New Life Games LLC
**Reel Slots** Gaming Machines => Bally Electromechanical => Topic started by: Karloz25 on March 18, 2021, 09:55:44 AM
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I have a 1088-2 EM machine.
The machine accepts coins.
Handle works.
Reels spin and stop good.
No payout after a winning combo.
The tilt light is always on.
I’ve replaced both blue capacitors on the hopper.
The hopper has no signs of life during game play.
I haven’t heard it energize.
Any ideas?
(https://i.ibb.co/RPRjRYf/706-DE2-BC-356-A-468-E-8677-D23-FD93-C50-CF.jpg) (https://ibb.co/RPRjRYf) (https://i.ibb.co/NZ006Tx/86487-EB8-82-AD-4-BEB-A986-502-AA8-ED761-B.jpg) (https://ibb.co/NZ006Tx) (https://i.ibb.co/z5FDWd6/9-E517-E1-F-3-D87-419-E-B8-A1-DA39-CE5-EAA6-B.jpg) (https://ibb.co/z5FDWd6) (https://i.ibb.co/ZMbgphb/31-A89081-D4-F5-4-CF1-9192-37386897-DFFD.jpg) (https://ibb.co/ZMbgphb)
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I'm not familiar with the 1088, so I'm offering general advice based on what would cause the problem on the 873 or 1091 that I own.
Most Bally machines have a tilt switch; it's likely located in the feature unit above the reels.
That switch is normally closed and one of the leaves has a weight on it. If the machine is moved, the weight moves, the switch opens and that will cause the tilt light to light up.
If that switch is misadjusted so that it's always open, that will cause your tilt light to remain on and will likely prevent the machine from doing anything useful. On my 1091, that switch is located in a position that makes it easy to accidentally hit or mangle while you're working on other things.
If that switch is OK, then the next likely culprit would be misadjusted switches on your anti-cheat relay.
I'm an amateur at this, but it's a good place to start. I'm sure Wolftalk will chime in shortly with more model-specific suggestions.
Photo of a typical tilt switch attached.
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1088-2 looks like a sands casino machine. Uses same reel tapes, payout counter, index discs, etc as the 94.66% payback version of the 1088, which you can grab the paperwork for from https://bingo.cdyn.com/slots/
on the 1088 bally called the "anti-cheat relay" the "hopper cutoff relay". There should be a reset button near the top/right of the door opening. If you push it, the hopper cutoff relay should power and keep itself powered. It should also power and stay powered when the handle is pulled.
if you want to see if that's your only issue, you can strap down the hopper cutoff relay armature plate onto the coil top and see if the game pays then. If it does, you just need to figure out why the hopper cutoff relay isn't powering or staying powered. Is the schematic good enough or do you need more specific info?
the 1N4004 diode if bad can be replaced with a 1N400x, where X >= 4. 1N4007 is very common and usually the packaging costs more than the diodes inside :-)
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1088-2 looks like a sands casino machine. Uses same reel tapes, payout counter, index discs, etc as the 94.66% payback version of the 1088, which you can grab the paperwork for from https://bingo.cdyn.com/slots/ (https://bingo.cdyn.com/slots/)
on the 1088 bally called the "anti-cheat relay" the "hopper cutoff relay". There should be a reset button near the top/right of the door opening. If you push it, the hopper cutoff relay should power and keep itself powered. It should also power and stay powered when the handle is pulled.
if you want to see if that's your only issue, you can strap down the hopper cutoff relay armature plate onto the coil top and see if the game pays then. If it does, you just need to figure out why the hopper cutoff relay isn't powering or staying powered. Is the schematic good enough or do you need more specific info?
the 1N4004 diode if bad can be replaced with a 1N400x, where X >= 4. 1N4007 is very common and usually the packaging costs more than the diodes inside :-)
Thanks for the links.
I’m still new at this, it’s my first EM machine.
I have pressed the silver cherry switch on the top right and nothing happens.
Regarding the hoppy cutoff, and diode. I not sure what those are.
I will post pics of the hopper and maybe you can help me identify them.
This machine does not have a anti cheat weight switch, I haven’t seen one.
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(https://i.ibb.co/DVGb7n8/12-BAC255-A29-B-4-A49-855-F-7-CB6-CD49-FDFB.jpg) (https://ibb.co/DVGb7n8) (https://i.ibb.co/6F9H27Z/8-FE5-C82-F-25-AE-4-B86-8-A42-F1-C71384-C1-B2.jpg) (https://ibb.co/6F9H27Z) (https://i.ibb.co/gMRMP6P/590-C286-C-11-C7-4-CF8-B66-E-EE05-D2-CDE8-F4.jpg) (https://ibb.co/gMRMP6P) (https://i.ibb.co/C1T5ZPn/EC8-BCE31-E376-4085-8-ED7-76-B48-F0-F9-A60.jpg) (https://ibb.co/C1T5ZPn) (https://i.ibb.co/0yw7YKP/9-AC8-AF5-F-DDE0-4736-B9-C8-AE719-DFE00-F1.jpg) (https://ibb.co/0yw7YKP) (https://i.ibb.co/bzmBvjt/C75-E1-C7-C-31-C8-4980-9-E49-6-B1486-F3-C45-B.jpg) (https://ibb.co/bzmBvjt) (https://i.ibb.co/4JJZffF/C894-CB8-E-B0-F5-4901-BDDA-67-AC383-E4-E57.jpg) (https://ibb.co/4JJZffF) (https://i.ibb.co/yRPXMcy/FDE99-F82-1-CCF-42-FD-BDCF-EDB9-ACC19-F93.jpg) (https://ibb.co/yRPXMcy) (https://i.ibb.co/RSdCSSN/A2-B532-B4-E78-B-4-ED6-9387-3-BA52-B1-F2-AE7.jpg) (https://ibb.co/RSdCSSN)
I also noticed on the coin unit what seems to be a broken “tooth†on the gear, is this normal?
The missing teeth, can be seen just about where the grease is on the white gear.
(https://i.ibb.co/tYMr5yh/6-B5-D107-C-2-DE6-4505-941-A-7-B7-DC3-B9-F596.jpg) (https://ibb.co/tYMr5yh)
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nice pics! Mind if I swipe them and add them to the pics with the paperwork?
hopper cutoff relay labeled below [edit ... no it's not - I screwed up]
the flat spot/missing teeth on the ratchet is normal. That prevents the unit from physically stepping up more than it should. When the unit has stepped to the flat spot, it's at the "top" step.
if you jamb a piece of cardboard between the bottom of the payout relay and the hopper cutoff relay to hold down the HCR armature plate on the coil top, that'll tell you if that's your only issue.
you do have something odd ... the black wire on the left coil lug is supposed to be orange wire 70. Ya may want to follow it thru the harness and see where it goes. If it goes to the hopper plug, see if it's the right pin for wire 70 per the plug chart on the schematic. It may be okay and it's a difference between the 1088 and 1088-2 ... worth checking to see.
the wire id -> colors chart is also on the schematic, so you can make sure which pin is supposed to be wire 70 be verifying there's a brown/blue wire next to it and a black/green wire below it. I always forget whether the plug chart is looking at the plug or socket, and/or from the wire side or the pin/socket side. If ya figure it out, let us know :-) The plug and/or socket is actually numbered on the back ... or front ... I forget that also.
oh, and the schem says the capacitor on the HCR is supposed to be 50 MFD. Yours is 30 MFD. It'll probably work fine, but if you have a 50 MDF handy that is rated at least 150V, bung that in when you are bored.
the switches with the weight on a blade is sometimes called a "slam tilt switch". A lot of casinos didn't need them because the floor was monitored and there were lots of employees roaming around. On the 1088, the tilt light being on means the HCR is not powered.
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nice pics! Mind if I swipe them and add them to the pics with the paperwork?
hopper cutoff relay labeled below.
the flat spot/missing teeth on the ratchet is normal. That prevents the unit from physically stepping up more than it should. When the unit has stepped to the flat spot, it's at the "top" step.
if you jamb a piece of cardboard between the bottom of the payout relay and the hopper cutoff relay to hold down the HCR armature plate on the coil top, that'll tell you if that's your only issue.
you do have something odd ... the black wire on the left coil lug is supposed to be orange wire 70. Ya may want to follow it thru the harness and see where it goes. If it goes to the hopper plug, see if it's the right pin for wire 70 per the plug chart on the schematic. It may be okay and it's a difference between the 1088 and 1088-2 ... worth checking to see.
the wire id -> colors chart is also on the schematic, so you can make sure which pin is supposed to be wire 70 be verifying there's a brown/blue wire next to it and a black/green wire below it. I always forget whether the plug chart is looking at the plug or socket, and/or from the wire side or the pin/socket side. If ya figure it out, let us know :-) The plug and/or socket is actually numbered on the back ... or front ... I forget that also.
oh, and the schem says the capacitor on the HCR is supposed to be 50 MFD. Yours is 30 MFD. It'll probably work fine, but if you have a 50 MDF handy that is rated at least 150V, bung that in when you are bored.
the switches with the weight on a blade is sometimes called a "slam tilt switch". A lot of casinos didn't need them because the floor was monitored and there were lots of employees roaming around. On the 1088, the tilt light being on means the HCR is not powered.
(https://i.ibb.co/dJBmPG1/7-ECDCE61-3-A83-4-AE8-BD0-B-56-BAD20514-C5.jpg) (https://ibb.co/dJBmPG1)
I jammed two pieces of cardboard and wedged the relay coil.
Powered on the machine and the hopper had life, it kept spinning loudly.
I unplugged it and waiting further instructions.
No coins in hopper.
After about 30 seconds running it shuts off and the amber lights kicks on for the safety reset switch.
I did screw the “weight “ level switch on the hopper to be clicked on the whole time as I have been testing it and didn’t want to have a full bin of quarters regularly in the way.
