Hi - I Inherited a Bally 1090 from 1975

[GeeksGoneBad]

Payout never resets when I pull the handle, so after the first payout, it never pays out again

[wolftalk]

the horizontal switch in front of the spiral cam should have orange/black (78-1) and yellow (30) wires on it.  Clip a jumper to the 78-1 wire and run it out of the game and shove the hopper back in with the payout counter stepped up a few times.

take a voltmeter and put one probe on the end of the jumper and the other probe on orange wire 70 on any handy coil coin the door.  Do you get 50VAC?

alternatively, just jumper the 30 and 78-1 wires together and see if the payout counter resets.

the grey/brown wire (96) went to the win meter.  Since you don't have the win meter anymore, it will just be dangling there.  That's ok.  However, you can use it to see if the payout counter horizontal switch is ok.  Stick a meter probe on the on the cut end of the wire and other probe on wire 70, then spin the reels.  When the reel mech B-1 switch is closed, you should see 50VAC.

the reel mech B-3 switch is the one that resets the payout counter ... it has wires 78-1 and black/white wire 85-1 on it.

the vertical switch on the payout unit usually is called something like "open at xx carriage" on the schem, and it was used to make sure the wipers got far enough on higher pays for other traces to take over.  I don't see it on the 1090 schem.

can you post a picture of the glass in your game?  Pics of the entire front of the game would be good.  If you're having problems posting big pics, you can email them at the highest possible resolution to slotpics@cdyn.com and I'll downsize them and post them.

[GeeksGoneBad]

My Reel Mech B switch has only 2 switches there and only one has any wires going to it - one being that grey-brown (96) wire and the other a yellow wire - unless I completely don't understand which one is A B and C LOL but I'm going off that picture someone posted earlier in the thread with the A B C and Coin Relay Switch labels

If I jumper that grey-brown wire to my payout reset coil, it does seem to work - but that's not jiving with what you are telling me I *should* be seeing

I included the top glass pic too

[GeeksGoneBad]

And the full front before I took it somewhat apart LOL

[DavidLee]

On this 1090 schematic there are only two switches between the payout reset coil.
The B switch and the O stop switch.
The Zero "O" stop switch is mounted on the payout unit, same color as the spiral cam. Turquoise blue.
Also check the switch for movement, sometimes they get a little sluggish.

Best to check continuity on both.
Switches that appear to be closed do not always make continuity.

1 of the Grey Brown wires ends up at the win meter reset coil.

On this 1090 schematic there are only two switches between the payout reset coil.
The B switch and the O stop switch.
The Zero "O" stop switch is mounted on the payout unit, same color as the spiral cam. Turquoise blue.
Also check the switch for movement, sometimes they get a little sluggish.

Best to check continuity on both.
Switches that appear to be closed do not always make continuity.

1 of the Grey Brown wires ends up at the win meter reset coil.

The Pink behind the artwork was used by the Summit Company when they converted machines by adding control cards after removing 75% of the wires.

This machine could have been converted by Summit just as a 2 coin machine, keeping intact the basic stuff.

[wolftalk]

well, I guess you have a sorta 1090 :-)

the schematic for a 1090 won't be completely correct, so you'll have to do some poking around.

you primarily want to know where the black/white wire attached to the payout unit reset coil is going.  It may just loop around to the zero switch in front of the spiral cam.  If so, what wire color is on the mating blade and where does that go?

[GeeksGoneBad]

Thanks for all the help guys - yeah I DO have a PCB in the top that I thought was just for the 3 stop buttons in the front - they never worked so I figured that board was fried or something - but those three stop buttons don't seem to be standard either it seems - so it's almost a 1090

That black/white wire goes into the harness and up the case in the back - I will hunt it down tomorrow!

almost there

[DavidLee]

Looks like a Summit conversion with the pink and metal sides.
Is there a blue and silver tag below the handle?

Stop buttons activate hold coils on each reel. Mounted between the reels on the back of the chassis.

The PCB could be just a sound card if there’s a speaker mounted inside.

Photos of the interior would be interesting to see.

