New Life Games LLC
**Reel Slots** Gaming Machines => IGT S and S-plus Reel Games => Topic started by: Fredoetisa on October 23, 2017, 09:21:38 AM
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hi guys,
I am french so excuse me for language...
I bought a slot IGT black jack « s » that was modified with somes parts of « s+ ». The MPU motherboard, hopper... is an « s+ » but i think the coin optic board is an « s » part. I found nothing to Know how connect it ? I think it’s not the same connection than the « s+ »
I think the coin optic is dead and i hope repair it but i have no shematic ? I don’t know how to connect the 10 pins and significations of each pin ?
Is it possible to replace the optic board by a physical switch ?
Thank’s for Yelp and big kiss from France !
https://image.noelshack.com/fichier...ece32226aa.jpeg (https://image.noelshack.com/fichiers/2017/42/7/1508679575-dd2fe5b7-986d-4529-a776-02ece32226aa.jpeg)
https://image.noelshack.com/fichier...b04737d059. (https://image.noelshack.com/fichiers/2017/42/7/1508679576-7c66f2f4-7dc1-43a6-ba37-21b04737d059.jpeg)jpeg
https://image.noelshack.com/fichier...77bcc175195.png (https://image.noelshack.com/fichiers/2017/42/7/1508679568-53ede88d-aa6c-4268-a010-177bcc175195.png)
https://image.noelshack.com/fichiers/2017/43/1/1508777593-9d58eaa2-44e9-477b-8065-3454a9b356ad.jpeg
https://image.noelshack.com/fichiers/2017/43/1/1508777591-cca721ae-91c4-4fb6-ab42-8cf0556d01d6.jpeg
https://image.noelshack.com/fichiers/2017/43/1/1508777592-811bb319-610e-443a-a308-5a96b76fed23.jpeg
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Welcome to NLG. Are you sure that was an S machine? I think you actually have an early model S+. They look the same from the outside as the S machine but are different on the inside. It has door optics and the inside setup from an S would be completely different.
I'll do some more looking for what you are wanting. Or others may jump in. Here's a picture of an early S+ compatator inside one of my machines. Do you know what coins this was set up for before. The coin guide could be the wrong size.
Dave
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I agree. It is a S+ machine .. probably 1990 maybe 1991. Do you have the parts that Shaggy posted in the pictures?
Wire harness looks like a rat's nest.
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the optics you showed are from an early "S" model, you can tell because of the 555 timer, and the diode that was cut off, the diode being cut off on that optic board was the same thing as taking off Q-2 or Q-4 on the S+ optic board.
I would write down where and what all the other wires are attached to. looks as if all the connectors are there that you would need to hook up the entire optics and diverter. the 10 pin connector for the optic board, the two pin connector for the diverter, and I think the three pin connector for the cc-16,
I would secure the bracket that holds the cc-16 along with the optics to the proper place ( as in the pictures) hook everything up and see what happens, make sure all exposed wires are taped. when everything is hooked up, you should be able to press the button on the optic board and put a credit on the machine, if this works, then you should be able to put a cc-16 in place ,put a sample coin in the right spot and see if it will accept it.
Jim
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Welcome to NLG. Are you sure that was an S machine? I think you actually have an early model S+. They look the same from the outside as the S machine but are different on the inside. It has door optics and the inside setup from an S would be completely different.
I'll do some more looking for what you are wanting. Or others may jump in. Here's a picture of an early S+ compatator inside one of my machines. Do you know what coins this was set up for before. The coin guide could be the wrong size.
Dave
Ok it might be an early s+. But my coin optic board is different from others s + i saw on the web?
I found this document about s+:
http://slot-tech.com/interesting_stuff/igt/spluspeplus.pdf (http://slot-tech.com/interesting_stuff/igt/spluspeplus.pdf)
The shematic on page 15 is a little bit different from my optic board, they show That resistor r1 goes to pin 8 on the sp / 50 connector. but mine goes to pin 2?
And nowhere its indicate Where plugging the 24 volts ac ?
My coin comparitor is an old azkoyen l20 out of order (i bought the slot like this):
https://image.noelshack.com/fichiers/2017/43/1/1508791821-2a7209c2-8d6f-41d1-84c3-99cd78c787d8.jpeg (https://image.noelshack.com/fichiers/2017/43/1/1508791821-2a7209c2-8d6f-41d1-84c3-99cd78c787d8.jpeg)
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I agree. It is a S+ machine .. probably 1990 maybe 1991. Do you have the parts that Shaggy posted in the pictures?