I have a 50 MDF that I will install later tonight, I had replaced the one that’s as on there before as it looked damaged, but it too was a 30MDF
This is a pic of the old one.
(https://i.ibb.co/gd6wnsG/37-D3-A263-44-C9-470-D-A36-C-F85573-F0-F329.jpg) (https://ibb.co/gd6wnsG)
Yes you can use my pics. I can share the whole unit, as I’ve searched for this 1088-2 unit online and have found very little results.
Side note: the machine accepts quarters, although the marquees states $1.00’s, is this a Susan b Anthony machine?
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you do have something odd ... the black wire on the left coil lug is supposed to be orange wire 70. Ya may want to follow it thru the harness and see where it goes. If it goes to the hopper plug, see if it's the right pin for wire 70 per the plug chart on the schematic. It may be okay and it's a difference between the 1088 and 1088-2 ... worth checking to see.
the wire id -> colors chart is also on the schematic, so you can make sure which pin is supposed to be wire 70 be verifying there's a brown/blue wire next to it and a black/green wire below it. I always forget whether the plug chart is looking at the plug or socket, and/or from the wire side or the pin/socket side. If ya figure it out, let us know :-) The plug and/or socket is actually numbered on the back ... or front ... I forget that also.
Following the black wire from the coil, leads to the 60Hz spot of the hopper motor.
Is this ok?
(https://i.ibb.co/K9NVqb8/CE7-FFF12-F731-4940-B47-E-9860-A6751-A24.jpg) (https://ibb.co/K9NVqb8) (https://i.ibb.co/nfdLdf5/8-CEFC45-C-F888-43-D2-B910-776-AF8-D7083-D.jpg) (https://ibb.co/nfdLdf5)
The actual orange wire from the harness #70 actually runs to a relay box under the hopper.
It’s attached to a 50mdf.
(https://i.ibb.co/8dzQ5fH/E46-BD6-CF-4-EC6-44-D9-8-AE5-6-CE2055-C7825.jpg) (https://ibb.co/8dzQ5fH) (https://i.ibb.co/h9Q2QLv/333-B5-D3-F-67-E7-4-F92-B7-E4-6044309188-C0.jpg) (https://ibb.co/h9Q2QLv) (https://i.ibb.co/7gh6tw7/9-B89630-B-FA60-403-F-9-EAE-A09-F756-F5-E15.jpg) (https://ibb.co/7gh6tw7) (https://i.ibb.co/bXLZ7yZ/168-DBAE8-D459-428-E-B62-A-034-EDA6-DD312.jpg) (https://ibb.co/bXLZ7yZ) (https://i.ibb.co/60xBvSM/5752-FDF3-51-F2-435-D-BD04-942-B1-D37-DC3-D.jpg) (https://ibb.co/60xBvSM) (https://i.ibb.co/YWbNCcZ/A918-E328-0217-4-A03-A007-651-CE4-CAA969.jpg) (https://ibb.co/YWbNCcZ)
Another thing very wired is, I found some modern crimped wires, meaning someone has worked on this before. Seems like
Some one cut the brown and orange wire from the hopper. The brown and orange wire leads from payout switch to the relay box below the hopper. The wires were cut in half and then each new end was crimped to another wire leading to the male harness on the hopper. The female harness clip also had to new wires added on and tracing those lead to series of connections on the back of the machine on the wall. Is this normal? What do you think it was for?
Hopefully the pictures tell the story. I took pictures following the wires from the new crimps.
The pencil in the pics shows where the wires are at.
(https://i.ibb.co/Cbrq42z/52-A97-EB5-BDA9-43-E0-89-EB-DA51-C0056-AE8.jpg) (https://ibb.co/Cbrq42z) (https://i.ibb.co/DCGdLkL/1718-C4-FE-8-CCA-443-C-BC55-4-AB127-F152-BB.jpg) (https://ibb.co/DCGdLkL) (https://i.ibb.co/xfFVFP8/3-A5-F927-D-ACF4-4-AA9-BB23-770-B6196-B002.jpg) (https://ibb.co/xfFVFP8) (https://i.ibb.co/2tmBQbr/0553-B067-62-B9-424-E-903-B-9-A118417-AAF7.jpg) (https://ibb.co/2tmBQbr) (https://i.ibb.co/7nv43Mc/2945-E3-EA-CC19-4-A96-BA77-60-C977-BB092-A.jpg) (https://ibb.co/7nv43Mc) (https://i.ibb.co/cxnsg0P/A646-ABDC-6170-4-C01-90-A6-33-D0-ADE9-EE03.jpg) (https://ibb.co/cxnsg0P) (https://i.ibb.co/QJTQzX4/5-FEA096-B-2-C02-4892-8-D9-F-CAD530-DC3479.jpg) (https://ibb.co/QJTQzX4) (https://i.ibb.co/hgnHvVp/891-C0-E4-C-4129-4-F76-A063-35475-E79580-A.jpg) (https://ibb.co/hgnHvVp) (https://i.ibb.co/ZLCBKXW/537-DA6-E7-A416-49-EF-87-FF-E0-C79-BD3-D708.jpg) (https://ibb.co/ZLCBKXW) (https://i.ibb.co/qjqgXKm/ABCEB16-C-FF90-418-C-91-B9-3-CF8-EFECF5-E8.jpg) (https://ibb.co/qjqgXKm) (https://i.ibb.co/41cBGZ9/A5-BD5-DEF-83-AD-433-B-8726-7-EBD9-F97-CC78.jpg) (https://ibb.co/41cBGZ9) (https://i.ibb.co/VmmWFMW/C57587-BA-3420-4721-9221-ADCD7-DCBDBCE.jpg) (https://ibb.co/VmmWFMW) (https://i.ibb.co/9yb6LrM/5-FBCBCE3-CEDC-4-F63-8276-B2-A2-E681-DFE8.jpg) (https://ibb.co/9yb6LrM) (https://i.ibb.co/F0rQWvS/E9-D7-D3-B1-0-AD5-4-EA6-B2-DA-51-C988-A6-B783.jpg) (https://ibb.co/F0rQWvS)
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ok, I blew it. The relay I labeled as the hopper cutoff relay is really the delay relay, the 30 MFD capacitor is right, the black wire on the delay relay coil is right, and there's pretty much nothing good I can say except sorry about that.
you found the actual hopper cutoff relay. If you can see it when the hopper is installed, see if you can tell if the relay powers when you hold in the reset button at the top/right of the door opening (if that's where it is). The relay should also power when you have the handle release relay tripped so the handle is free, but don't pull the handle. When the relay powers, the tilt light should go off.
the cut brown/orange wire is wire 67. They inserted the door hinge switch into the circuit. I assume the hinge switch is closed when the door is closed, so your game won't pay if the door is open unless you hold in the reset button. You can disable that by jumpering the two lugs on the terminal strip they attached the added wire to or removing those crimps/wires and putting the wire 67 ends back together.
note that bally may have made that change ... only way to know is find a 1088-2 schematic (W-1046-1933), and the casino-specific schems are not likely to be found.
the entire hopper cutoff relay circuit is to prevent people from fishing a wire up where the coins drop into the tray and holding the roller that is detecting an ejected coin up (i.e. hopper pulse switches don't make pulses, so the payout counter doesn't step up). When they did that, the game didn't count ejected coins and emptied the hopper out ... at least until the safety circuit shut the machine down if they weren't savvy enough to count a coin occasionally to recharge the delay relay capacitor.
since your hopper cutoff relay is encased, you can't hold down the armature plate unless the plastic shell comes off. If you want to bypass it, the easy thing is to jumper the payout relay coil red/blue wire 12 directly to wire 70, then the hopper cutoff circuit doesn't matter ... then pull out the relay so the tilt light doesn't stay on.
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Thanks Wolftalk for replying...
Last night I test the relay box using the door.. It works. As I tap it, it opens and closes. The relay does not open or close when coins are inserted or handle is released.
(https://i.ibb.co/dfky23q/35906-C75-75-F5-451-E-92-E4-669228-B5-CC51.jpg) (https://ibb.co/dfky23q) (https://i.ibb.co/qny89nH/F2517-C14-B546-4974-9-A5-C-4-EE9-C17-E5-A86.jpg) (https://ibb.co/qny89nH) (https://i.ibb.co/16szQjQ/9-BCE3726-0958-4722-B169-16-BE93-C85-A36.jpg) (https://ibb.co/16szQjQ)
I also reconnection the 67 Wire.
No difference. Same issue.
(https://i.ibb.co/3ctK9Xr/D8-C16-DD6-8342-4-D73-8-E3-F-84-B684-C133-DD.jpg) (https://ibb.co/3ctK9Xr)
With the cardboard on both coils, the hopper runs for about 60seconds spitting out quarters, then shuts down and amber light comes on.
The cherry switch on the top right dosnt seem to do anything.
(https://i.ibb.co/dpLB6bR/FDE90-C9-F-8004-43-BA-A08-B-B9-B95-E185533.jpg) (https://ibb.co/dpLB6bR)
Not sure whats causing the hopper NOT to energize.?
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Also how can I test the Coils? They do not seem to open or close on there own.
Do they need replacing?
This is a pic of my unit before I replaced the capacitor; for reference of the 2 Coils that need testing.
(https://i.ibb.co/Jvy45hY/BC1-AD81-F-D072-465-A-AC84-51-ECED158191.jpg) (https://ibb.co/Jvy45hY)
The owner did give me a paper with some info, I believed they were referring to the "capacitor" that was bent and beat up, but after replacing that, the same issue continued.
Is there resisters on the hopper that are testable?
