being on its own. When i connected both loops all was ok.
Ok but how come not all the 30 where connected in the door i couldnt find a loose end?
Then i had a closer look at the coin switch and compared it with a 873 a saw that in my 809 the ramp switch was removed with all the 30 wires which connect the lower door GI through the ramp switch with the coin switch. One jumper from the GI to the coin switch and all is working perfect!
I have added two photos of my 873 and the 809 with the mistake.
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This is 873 before 809