[GeeksGoneBad]

Nope, no labels other than the ones at the top (first picture)

the PCB wires go to the buttons in the front and then a bundle goes inside the reel assembly - I'm assuming to the coils that activate the arm release coils - no speaker or bell at all

I've included a few pictures - in the top that thing in the center is my LED strip driver - other than that this is how it was when I got it

made myself new reels for fun

[DavidLee]

I was wondering about the reel tapes. Great you were able to personalize the reels.

As for the reset problem. Check contacts suggested in earlier post.

Also check for continuity on all the other contacts on the payout step up unit.

[GeeksGoneBad]

Good news! I traced ALL the wires around and found that everything was connected through this and that and finally figured out my grey/brown wire just needed to be connected to a ground (at least that what made it all start to work! Thanks for all the help guys!

Next adventure

I'm trying to make the 1 coin / 2 coin lights in the top half work right... When I took it apart there was a molex connector with 3 wires going to those top lights - I figured it would be easy enough to figure them out but it turns out I'm not figuring them out LOL - here's what I have

Black/White - Blue - Yellow

Trying to wire in a bulb to see what is what here's what I get...

B/W + Blue - no coin=on / 1 coin=off / 2 coins=on
Blue + Yellow - bulb is always on
B/W + Yellow - bulb is always off

Any ideas on how these should be wired?

I would think if I didn't have any coin in they'd be off - and then one coin would light the left and 2 coins light the right (and maybe the left stays on too)

[wolftalk]

Good news! I traced ALL the wires around and found that everything was connected through this and that and finally figured out my grey/brown wire just needed to be connected to a ground (at least that what made it all start to work! Thanks for all the help guys!

hmmm ... that may be kinda cheating, but it does depend on how the game got wired.  In the image below, yellow wire 30 is neutral (ground if ya wanna think of it like that), and orange wire 70 is the 50V hot wire.

the circuit is supposed to go along the blue highlight path thru the payout counter '0' switch.  When the payout counter is reset because the previous spin wasn't a win, that switch is open and the payout counter reset coil is not powered.

if you connected wire 96 to 30 like the purple highlight, then in theory the payout counter reset coil will reset on every spin ... which is not a big deal, just more wear-n-tear than necessary.

'course, your game may not be wired like the below schematic, so the only point of this post is ideally you want the '0' switch (in front of the blue spiral cam) to be in the circuit.

[wolftalk]

I'm trying to make the 1 coin / 2 coin lights in the top half work right... When I took it apart there was a molex connector with 3 wires going to those top lights - I figured it would be easy enough to figure them out but it turns out I'm not figuring them out LOL - here's what I have

Black/White - Blue - Yellow

Trying to wire in a bulb to see what is what here's what I get...

B/W + Blue - no coin=on / 1 coin=off / 2 coins=on
Blue + Yellow - bulb is always on
B/W + Yellow - bulb is always off

Any ideas on how these should be wired?

I would think if I didn't have any coin in they'd be off - and then one coin would light the left and 2 coins light the right (and maybe the left stays on too)

blue is wire 20 ... the "hot" 6V power.
yellow is wire 30 ... the neutral/ground wire.

one side of the lamp is always connected to wire 20.  The other side of the lamp is eventually connected to wire 30 when the lamp is supposed to be on.

some games always turned on the 1st coin lights ... they didn't bother run it thru the coin unit disc.  In effect, the first coin lights were GI (general illumination - always on).

usually on multiplier games the payout column moved appropriately and only one was lit.  On other style games like buy-a-pays, the stuff stays lit and more things get lit as coins are played.

you want the 2nd coin lamp to have wire 20 on one side (probably a bare wire running between lamps), and the black/white wire 85-4 on the other side.  When the coin unit is reset, that's = 1 coin played.  When the coin units steps up once, it connects 85-4 to 30 and turns on the 2nd coin lamps.

on a normal 1090, there's a grey/white 95-4 wire going from the coin unit to the 1st coin lamps that is connected to 30 when the unit is reset.  The 1st coin pays turn off when the 2nd coin is played.