(https://i.ibb.co/rdmYHqP/8-FC33385-0-D77-4165-836-C-DB7577-C07470.jpg) (https://ibb.co/rdmYHqP) (https://i.ibb.co/fnkrty7/B615-E2-E8-DFCB-424-E-939-F-FBAE5786-A1-FE.jpg) (https://ibb.co/fnkrty7) (https://i.ibb.co/4WWRLX1/D7-F3-AE74-F40-D-4-B45-9-F0-E-82047-E541-F72.jpg) (https://ibb.co/4WWRLX1) (https://i.ibb.co/MB67h3P/EF824-F97-26-A6-4625-B626-9-D0-F58-C82-CDA.jpg) (https://ibb.co/MB67h3P)
Here is the bad capacitor replaced with a new one of the same.
Also the note the guy gave me...
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I tested the COILS on the hopper.
The one on top gave me a OHM reading.
The one on the bottom, gave me no reading, I wiggled it and applied pressure and no reading was given. The bottom coil is the same coil that had the bent capacitor.
Do I need to test it a different way? Is it dead?
(https://i.ibb.co/16wP7PZ/D372-DE65-FB90-46-FA-83-B4-4-A8560446-A89.jpg) (https://ibb.co/16wP7PZ) (https://i.ibb.co/XDWBwHx/951-B787-E-9-ADD-4-A24-BF50-BDF31-C2-AE994.jpg) (https://ibb.co/XDWBwHx) (https://i.ibb.co/5Yrwndk/1-BC55-BA8-E223-429-E-B192-067288-EB25-A8.jpg) (https://ibb.co/5Yrwndk) (https://i.ibb.co/sw3pYv2/2915-E0-DC-47-A5-4-AAF-AA52-C955-DDAE13-C5.jpg) (https://ibb.co/sw3pYv2)
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you need the hopper cutoff relay to be powered or the payout relay coil is disconnected so nothing happens on a winning spin.
below is the schematic chunk that is relevant if you use the reset button (yellow highlight). The handle release switch powers the relay also when the handle release relay is tripped (orange highlight).
Since your hopper cutoff relay works, that implies the 1N4004 diode is bad, the resistors aren't hooked up right, or resistance is way off. It looks like they have two 470 ohm resistors in parallel, which would be equivalent to 235 ohms. That's just slightly off the 47 ohms that it should be :-)
got a 47 ohm 1 watt (or higher watt) resistor laying around you could install?
wire 67 is the blue highlight. It's in the circuit that keeps the relay powered once the handle release relay switch normally powers it (the reset button is typically used when hopper fills happen). If you win, the payout relay switch opens, but as long as the hopper pulse switch closes as each coin is ejected, pulses of current get fed down wire 67 and keep the capacitor charged so the hopper cutoff relay stays powered.
assuming you don't have a resistor on hand and want the game to work, just bypass the HCR switch that is disconnecting the payout relay. Per second schem below, jumper the payout relay coil lug with the red/blue wire on it to wire 70.
take all the cardboard out of the relays ... that suggestion was not helpful since neither of the relays you put cardboard in were the hopper cutoff relay :-(
there's a 47 ohm 1W resistor on the delay relay you could borrow, and yeah, you shouldn't get infinite ohms measuring that coil. Make sure you dig you probe tips into the metal lug or solder a little as surface oxidation makes a great insulator.
if the coil is bad, stick paper between the contacts on the delay relay so the safety time motor doesn't keep running. That will cause the game to shut down completely after a while during payout.
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assuming you don't have a resistor on hand and want the game to work, just bypass the HCR switch that is disconnecting the payout relay. Per second schem below, jumper the payout relay coil lug with the red/blue wire on it to wire 70.
take all the cardboard out of the relays ... that suggestion was not helpful since neither of the relays you put cardboard in were the hopper cutoff relay :-(
(https://i.ibb.co/nfdFGVW/CC3968-C0-3958-4-C26-9-C19-A9-A4-FC7-A21-C8.jpg) (https://ibb.co/nfdFGVW)
Do you mean jump these two wires together?
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By adding a cardboard wedge between the armature.
It’s possible that contacts that were normally close made a better connection.
Or we’re out of adjustment and weren’t closing enough to complete the circuit.
Prior to the wedge being installed,
were the contacts inspected for proper function and or cleaned?
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By adding a cardboard wedge between the armature.
It’s possible that contacts that were normally close made a better connection.
Or we’re out of adjustment and weren’t closing enough to complete the circuit.
Prior to the wedge being installed,
were the contacts inspected for proper function and or cleaned?
Thank you davidlee for helping out.
I briefly checked them for functionality, but I haven’t thoroughly cleaned them. What would be the easiest way to clean them? Do they need to be taken apart and each leaf cleaned one by one? With what chemical or abrasions?
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For now a business card or card stock the same thickness works.
Needs to have a little tooth, not a smooth surface. Cut into 1/4" strips or 1/2" then fold in half.
Denatured alcohol can be used for cleaning.
After the cleaning fluid, its best to dry clean one more time. As some cleaners will leave a residue.
Machines that sit for long periods of time will build up corrosion / oxidization on the contacts,
Much like copper and brass changing from bright shinny to a dull finish.
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assuming you don't have a resistor on hand and want the game to work, just bypass the HCR switch that is disconnecting the payout relay. Per second schem below, jumper the payout relay coil lug with the red/blue wire on it to wire 70.
(https://i.ibb.co/nfdFGVW/CC3968-C0-3958-4-C26-9-C19-A9-A4-FC7-A21-C8.jpg) (https://ibb.co/nfdFGVW)
Do you mean jump these two wires together?
yes, tho jumpering at the hopper cutoff relay would probably require soldering wires since there's not a lot of space in there.
it may be easier to jumper on the payout relay ... the other end of the red/blue wire ... it's easy to attach an alligator clip jumper there and find a convenient wire 70 spot to connect to.
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assuming you don't have a resistor on hand and want the game to work, just bypass the HCR switch that is disconnecting the payout relay. Per second schem below, jumper the payout relay coil lug with the red/blue wire on it to wire 70.
(https://i.ibb.co/nfdFGVW/CC3968-C0-3958-4-C26-9-C19-A9-A4-FC7-A21-C8.jpg) (https://ibb.co/nfdFGVW)
Do you mean jump these two wires together?
yes, tho jumpering at the hopper cutoff relay would probably require soldering wires since there's not a lot of space in there.
it may be easier to jumper on the payout relay ... the other end of the red/blue wire ... it's easy to attach an alligator clip jumper there and find a convenient wire 70 spot to connect to.
I just connected a jumper cable from the coil lug to the 70 Orange on the coin acceptance switch on the door.
HCR left attached.
Powered up the machine. Added coins and hit cherries, no payout.
Weird thing is, with the jumper in play, Now after a handle pull, and reels spin and stop, a bell sounds and the handle is ready for pull again. So it’s gives a credit after play, With the jumper wire attached. Should I look for another orange 70?
(https://i.ibb.co/nRRhV9r/781974-E7-A21-A-461-F-A3-F3-C68-AB2-E5-F7-F9.jpg) (https://ibb.co/nRRhV9r) (https://i.ibb.co/rt5H2zp/5217-E200-5-E78-4-F2-E-9490-44-CF914-F049-D.jpg) (https://ibb.co/rt5H2zp) (https://i.ibb.co/1fkkNrF/A8712-F31-3-B1-D-4-B07-805-D-1-E3273273-B4-B.jpg) (https://ibb.co/1fkkNrF) (https://i.ibb.co/zFd1KCV/FD0-C5-E6-B-1-E0-B-4-E27-9-ED9-5-F9-FB15-A6411.jpg) (https://ibb.co/zFd1KCV)
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Check a couple of things.
Inspect the payout relay top left on the back of the hopper.
Check the contacts for proper adjustment manually activate it to see if contacts are operating properly.
Might as well clean the contacts while you have it out.
While the hopper is out, manually operate the step up unit bottom right of the machine.
One plunger steps up and the other is to release. Theses aren’t real accessible, but it can be done.
Inspect for loose wires. Leave in the reset position when finished.
Photo of payout step up unit.
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I just connected a jumper cable from the coil lug to the 70 Orange on the coin acceptance switch on the door.
HCR left attached.
Powered up the machine. Added coins and hit cherries, no payout.
Weird thing is, with the jumper in play, Now after a handle pull, and reels spin and stop, a bell sounds and the handle is ready for pull again. So it’s gives a credit after play, With the jumper wire attached. Should I look for another orange 70?
(https://i.ibb.co/nRRhV9r/781974-E7-A21-A-461-F-A3-F3-C68-AB2-E5-F7-F9.jpg) (https://ibb.co/nRRhV9r) (https://i.ibb.co/rt5H2zp/5217-E200-5-E78-4-F2-E-9490-44-CF914-F049-D.jpg) (https://ibb.co/rt5H2zp)
your turn for the oops. That's not wire 70 on the coin switch, it's wire 74-1 ... tho it does look orange/brown rather than orange/green. In any case, it won't work.
there's a couple pieces of wire 70 in your pic ... one is attached to the coin diverter coil below/left of the coin switch ... if you jump to that, make sure you don't short to the metal on the coin door.
the handle release coil inside the cabinet may be easy to reach, or clip directly on the 50V fuse holder lug.
the bell may ring on any win or just certain ones ... that's one of the common differences between the versions of a machine. The handle release relay tripping may be a side effect of where your jumper is ... tho it's not obvious from the 1088 schematic. See what happens after your jumper is moved and you get the payout working.
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The 1088 has a green / white wire in the top box.
If it is connected to the bell circuit, the bell will ring on every payout.
Otherwise the bell rings on jackpot bars and sevens only.
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@davidlee
I check for loose wires on both the hopper and payout unit, as well as the male and female plugs. All good.
I cleaned all switches on the Payout Counter Unit and Hopper.
They did have black in them and cleaned up to a gold or silver color.
Tomorrow I will work on cleaning the leafs on the Reels and upper cabinet where the Coin Stepper is.
(https://i.ibb.co/Hhm8LXG/37-DBCF9-A-CE6-C-414-B-91-B3-C3-C615175843.jpg) (https://ibb.co/Hhm8LXG) (https://i.ibb.co/86gqZ55/DD4-C84-A0-7229-4746-A25-A-2992947-D0-E5-E.jpg) (https://ibb.co/86gqZ55) (https://i.ibb.co/R7w65Nz/C0-D844-BE-E793-4-A3-F-A3-BB-2333-DA32924-E.jpg) (https://ibb.co/R7w65Nz) (https://i.ibb.co/qNds1c6/318-CF91-B-6-BC7-4390-B0-E0-5-F55-B5-D2-BFF4.jpg) (https://ibb.co/qNds1c6) (https://i.ibb.co/x7png1K/176-BCDD9-ED80-43-BC-A8-DE-30-A13-E8-ED073.jpg) (https://ibb.co/x7png1K) (https://i.ibb.co/yfYv1MD/66109-E72-5-CA5-4-BB2-AF74-6-AE4-D0-E2891-E.jpg) (https://ibb.co/yfYv1MD) (https://i.ibb.co/k2XGHJ9/22-DFDE97-CF05-4-BD7-BB87-A56-E3-CB9-BC74.jpg) (https://ibb.co/k2XGHJ9) (https://i.ibb.co/18MDDNF/2-B997-B30-3-E9-B-4-CF4-A440-925-FC1-DF5155.jpg) (https://ibb.co/18MDDNF) (https://i.ibb.co/Fgh56jX/6-BF015-B5-673-F-42-F9-A756-A8-A9-D1192-AB4.jpg) (https://ibb.co/Fgh56jX) (https://i.ibb.co/sHJQCzx/849-E2-AA5-1-C35-45-E8-87-C1-88-B70-A034-E6-E.jpg) (https://ibb.co/sHJQCzx) (https://i.ibb.co/tzXF6gg/B98-E7844-EF8-B-46-C0-9335-C28182164-CAD.jpg) (https://ibb.co/tzXF6gg) (https://i.ibb.co/qyDSfnQ/E8-AC9272-3-ECE-41-E9-A521-27854-A2736-FE.jpg) (https://ibb.co/qyDSfnQ) (https://i.ibb.co/Z1Jtvp0/DEB21-DC5-A734-4-B1-B-A7-BC-304-B3036-D08-A.jpg) (https://ibb.co/Z1Jtvp0) (https://i.ibb.co/Vtyh60t/9-F1-CF607-4-D71-476-A-A511-A97-C1-D16-D7-FD.jpg) (https://ibb.co/Vtyh60t) (https://i.ibb.co/5j4knyK/329-A5-E4-B-A7-C2-4-C28-A3-C5-F8-E14517-FC99.jpg) (https://ibb.co/5j4knyK) (https://i.ibb.co/3RMtn7t/7-AB6421-C-973-D-41-FF-8942-0269704-D54-EF.jpg) (https://ibb.co/3RMtn7t)
Wolftalk, I used the orange lug from the main fuse box.
Unfortunately it did not give life to the hopper, door closed, coins in, winning combo, no payout. Nothing moved.
Tilt light still on. :Scratch-Head:
(https://i.ibb.co/kxdT3hF/1-B7-CAAFC-1-CBC-4-FD0-B943-8-E08-CBD79-FFB.jpg) (https://ibb.co/kxdT3hF) (https://i.ibb.co/ZMPW9yh/8-FC5-FDA1-30-FF-444-A-BFA2-6-CF0-B4-A71-FDC.jpg)
I noticed earlier that this coil does not engage ever, not sure what it’s for? Also there is a modern switch trigger behind it that doesn’t look to be hooked up to anything to trigger it? On the front side of the door is the coin in and coin release drop.
(https://ibb.co/ZMPW9yh) (https://i.ibb.co/ggRGjhv/CC4-DBC33-4590-4705-A7-EF-13751-DA9-F134.jpg) (https://ibb.co/ggRGjhv) (https://i.ibb.co/gvFfh8s/0-DAE706-C-CD6-E-433-C-A568-9748-EADB20-AE.jpg) (https://ibb.co/gvFfh8s) (https://i.ibb.co/YLCTG0L/D1679122-74-B2-471-A-BFF9-4-EE1-D6816-DC1.jpg) (https://ibb.co/YLCTG0L)
Thanks again guys for helping me, hopefully we can get this beauty properly working again.
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Okay, you’re making progress.
It’s best to clean not more than two areas at one time without testing.
Clean a switch stack then test or a unit then test.
This way you’ll know what correction made the difference.
I’ve seen those coil door locks, but none of them were ever hooked up.
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Okay, you’re making progress.
It’s best to clean not more than two areas at one time without testing.
Clean a switch stack then test or a unit then test.
This way you’ll know what correction made the difference.
I’ve seen those coil door locks, but none of them were ever hooked up.
Reading this guide, I guess the reel sends the signal to the payout and hopper of a winning combo is detected. What can I trouble shot at the reel assembly to try to fix the “TILT†light and “WINNER PAID†light that is always on, with no pay?
Also, I don’t want to get into other repairs without fixing the main one first, but I’ve noticed the icons never really line up on the pay line, not sure if a person should be sitting or standing while playing to get a different angle of view. But looking at it dead on, it doesn’t line up with the pay line. Some are a bit off, not straight, but I’m guessing the icons on the reels have slipped and need to be tightened and repositioned. But just a thought since I don’t know if the icons are moved and I’m getting a false visual win. I wonder if there is a notch or starting point that the reel strip should align to?
(https://i.ibb.co/r06vQrp/5-DA611-CD-F5-B6-4593-B22-A-A24-FF00-A2309.jpg) (https://ibb.co/54821Hj)
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The reel tapes have slipped slightly.
Set up two cherries on the pay line.
Attached one lead of an ohm meter to the solid gray wire.
Located on the 3rd reel wiper board near the top left in most cases.
I believe the cherries wire out is red/white and this would be on the first reel wiper board.
There should be continuity at this point.
Winner paid light would direct me to the payout step up unit bottom right of the machine.
As in not resetting completely or the contacts are not opening.
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Thanks, I will test the cherrys when I get home from work after today.
As for the payout unit.
I’ve cleaned all the leads.
I’ve replaced the gummed up stopper with a eraser.
I’ve manually pressed the coil with the weights and it did step and move the disc.
The disc has been cleaned and all contacts.
I’ve pressed the top coil with weights and it return the disc to the start state again.
No wires are loose.
When the card board was placed on the hopper and it went crazy spitting out quarters, the payout unit was in action the whole time.
That’s what I have done at the payout unit thus far.
Any ideas what else I can do there?
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The reel tapes have slipped slightly.
Set up two cherries on the pay line.
Attached one lead of an ohm meter to the solid gray wire.
Located on the 3rd reel wiper board near the top left in most cases.
I believe the cherries wire out is red/white and this would be on the first reel wiper board.
There should be continuity at this point.
Winner paid light would direct me to the payout step up unit bottom right of the machine.
As in not resetting completely or the contacts are not opening.
I need more info, below is my setup. I tried the 3rd reel top grey on either side and basically any wire with red on 1st reel, nothing.
(https://i.ibb.co/7gS1k2X/B83-B0610-B78-E-4-DAC-8-E86-0-B1-EAE178-D61.jpg) (https://ibb.co/7gS1k2X) (https://i.ibb.co/yhZsqyh/B43-A5-B2-D-EE08-4696-B0-E0-7-DE387-D43638.jpg) (https://ibb.co/yhZsqyh) (https://i.ibb.co/125ctXH/1-EEA9995-0267-40-FE-A595-748-CDE4-C986-F.jpg) (https://ibb.co/125ctXH) (https://i.ibb.co/7R1msqp/11514972-14-E7-42-EA-8284-99-D2458-AAC58.jpg) (https://ibb.co/7R1msqp) (https://i.ibb.co/hmTtTV1/051767-A3-1365-422-D-AF54-5-CC70-BA9-B441.jpg) (https://ibb.co/hmTtTV1)
I get continuity with the second roll of wires with 2 cherries lined up, but then again on the third reel, I can test Almost the whole second roll of wires gives continuity with it aligned with the red wire in the first reel?
(https://i.ibb.co/LzHcL9M/18452-D09-E589-4-ED6-B245-C325-D7-C803-D5.jpg) (https://ibb.co/LzHcL9M) (https://i.ibb.co/y62KMp1/0-FBAF21-C-1009-4-EF9-9-EFC-895-A6-E288508.jpg) (https://ibb.co/y62KMp1) (https://i.ibb.co/WyL4J5M/6-FEA24-B4-8-C5-F-45-A7-AC88-7-BF926728531.jpg) (https://ibb.co/WyL4J5M)
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You’re on the right track.
Trace back from the cherries to the 3rd wiper.
I might be mistaken about the gray wire, could be gray red.
Anyway start with the cherries and verify each step.
From the rivet to the wire on the first cherry.
Connect to the wire, then trace to the next cherry solder joint.
Check for continuity.
Then prob the 3rd wiper board for continuity. Pretty sure it’s going to be a gray maybe with color.
When you get continuity all the way across pull the middle wiper back.
This should interrupt the signal.
Proving this portion of the circuit is okay.
Leaving a possibility, that from the gray to the beau plug. Here a pin or socket could be pushed out of the housing.
Note this circuit is fairly strong as it is static.