I guess it's your call whether you want the lights to move between 1 coin and 2 coin payouts, or everything to be lit when you play the 2nd coin.  If you want to lights to move, you'll need to look at the coin unit wiring.

[DavidLee]

The 2nd and 3rd coin light up individually as the coins are inserted.
Pretty sure the coin unit in the top illuminate the corresponding light as it advances.
If you were to insulate the wipers from the contacts one at a time.
This would help find the contact that lights the first coin.
In theory the next coin advances the unit to the second coin light(s).

But first.
Best to swap bulbs to be sure they work.
Don’t want to spend time try to figure out what is wrong, when it’s only a bad bulb or socket.

[GeeksGoneBad]

ideally you want the '0' switch (in front of the blue spiral cam) to be in the circuit.

That is definitely in the circuit - I traced the wire from the payout counter (not the orange one, sorry don't remember the color) - through the plugs, up to the reel mech, to the first reel - winner pads (not sure what that is called but it's the first of three thing with the grid of pads...) - when the handle is pulled all the way this connects this wire to one that goes back to the plug and down to the switch on the spiral cam side - the other side of that switch goes back into the plug and up to the reel mech B switch, and finally the other side of that comes out and is the wire I cut...

I also only have the one Reel Mech B switch - not sure if it used to be 1 or 3 LOL - but I am certain my machine is not wired to that schematic exactly - I have no idea why they would pipe the circuit through the gird of pads, would that maybe be to prevent a half pull or something? because without a full pull all the way the payout would not reset the way this is wired... weird!

[GeeksGoneBad]

Thanks for the help too on the light wiring in the top - I'll take a look tomorrow with the new knowledge

I'm also not using the original bulbs - everything is getting replaced with LED bulbs

[wolftalk]

ideally you want the '0' switch (in front of the blue spiral cam) to be in the circuit.

That is definitely in the circuit - I traced the wire from the payout counter (not the orange one, sorry don't remember the color) - through the plugs, up to the reel mech, to the first reel - winner pads (not sure what that is called but it's the first of three thing with the grid of pads...) - when the handle is pulled all the way this connects this wire to one that goes back to the plug and down to the switch on the spiral cam side - the other side of that switch goes back into the plug and up to the reel mech B switch, and finally the other side of that comes out and is the wire I cut...

I also only have the one Reel Mech B switch - not sure if it used to be 1 or 3 LOL - but I am certain my machine is not wired to that schematic exactly - I have no idea why they would pipe the circuit through the gird of pads, would that maybe be to prevent a half pull or something? because without a full pull all the way the payout would not reset the way this is wired... weird!

I guess "grid of pads" is the reel wiper board (reel wiper contact plate).

the usual reason a reel mech B switch would go into a wiper board is to control a hopper mixer relay.  The hopper mixer relay was used on some "jackpot only" style games.  Those game types paid much less frequently, but when they did they paid more.

the problem is that since the payouts are much less frequent, the hopper doesn't turn on as often and deposited coins can kinda stack up and possibly overflow the bowl edge.  To get around that, the hopper mixer relay would burp the hopper.  Typically when reel 1 stopped on some blanks, the hopper mixer relay would power while the reel mech B switch was closed and turn on the hopper motor so the coins get churned in the bowl.  The override solenoid was not powered, so no coins were ejected.

having babbled all that, I would have thought the wide reel games all used the new style hopper that didn't have an override solenoid, so it's not possible to burp those.

seems like someone was using an earlier style machine as a reference for rewiring your game and did some stuff that wasn't needed.

since you don't have a win meter, you only need one reel mech B switch and it should be wired per the previously posted schematics.  Any wires going up to the reel wipers can be removed.

you could make your life easy and have the circuit be:
- wire 30 (on reels) to switch B
- other switch B blade wire 78-1 to the zero switch in front of spiral cam
- other zero switch blade to payout counter reset coil

however, then your game wouldn't match any schematic, so I'd just wire it like the blue highlight path in post 31 using the correct wire colors (if available) and the next person to look at your game won't have to figure it out :-)

btw, you can't do a partial pull on the handle.  There should be a ratcheting piece that prevents the handle from going back up until the reels have kicked off.