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continuity isn't the best way to test as it can't detect a poor connection that limits current flow. It will catch open connection ok tho.
your goal is to get the payout relay to power ... it'll turn on the hopper so the payout happens.
since you are comfortable checking voltages, I'd do this:
1] clip a meter probe on red/yellow wire 13 on reel 1, 2 or 3 wiper boards
2] clip other meter probe on wire 70 ... coin relay is handy
3] set up a single cherry on reel 3
4] stick reel mech back in game and turn it on (coin relay and handle release relay need to be reset ... i.e. state after spin and before depositing a coin to start a new game)
got 50V? If no, move the probe from wire 13 to the solid grey wire 90 david mentioned - it's on all three reel wiper boards. If still no 50V, keep going up the circuit highlighted below until you find where the 50V disappears. You must have it at the green highlight or the handle release wouldn't work, so that just leaves:
- coin relay switch
- handle release relay switch
- reel wipers connecting wire 90 to 13
- payout counter wipers -> traces -> wire 93-5 to payout relay
- plug connections
Not shown on the schem is plug locations in the wiring, but you'll get the hang if it. e.g. if no 50V on wire 90 on the reel mech, but you have 50V on wire 90 on the handle release relay switch, the plug connection between cabinet and reels has a problem.
the tilt light is on when the hopper cutoff relay is unpowered. Until you get the right resistor and fix the hopper cutoff relay operation, just yank out the relay to keep the light off or ignore the tilt light ... it doesn't affect anything else.
the payout relay cannot power if you don't have the red/blue lug on the coil connected to wire 70. Since a jumper wire dangling around is inconvenient, if you pull out the hopper cutoff relay can you jumper wire 70 to 12 in the socket using a wire/paperclip?
you can also jumper solid yellow wire 30 to anyplace along the yellow highlight path and the payout relay should power.
since no payout is working and the coin unit creates multiple paths thru the reels, it's much more likely the problem is the coin relay switch, handle release switch, or payout relay itself since they affect all pays ... assuming your payout counter is reset.
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OK, so thanks for all this detailed help, but im starting to get a bit lost here, lol. I cant really understand the schematics to well, im more of a visual guy....
But, here's what I did so far, hope it helps;
I probed the Reels, Red/Yellow wire and the Grey wire at Reel 3, with a single cherry setup. Both returned +50Volts.
(https://i.ibb.co/ZXcNjVR/CCDDD934-71-D5-4133-B0-AD-FAFEB609737-E.jpg) (https://ibb.co/bmN70Pj)
(https://i.ibb.co/bW94x1G/5-A73721-A-FD40-49-BD-82-C1-1-DB239-C4-D678.jpg) (https://ibb.co/BzMhmLY)
(https://i.ibb.co/jwMpvM1/98-B8-E247-677-E-4-A82-B6-F9-EACAB87-DC360.jpg) (https://ibb.co/2Mtb7tf)
Then I moved up the cabinet, tested "Level Re." switch, also received +50Volts.
(https://i.ibb.co/pjkqFGP/0829-A200-87-A3-448-A-AB29-31820-EC2-D169.jpg) (https://ibb.co/4R0kr9f)
The "Coin Unit" was next and also gave me +50Volts.
(https://i.ibb.co/qBCwdR1/5-A1-E3772-F121-48-A4-B5-B1-62-CD55707-ACD.jpg) (https://ibb.co/jhzFTL4)
(https://i.ibb.co/2jFrdN8/495-B3-D2-A-2-FDD-4-D32-B197-900-BE71-A5421.jpg) (https://ibb.co/GVdDRTs)
Moved down to the "Handle Release" switch, which gave me +50Volts again.
(https://i.ibb.co/3RSpKJ3/9-B7-B015-A-6-E5-E-48-A5-BDF0-8-A47-B0659-BBB.jpg) (https://ibb.co/FH85pPr)
(https://i.ibb.co/zsC0J57/39-ED40-CB-22-B5-4-FC1-88-EA-B362-BDCD76-C8.jpg) (https://ibb.co/p2N9yPR)
The "Payout Counter" also returned +50Volts.
(https://i.ibb.co/k2mMbS3/EC760875-BA74-418-D-94-BA-5743-A469797-D.jpg) (https://ibb.co/XxYV0Cy)
(https://i.ibb.co/xSbsxG0/E992-BB8-F-C55-B-4-B54-83-EE-82-A4808922-C8.jpg) (https://ibb.co/kgTyN0f)
Last was the "Hopper Beau" plugs, I received a range of different volts, but there was a couple +50Volts in there.
The hopper has its wires in the back so its difficult to probe, im going to attached gator clips one by one tomorrow and test.
Lol, Im just probing any connection since I don't understand the wire layouts, the schematics lose me.
(https://i.ibb.co/hBpRYLJ/3-F5-D88-E4-086-B-4-DFB-B307-2-CAEAF59761-C.jpg) (https://ibb.co/1rHfz7t)
(https://i.ibb.co/vYwpyMn/4-F600229-FA18-4342-A718-96-AAA4-F2-C8-A1.jpg) (https://ibb.co/C21gCSG)
(https://i.ibb.co/VLDx5nj/BE10-E4-F9-0011-4213-A59-A-BF8848853750.jpg) (https://ibb.co/Gdk9NYx)
(https://i.ibb.co/1QHxtVR/A96164-AF-A65-A-4295-8-B31-F5117-E6289-C0.jpg) (https://ibb.co/T2z5xXP)
I turned on the machine and left it on standby, no coins inserted, taking Orange from the coin relay on the door.
(https://i.ibb.co/4pQ130Z/8-A1-E0794-DC46-46-C9-995-F-2-CF5-A55-BE78-E.jpg) (https://ibb.co/XtwYMGZ)
Let me know what I missed and what's next.
About the Hopper diode and resister, should I order them now? What are the part numbers for them...
Thank You!
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you're doing great. Overkill actually :-)
once you found 50V on red/yellow wire on the reel wiper board, everything upstream of that point all the way to wire 30 was good, so checking the coin relay switch, handle release switch and grey wire 90 wasn't needed.
the furthest you got in the circuit toward the payout relay in your pics was grey/white wire 93-5 on the hopper socket in the cabinet and you got 50V there. That means the entire path thru the reels and payout counter disc is probably good ... depends whether the hopper was installed when you were checking.
the only thing left is wire 93-5 going from the hopper plug to the payout relay coil. There's only two things left you can check:
1] wire 93-5 on the payout relay coil to wire 70
2] one probe wire on each of the payout relays coil terminals
there is one gotcha if you were checking voltages in an open circuit. If some connection is cruddy, you won't see voltage drops because no current is flowing.
if you have the hopper installed and you see something a lot less than 50V on test [2] above, you have a poor connection. Leave the hopper in, put one probe wire on 70 and the other poke along the entire path you were checking. At some point the voltage will drop significantly across a connection (switch, wiper contact, plug connection) and that connection will need cleaning.
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Good News: 93-5 at the Beau Plug to the hopper has +50Volts.
(https://i.ibb.co/7GL7Hqb/4-CE3-A64-A-8022-451-B-9-B94-E52-D64415-E43.jpg) (https://ibb.co/mHgQm3S)
Bad News: When I plugged in the hopper to test the payout counters relays and terminals, the hopper had life on its own (NO CARDBOARD), but there was sparks in the back of the hopper. I quickly unplugged it and inspected the damage. The resister attached to the Capacitor broke.
(https://i.ibb.co/Yh3Z61w/10-E7-D7-C8-E052-4-EDB-9598-BBF5268-B1989.jpg) (https://ibb.co/1TL63Pj)
Can you share with me the diodes / Resisters / model numbers?
I would like to of course replace the one that broke, but I also would like to buy all the resisters and diodes on the hopper and either replace or have just in case.
Hopefully I can find this replacement.
I hate being down several days from testing :(
The sooner I order, the sooner I continue our path to restore this beauty :)
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your resistor blew a chunk out the side? Doesn't happen often ... usually they burn and break in half.
that relay is the delay relay and everything on it except the coil is on the 120V circuit. Don't poke around in there with your meter.
the resistor should be 47 ohm, 1 watt ... which is what you have blown up in there
the diode was originally a 1N2070, but you can replace it with a 1N4007
those are the same two parts you need for the hopper cutoff relay, and you probably can't buy just one anyway ... they are so cheap they sell them in packs :-)
when installing the diode, the end with the white band goes toward the coil on both the delay relay and hopper cutoff relay. The delay relay goes:
wire 95 -> resistor -> diode -> coil
the hopper cutoff relay goes:
wire 97 (black/orange) -> diode -> resistor -> coil
the delay relay is also a "something is wrong, panic" device. If the hopper is running without the payout counter stepping up, the delay relay will shut the game down. Until you get the parts, just disconnect the resistor (cut the leg where it connects to the switch with grey/white wire 95) and stick paper between the two closed contacts on the relay. The game won't time out then.
the delay relay is not related to your payout problem. You need to get your meter on the relay above the delay relay ... that's the payout relay and it needs to power when you have a winner.
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Is this right? Gonna wait to test the payout delay until you confirm this pic. Lol, I don’t want to start a fire!
(https://i.ibb.co/ZSKJjsV/11-EB030-D-839-B-466-B-BC0-B-F270-AEAE1458.jpg) (https://ibb.co/jzG5NKT)
I ordered 3 resistors and a 10pack of the diodes, thanks for the info.
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I tested the payout relay connecting to the grey/ yellow wire, received +50Volts.
Can I probe all the (grey/ 2nd color) wires on the hopper? Or what’s next?
(https://i.ibb.co/wQDkZsP/2148044-D-C263-410-A-A709-25-D5-D96439-E1.jpg) (https://ibb.co/WzShNtM)
(https://i.ibb.co/QYWMFD1/93-C41-A00-BF4-B-4-CB0-B0-AC-A4729-F14-CFA8.jpg) (https://ibb.co/bN4Xgb8)
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is the red/blue wire on the payout relay connected to wire 70 at the hopper cutoff relay socket?
normally the hopper cutoff relay switch makes the connection, but your hopper cutoff relay doesn't work, so you need to tie that red/blue wire to 70 someplace.
if you want a bad explanation of what is going on with the circuits and how to read the schematic, see https://bingo.cdyn.com/techno/readschem/
that site is talking about bingo pinball machines, but bally made those also. The slots are basically the same electrical components, wiring conventions and schematic symbols.
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I tested the payout relay connecting to the grey/ yellow wire, received +50Volts.
Can I probe all the (grey/ 2nd color) wires on the hopper? Or what’s next?
humour me but if you have 50 volts then is the relay pulled in?
(https://i.ibb.co/wQDkZsP/2148044-D-C263-410-A-A709-25-D5-D96439-E1.jpg) (https://ibb.co/WzShNtM)
(https://i.ibb.co/QYWMFD1/93-C41-A00-BF4-B-4-CB0-B0-AC-A4729-F14-CFA8.jpg) (https://ibb.co/bN4Xgb8)
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humour me but if you have 50 volts then is the relay pulled in?
Sorry, what do you mean pulled in?
The payout relay coil is installed, nothing altered. I tested it on the lug of the coil.
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When the core of a coil is energized it will pull the armature / small metal plate on to the core.
If the core / plunger is moveable it will be pull into the coil winding.
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Sorry, still learning this lingo.
I understand now.
Not sure, that relay is on the back of the hopper, I will have to stick my phone in there with a light and record it to see if it’s coil is pulled down when plugged in.
I still have a single cherry setup at reel 3.
I will test when I get home from work in a couple hours.
Thanks for the help, and understanding.
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When the core of a coil is energized it will pull the armature / small metal plate on to the core.
If the core / plunger is moveable it will be pull into the coil winding.
I took a video of it powered on, cherry on third reel, connected to a meter, showing +50volts and the coil is NOT pulling the plastic down. 😕
https://youtube.com/shorts/HRwT8Vd_c7w (https://youtube.com/shorts/HRwT8Vd_c7w)
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you have a meter probe on the red/blue wire on the payout relay coil and the other meter probe on wire 70 on the door?
if so, your payout relay won't work....but at least you proved the payout relay coil isn't blown.
I've mentioned a couple times your red/blue wire on the payout relay coil needs to be connected to wire 70. Is that not making sense?
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you have a meter probe on the red/blue wire on the payout relay coil and the other meter probe on wire 70 on the door?
if so, your payout relay won't work....but at least you proved the payout relay coil isn't blown.
I've mentioned a couple times your red/blue wire on the payout relay coil needs to be connected to wire 70. Is that not making sense?
Yes, the 70 is at the door.
Lol, I’m new to this, I actually went back earlier today and reread all your post in this thread. And I understand now hat you said a couple days ago. My diode on the hopper cutoff is probable bad, and the resisters are wrong because they are in parallel and probably the wrong ohms or so. You had mentioned to jump the red/blue with a orange to bypass it. Maybe even use a paper clip or do it at the beau plug if it’s easier. Non of that made too much sense a couple days ago. Now it does.
I will jumper them tonight and report back.
It’s clear now, sorry for the delay wolftalk, I slowly learning and you have been wonderful and patient with me.
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the paper clip jumper would be in the hopper cutoff relay socket ... pull out the hopper cutoff relay relay and you can usually insert a paper clip in the slots where the relay plugs into the socket. Look at the wiring side of the socket to see where the red/blue and orange wires are.
You can't put the relay back in, but you don't need to.
you could jumper wire 70 from the coil door directly onto the red/blue wire on the payout relay coil, but if things start working you'll probably want to close the door and play test the game, so a jumper like that is less convenient.
beau plugs are the black connectors between the hopper/cabinet and reel mech/cabinet. The white plastic plugs are molex plugs.
you're doing fine ... there's always a learning curve and you haven't blown any fuses yet :-)
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Wolftalk,
Would it be possible to temporarily replace the resistor with a 7 watt light.
Something like a small night light.
Just curious to know if that would be a possibly?
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(https://i.ibb.co/c6ncSfG/74-EBB126-68-E0-4306-9-CC3-CD1207-FE542-F.jpg) (https://ibb.co/c6ncSfG) (https://i.ibb.co/3TyG0Kf/9-D273-F18-0-C0-C-4-FB8-AAFA-04-BACC1-BE677.jpg) (https://ibb.co/3TyG0Kf) (https://i.ibb.co/nQcVd1M/C05955-D0-06-F2-4101-91-B7-194-DD7763-F5-D.jpg) (https://ibb.co/nQcVd1M)
I jumped a paper clip. And powered it on, the hopper spot out a couple quarters then stopped, roughly around 8-10 quarters or so.
I noticed the tilt light was off.
I played a few games.
For a while I was winning but only the bell would sound one time and a “free play†would be available? It would let me pull the level and play. It didn’t spit out quarters on a win.
So I checked the hopper weight, and adjusted the nut to trigger the switch for the coin weight.
I played another times and hit, the hopper spit out 4 quarters and now it won’t accept quarters any more. I add coins and they go into the hopper but handle doesn’t release. Tilt light is back on, winners paid light is off.
I tried it with the door closed and open, I’ve pressed the cherry switch inside the unit top right. Did not help.
New problem, coins go in, but handle is stuck.
I cleaned all the leafs on the top cabinet, still did not fix the issue.
Pressing the coin switch at the door triggers the coil unit reset re. That’s it.
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Wolftalk,
Would it be possible to temporarily replace the resistor with a 7 watt light.
Something like a small night light.
Just curious to know if that would be a possibly?
it it has around 47 ohms or resistance +/- 10%, then it should work. A light bulb should be able to handle the current flow. It may not light very much.
I jumped a paper clip. And powered it on, the hopper spot out a couple quarters then stopped, roughly around 8-10 quarters or so.I noticed the tilt light was off.
all the 1088 schems I have show the only thing turning on the tilt light is a hopper cutoff relay switch. You don't have the HCR installed, so the light should never come on unless the 1088-2 has another way to do it.
I played a few games.For a while I was winning but only the bell would sound one time and a “free play†would be available? It would let me pull the level and play. It didn’t spit out quarters on a win.
if you could pull the handle, the handle release relay didn't reset. If it's still tripped at the end of a spin, the game won't pay anything because a handle release relay switch opens the payout circuit. The bell still rings tho because there isn't a handle release relay switch in the bell circuit.
when the game doesn't pay, look to see if the coin relay on the left side of the reel mech is still tripped. If it is, you'll need to determine if the problem is electrical or mechanical.
both the coin relay and the handle release relay should reset after the handle pull. When a coin is inserted, the coin relay trips. When the coin relay trips, the handle release relay trips as soon as the coin switch is back up.
I played another times and hit, the hopper spit out 4 quarters and now it won’t accept quarters any more. I add coins and they go into the hopper but handle doesn’t release. Tilt light is back on, winners paid light is off.I tried it with the door closed and open, I’ve pressed the cherry switch inside the unit top right. Did not help.New problem, coins go in, but handle is stuck.I cleaned all the leafs on the top cabinet, still did not fix the issue.Pressing the coin switch at the door triggers the coil unit reset re. That’s it.
if closing/releasing the coin switch keeps powering the coin unit reset relay, the handle release relay isn't tripping ... first thing to check is whether the coin relay tripped. If it didn't, check the switch on the coin relay with blue/red wire 21-1 and white wire 50-1 on it. Make sure it's closed when the coin relay is reset. Wire 50-1 goes to the coin relay coil.
tilt light turning on is interesting .. you game must have a way to do that besides the hopper cutoff relay (or is your hopper cutoff relay reinstalled?)
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Inspect the coin in relay bottom left of the reels mechanism.
This is the first thing activated after the coin in switch.
Also check the coin in switch.
If the trip wire is bent and or dragging on the guide slot this could be a problem.
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Wolftalk, can you point out which wires your talking about? Do I test the blue red wire with orange too? Or with white? Or white with orange? I didn’t see a white wire...
I recorded a video of what’s happening, sorry I poked around stuff I shouldn’t, I still don’t know better, I didn’t die, so that’s a good thing...
https://youtu.be/QS8hnYqkwz8 (https://youtu.be/QS8hnYqkwz8)
Also PLEASE, I need help identifying these items in red boxes. It will help me not get lost. I hear coin relay and coin switch, etc... Thai would help me. Please...
(https://i.ibb.co/Jsx3CGN/4115-D54-C-305-D-46-B6-BD37-36-E75-DC158-C8.jpg) (https://ibb.co/87zYXfJ)
(https://i.ibb.co/dGSKjPX/BF4-F559-F-2-F33-47-FF-9-B6-C-9-C2-E8-B3-D283-D.jpg) (https://ibb.co/J5Nkmv8)
(https://i.ibb.co/RTKjTS8/AB96-C560-B916-489-A-BFDA-3-C2-B7-DBFFD27.jpg) (https://ibb.co/VYGwYN6)
(https://i.ibb.co/M7kx5zM/4295-D0-EB-67-A7-42-D8-9-AF6-2-D3-E0511-CBF4.jpg) (https://ibb.co/9WHk3xs)
(https://i.ibb.co/2dYm03s/658611-F2-CD3-B-429-F-8-BC8-561-A956465-A6.jpg) (https://ibb.co/JHF0Wjy)
Thank you!
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Nice photos, could you post clear close up photos of the handle release switches and coin in relay switches.
Would like to see the coil and contacts, but mainly the contacts for alignment.
Photo of has two of the main components to release the handle.
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With all the components in the machine there is a lever
(see photo) that will release the handle.
But first try pulling the the J bar that is associated with the air cylinder.
Pull it towards the front of the machine.
See if that makes a difference as to releasing the handle.
The machine might just to be cycled through a few times.
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Nice photos, could you post clear close up photos of the handle release switches and coin in relay switches.
Would like to see the coil and contacts, but mainly the contacts for alignment.
Photo of has two of the main components to release the handle.
I pulled the J bar and nothing happen. It’s locked.
I released the handle by pulling the bar towards me. And spun it. The reels then stopped and it gave me some coins. Then I inserted some coins and again the handle is locked. It did register them upstairs, but I didn’t hear or see the lights for the stepper of the 2nd and 3rd coin. Just like the YouTube video I posted yesterday, it doesn’t step, I manually on the video flicked to the 3rd coin. Hope that made sense.
Hear are close of photos you requested.
I forgot to mention, if I release the handle again and spin it, and hit, it doesn’t pay out. But then again I didn’t manually step the coin unit. I had just triggered the coin in switch on the door.
(https://i.ibb.co/xLgZRV7/21647445-8-C0-F-47-FB-A40-B-1943-F13-A506-B.jpg) (https://ibb.co/V9C6PXq)
(https://i.ibb.co/g90gRJ0/2861-B991-07-FE-43-CB-86-E5-BEC16-BE5014-D.jpg) (https://ibb.co/YQ5jLh5)
(https://i.ibb.co/tX8JFZR/5045-FA20-DECC-442-C-9396-523-B2-E8-B058-C.jpg) (https://ibb.co/TLmgdKy)
(https://i.ibb.co/WPdZRNV/F759-A639-B0-D2-440-C-9212-461-BE27-F0-D2-F.jpg) (https://ibb.co/dL3FHsm)
(https://i.ibb.co/pjs6ntD/348-B8-BF8-CE4-D-48-E3-87-AA-98-C4856-A0-E40.jpg) (https://ibb.co/Qvq7X2B)
(https://i.ibb.co/VgrNvxr/E2-C5-E7-A5-EE2-F-444-C-A6-C0-F2613-E2-F71-A8.jpg) (https://ibb.co/1rhn9Mh)
(https://i.ibb.co/Jqzwdn7/16-D6-A36-A-35-C6-4-C82-B074-CBE9-D9-A7-F89-A.jpg) (https://ibb.co/FXBLW6w)
(https://i.ibb.co/VVchhJ6/2-D651669-F6-F7-43-C8-A089-F4-BA7-E85-A785.jpg) (https://ibb.co/BL577ck)
(https://i.ibb.co/ysfDsz7/6-FA5-E566-51-DF-4-E5-C-8703-B9383-A1-F711-E.jpg) (https://ibb.co/F7x97QC)
(https://i.ibb.co/2gFbqjT/29-A1-E708-BB51-4468-B3-DD-F68-DB29-BE325.jpg) (https://ibb.co/dGfhBQR)
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The machine appears to be over medicated with lube.
Excessive lube my foul the contacts.
Lightly clean all the contacts on the left side of the reels.
Actuate the mechanisms to be sure the contacts are opening and closing.
A good sign is when the opposing contact gets pushed back slightly.
Test.
Then do the same for the handle release switches.
Actuate the mechanism as to be sure contacts are opening and closing.
Test.
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Thanks, I will clean it all that grease later tonight.
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poking around is always fun :-)
here's a video of how the handle release relay works. Note the relay is mechanically reset by the rod that comes up during the handle pull. When the reel mech is in the game, it operates the lever that lets the handle return to the top.
bingo.cdyn.com/slots/videos/Handle_Release.m4v (http://bingo.cdyn.com/slots/videos/Handle_Release.m4v)
the relay on the right that you are manually closing (pushing the armature plate onto the coil top) is the coin unit step-up relay. It powers when you insert coins AFTER the handle release relay has tripped to release the handle.
the handle release trips AFTER the coin relay trips and the coin switch has returned to the top position.
david already posted a pic labelling the coin relay, but I took your image and added text to label the rest of the stuff your circled. Note the latch mechanism circled in purple ... works just like the handle release relay. The relay is mechanically reset and the latch ledge hooks onto the armature plate. When the coil is powered, the armature plate pulls out of the ledge and allows the switches to all shift position.
in any case, the coin relay must trip on the first coin or nothing else really happens.
second image below is the wire color code chart from the schematic. If it's not clear, the critical thing is wire 21-1 and 21-2 are NOT the same wire. They are both blue with a red tracer and they looks exactly the same, but they are used in different circuits. Don't assume that because a wire is the same color in two different places in the game it's the same wire.
next post ...what I'd do to check things.
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first thing below is the schem. I'm a big schem guy :-) Once ya learn how to interpret it, you can figure out how the machine works.
the circuit to power the coin relay is highlighted. Every switch in the circuit except the coin switch is normally closed (NC), where normally is after the game is over. When the coin pushes the coin switch trip wire down, wire 30 is connected to wire 23-1 and now ya have a closed path from wire 30 to the coil. Since the other side of the coil is directly attached to the 50V power wire 70, the coil powers.
there's two possible reasons the handle is not releasing:
1] the coin relay is not tripping
2] the handle release relay is not getting powered after the coin relay trips
if your coin relay is tripping but the handle release isn't, ignore all the below and move on to the next post
if your problem is the coin relay not powering and tripping the mechanism so the switches shift right like in the second pic below, then you got a huge help because the coin unit reset relay IS powering (the green circuit which branches off the yellow). That means the coin switch, handle release relay switch and snap switch are all working right, and the only things left are the coin relay switch and the coin relay coil.
the coin relay switch I think is the one circuit in purple on the second pic. The white wire on the coil (teal arrow) goes to one of the coin relay switch blades and the other blade will be blue/red.
reset the coin relay if necessary and check the contacts on that switch. They are large tungsten contacts, so it's ok to file them to remove pitting and make the contact faces parallel to each other. Also check that the moving right blade is deflecting the left blade a little when the coin relay is reset.
to manually reset the coin relay, push on the bar pointed to by the purple arrow. To trip the relay, push the armature plate onto the coil top. Do the reset/trip operation a few times and watch the switches. Look for ones that obviously aren't closing or barely touch. Those you need to bend the blades where they enter the stacks to make them work right.
generally you don't bend the moving blade to adjust a switch, but occasionally you need to if the moving blade isn't travelling far enough. In this case, the stationary blade on the left is snug against the movement limiting bar and the bar is straight, so the likely problem is either a cruddy switch or the moving blade on the right isn't applying enough pressure to the stationary blade to make a good contact.
if you wanted to probe around the circuit with a meter, you'd put one probe on wire 70 and the other in the circuit ... then hold down the coin switch and look for 50V.
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if the coin relay is tripping but the handle release relay is not tripping, below is the schem.
many switches in the circuit. The pic a couple messages up labelled the coin relay, reel mech A and C switches (1 is the "bottom" switch in the stack). You know where the payout relay is. The dashpot switch is a vertical switch hanging down on the right side of the reel mech, and the handle release switch is on the handle release relay.
there's plug connections to the hopper and coin door also.
if you deposit the first coin and the coin relay trips, then you can:
1] voltmeter approach
one probe on wire 70, the other poking along the highlighted path until the 50V drops/disappears
2] jumper approach
one end of jumper on wire 30, other along the highlight path
3] inspection / shotgun approach
clean/check all the switches and plug connections in the path
4] it's usually the ... approach
davidlee can give you better info here, but I'd guess the problem is usually the coin relay switch or the handle release relay switch.
if you look at the full schem, you can see what other stuff is connected to various spots in the circuit and see if that works. For example, payout needs the circuit to be closed up to wire 60-1. Since you get payout ... at least somewhat ... then the coin switch, reel mech A-1 and C-1 are all good.
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Wolftalk,
As I described in reply 51.
I would do this first, then go from there if the machine still doesn’t work.
Might turn out to be an odd circumstance in relation to what is going on.
Got to make sure the known / given is in proper order.
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Before and after cleaning...
(https://i.ibb.co/W5fkXVt/A1184135-7099-492-A-B3-EC-7-C032-E323-D98.jpg) (https://ibb.co/4tp8L1d)
(https://i.ibb.co/9w8ncLD/B4-BF232-F-5-A95-4549-960-F-58-A672436-BFE.jpg) (https://ibb.co/CJ1BmZc)
I did find 3 things:
These blue wires had the plastic scrapped off. I believe they made contact on the inside of the cabinet wall, there happens to be a screw there also. I taped them up with electrical tape.
(https://i.ibb.co/GdrWcBG/2-A8-EE399-6962-418-A-8-AC3-6-C4458-A2-E3-C2.png) (https://ibb.co/QJxPrzh)
I found a broken leaf, well not all the way detached, but barely on, this leaf is where the same blue wires connect to. I attempted to solder it closed. Hopefully that’s ok.
(https://i.ibb.co/gDxtgX5/5-C935470-AAFB-47-EC-B763-902709-A1-D7-A1.jpg) (https://ibb.co/cNj2TpG)
(https://i.ibb.co/zhzbZzV/96758022-E7-FD-46-EB-B3-D7-BF2714-C3-A9-A9.jpg) (https://ibb.co/JR92H9j)
(https://i.ibb.co/kg0RJyP/D7525-DD8-D7-EC-463-F-AA39-326463-AE0655.jpg) (https://ibb.co/hRHPcMT)
(https://i.ibb.co/yQm3sk5/40-FC6102-D05-B-4-E5-B-A474-0855-DEC01984.jpg) (https://ibb.co/Vq0KBCD)
Also when I reassembled the switches for the coin in relay, I just wanted to make sure they were correct, as far as what needs to be open and close.
Here is a before the cleaning and after the cleaning and repair.
(https://i.ibb.co/TM2Mc6c/ADE166-CA-FB1-F-4958-BFF6-2518-DD321882.png) (https://ibb.co/r202kYk)
(https://i.ibb.co/DpGn7KY/F4341-D76-2-C9-F-4-B43-9-A09-2-B94-E0162-AA4.png) (https://ibb.co/4dsxjN2)
After reassemble, same issue occurred. Handle did it release.
Wolftalk, I have yet to try your suggestions, last night I spent cleaning and repairing the reels.
I will follow your steps tonight. Thank you!
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Photos of a 1088 coin relay switch stack latched and unlatched.
Nice clean up on the machine.
Check for contact continuity in both positions.
Best to attach probs on the solder connection or as close to the wafer insulator as possible.
This will avoid a false positive reading.
Best to do each set of contacts at least two times.
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huh ... are the contacts closing or is the limit bar making the connection?
in any case, the limit bar should be straight, not kinked to the right and certainly not touching the moving right blade.
none of the blades should have kinks in them.
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Hi guys, I went back, and with pics that DavidLee shared and info Wolftalk advised, I was able to get the Coin In relay working again. There was a leaf contact that was not making contact all the way.
Also the Coin Switch at the door was buggy too, I jiggled it a bunch and kept triggering the metal bar back and forth, and it finally triggered the relay, I’m guessing it was stuck somehow. I might just buy a new one and swap it out.
Another problem now, well one that I’ve noticed before.
I played it for a while, and never really won anything?!
I feel the reels are offset? Or I don’t know where the actual payout line is?
The logos don’t really land all the way on the line. Maybe it was my angle? Well I sat down on a chair and tried my luck, the first reel#1 is significantly not lining up on the pay line. Reel 2 and 3 barely touched the line.
I hit a couple cherries and received zero payout.
I finally hit 3 berries, and only receive 4 quarters!
Another odd thing was when I moved reel #1 by hand, it triggered the hopper motor a bit. Is this normal? It felt like it was short of making the pay line, so moving it towards the pay line, it triggered the motor on the hopper.
I have 2 short videos:
Little to no payout on wins
https://youtu.be/SHHg_6_apfg (https://youtu.be/SHHg_6_apfg)
Weird hopper interaction with reel #1
https://youtu.be/aCbDSRiJv-0 (https://youtu.be/aCbDSRiJv-0)
Here is another video after the blueberry win, moving the reels
https://youtube.com/shorts/2ZV4CrI2XoU (https://youtube.com/shorts/2ZV4CrI2XoU)
Here is the reels out and placement of reels, after blueberry win
https://youtube.com/shorts/nOG-AAKyGc4 (https://youtube.com/shorts/nOG-AAKyGc4)
I’m so close!
I received the diodes in the mail this weekend, just waiting on the resister that broke on the hopper to arrive to install them all, and remove the paper clip jumper on the hopper relay.
Thanks guys.
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Good to hear you’re making progress.
Regarding the coin switch, I think I mentioned, if the trip wire drags or is bent this creates problems.
There also could be a slight build up of debris inside the switch.
Regarding reel symbol alignment.
Most likely the tapes have slipped out of position.
If this is the case, find the deepest cuts in the index disc. These are attached to the side of the reels.
Most likely each index disc has only one deep cut. This would be for the highest jackpot to be paid out.
To do this pull the index arms back, spin the reel until the deep slot is aligned, then in gauge the arm.
When all the reels have be re-aligned on the deepest cut, check the front of the reels.
There should be three 777 or bars.
Put the reels back into the machine, one of the symbols might be close to center cross line on the glass.
From here the others will need to be re-aligned.
Mark the reel tins in accordance with the center line on the glass.
Sometimes the tapes will side without un-crimping, if not the crimps need to be slightly lifted,
to align the tapes. Re-crimp with small pliers or make a special tool as to achieve a factor look.
But plies will do the job, but just go easy.
Caution, the reel tin edges a sharp and could result in blood getting on the tapes.
One more thing, this would be a good time to apply some cream wax-cleaner.
Always test a small area first for any unwanted side effects before applying any cleaners.
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the 1088's appear to be one of the exceptions for the index disc slot depths. My docs say your reel tapes are M-231-[1,2,3] - see chart below if you want to verify the symbols on your machine.
for those tapes, the matching index discs are p-684-[294, 295, 296]. Those numbers are sometimes stamped onto the discs. Definition is second pic below.
if that's what you have, the deepest slots on reel 1 are at positions 7, 13 and 21 and those are cherries.
in your last video that shows the index discs, reel 1 is on a plum (blueberry :-)) which is a depth 3 slot. Looks right.
third image below is the reel contact plate diagram, and everything checks. Wipers are at a depth 3 position, the drawing says that's a plum.
when you rock the reel up/down, you push the wipers towards a lower/shorter slot depth ... which would be an orange and that shouldn't cause a pay, so the implication is either the wipers are slightly misaligned on the rivets, the rivets are cruddy, or a wiper isn't pressing down on the rivet well and shifting the wiper helps.
before doing anything else, wiggle the whole reel mech to see if the issue is a poor plug connection.
if that doesn't help, you can set up the three plums and pull the reels. Set meter for resistance and stick one probe on wire 91 on reel 3. Other probe on wire 41 on reel 1. You should have almost zero ohms. If not, push down on wiper fingers in the path and wiggle them on the rivets to see which is flaky.
as usual, resistance checking may not find a problem. If just cleaning all the rivets and making sure the wipers are pressing down on them okay doesn't fix things, then you need one meter probe on wire 70 and the other along the path through the reels from wire 91 to 41 checking where the 50V disappeared.
It's still possible the problem is in the plugs. The other end of wire 41 is on the 14 trace on the payout counter, so the penultimate goal is to see 50V between wire 70 and the 14 payout counter trace. If you have that, you have to keep following the 50V thru the payout counter wipers onto wire 93-5 which goes to the payout relay coil. Powering the payout relay is the ultimate goal.
if the reel shaft is locked forward in the notches and the index arms are going all the way into the slots when the reels are stopped, then the only thing that matter is the position of the reel wipers on the rivets. Getting the tapes lined up is cosmetic.
you may be able to loosen the screws attaching the index discs to the hubs to shift the reel tins a little to change the symbol positions or possibly the reel glass is installed too low due to missing plastic edge protectors if it normally had those, but david's info on shifting the tapes is likely the right answer and he's definitely got way more experience on this problem than I have.
a 4 pay for plums is wrong, but to deal with that you'll want to look where the wipers are on the payout counter disc when pay ends. For 3 plums, they should be one step off the end of the 14 trace. Cruddy traces or a payout counter that isn't resetting all the way will give you an underpay and/or no win detect.
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While cleaning the payout unit, I took it apart, but I couldn’t remember the start position?!?
I have it on 2, starting off point... first click, stays at 2. Is that correct? Also I wound the unit one whole turn. Then locked it in. Hopefully that’s correct.
Also what is the “C.O.†and “F†before the 2 ?
Thanks.
https://youtube.com/shorts/iZSm1xu41qM (https://youtube.com/shorts/iZSm1xu41qM)
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Two steps should be off the 2, 5 steps should be off the 5 and so forth.
The unit was returning a little slow, might need a wipe of oil on the contact board.
And the cam carriage / armature should be lubed.
Plus a drop of oil on any moving parts.
Very nice cleaning on your part.
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the usual tension on the torsion spring wound around the ratchet is 2 turns. Spin the wipers clockwise until they hit the reset stop, remove the spring and put it back on. You can adjust tension +/- 90 degrees by changing which hole the short end hook into, but anything more than that and the problem is elsewhere.
the wipers need to reset quickly from 2 steps and step up 200 times (720 degrees). Oiling per david's info will help with that. 3-in-1 oil in the blue can works, and a lot of "electronic cleaner/lube" products are primarily a pure mineral oil. Just smear a drop over the surface with your finger to leave a film and the wipers should whizz back to reset. If they don't and the ratchet/hole is clean, the usual problem is excessive tension of the wiper fingers onto the traces.
I wouldn't lube the ratchet shaft or the spiral groove ... plastic on metal doesn't really need lube. It won't hurt, but it will gum up eventually.
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So here is a bit of news...
Thanks for your replies regarding the payout unit, it gave me more confidence to disassemble it further!
I took apart the Payout unit again, recleaned it again, removed all the grease and oil. I was now confident enough to take it more apart, so I removed the spring coil, cleaned that up and added lube to most moving parts, including the bake board with the metal payout numbers. I turned the spring as far as it went without breaking it, then went back a full turn so it rested on the "2". I clicked the weighted solenoid and locked it in place. Reattached everything, and plugged it back in.
I played it for a while and it payed out perfectly every time! I counted the quarters to match the "Dollars" on the marque, and yes it was perfect. Every winning combination payed out just fine. I didn't get to test the Jackpot "3 Bars" because I never hit it, plus I don't know if I had a hundred quarters in there...?
Next, I will continue to wait for the resistor to arrive so I can install that. Regarding the resister (1watt, 47ohm, -/+10%) Can I use a resister with 1watt 47ohm -/+5% ?
If so, amazon has 1 day shipping and I can continue repairing the machine and not have to wait another week for it to arrive.
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Great, everything is working good for now.
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Davidlee and wolftalk, send me your PayPal or Venmo and I’ll send you some beer money, you guys have been wonderful and patient.
I’m also going to donate to the site again.
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Karloz,
Thanks for the offer, reward enough just helping out and get a machine up and running.
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yup, thanks for the offer, but the pics have been plenty or reward! 'course, if you ever get some paperwork that I don't have, I'll nag ya for a loan of the stuff so I can scan and post it :-)
the resistor tolerance is how far off the labeled value the resistor can be when it's new, so a 5% resistor is guaranteed to be closer to 47 ohms (at 25 degrees C) than a 10% one. Either works fine in this application as exact resistance isn't critical.
there used to be a larger price difference for lower tolerance resistors, but with better manufacturing these days the cost difference only matters if you are buying very large quantities.
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Hi guys, a bit of a update here:
I was able to fully have my machine working again.
Taking Davidlee and wolftalks advice.
Cleaning all the relays and old grease,
And changing out the resisters and diodes fixed the issue.
I was able to unsolder the ones in the hopper and solder new replacements.
Tilt light went away, and payouts are precise.
Big thanks to this group of guys here in this great forum!
I’m now hunting Craigslist and offerup and marketplace for my next machine!
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Good to hear everything is working.
Yes, you need a another machine to keep your machine company.