Wire harness looks like a rat's nest.
Lol... very funny for the rats.... :24: :24:
I have all parts but not a cc-16d coin comparitor. I don t know if i requires a good coin comparitor for the error 21 ? Or if a good coin optic is enough?
I found this on the left of the slot:
https://image.noelshack.com/fichiers/2017/43/1/1508793123-46e6f7b7-a523-4ce4-b338-70a6a29c2c57.jpeg (https://image.noelshack.com/fichiers/2017/43/1/1508793123-46e6f7b7-a523-4ce4-b338-70a6a29c2c57.jpeg)
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the optics you showed are from an early "S" model, you can tell because of the 555 timer, and the diode that was cut off, the diode being cut off on that optic board was the same thing as taking off Q-2 or Q-4 on the S+ optic board.
I would write down where and what all the other wires are attached to. looks as if all the connectors are there that you would need to hook up the entire optics and diverter. the 10 pin connector for the optic board, the two pin connector for the diverter, and I think the three pin connector for the cc-16,
I would secure the bracket that holds the cc-16 along with the optics to the proper place ( as in the pictures) hook everything up and see what happens, make sure all exposed wires are taped. when everything is hooked up, you should be able to press the button on the optic board and put a credit on the machine, if this works, then you should be able to put a cc-16 in place ,put a sample coin in the right spot and see if it will accept it.
Jim
Thank’s for your response. But I don’t know how to connect the old optic from early s model. I think its différent from s+ optic board ? Otherwise i have all the connectors.
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the optics you showed are from an early "S" model, you can tell because of the 555 timer, and the diode that was cut off, the diode being cut off on that optic board was the same thing as taking off Q-2 or Q-4 on the S+ optic board.
I would write down where and what all the other wires are attached to. looks as if all the connectors are there that you would need to hook up the entire optics and diverter. the 10 pin connector for the optic board, the two pin connector for the diverter, and I think the three pin connector for the cc-16,
I would secure the bracket that holds the cc-16 along with the optics to the proper place ( as in the pictures) hook everything up and see what happens, make sure all exposed wires are taped. when everything is hooked up, you should be able to press the button on the optic board and put a credit on the machine, if this works, then you should be able to put a cc-16 in place ,put a sample coin in the right spot and see if it will accept it.
Jim
Thank’s for your response. But I don’t know how to connect the old optic from early s model. I think its différent from s+ optic board ? Otherwise i have all the connectors.
I think what Jim is saying, was this, is the picture you posted with the Azkoyen comparator, your machine before you took the Azkoyen out? Or did it come with the Azkoyen already out?
If it was in and hooked up but did not work. Can you put it back in and hook it up like before and the push the black button on the bottom and see if it registers a credit? Also check to see if all the other connectors are hooked up on one and just hanging loose on the other. If it registers a credit when you push the button, see if it will play that credit. If it works that way, you should be able to change it out for a different one. My guess is, parts for that Azkoyen are going to be difficult if not impossible to find.
Dave
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the optics you showed are from an early "S" model, you can tell because of the 555 timer, and the diode that was cut off, the diode being cut off on that optic board was the same thing as taking off Q-2 or Q-4 on the S+ optic board.
I would write down where and what all the other wires are attached to. looks as if all the connectors are there that you would need to hook up the entire optics and diverter. the 10 pin connector for the optic board, the two pin connector for the diverter, and I think the three pin connector for the cc-16,
I would secure the bracket that holds the cc-16 along with the optics to the proper place ( as in the pictures) hook everything up and see what happens, make sure all exposed wires are taped. when everything is hooked up, you should be able to press the button on the optic board and put a credit on the machine, if this works, then you should be able to put a cc-16 in place ,put a sample coin in the right spot and see if it will accept it.
Jim
Thank’s for your response. But I don’t know how to connect the old optic from early s model. I think its différent from s+ optic board ? Otherwise i have all the connectors.
I think what Jim is saying, was this, is the picture you posted with the Azkoyen comparator, your machine before you took the Azkoyen out? Or did it come with the Azkoyen already out?
If it was in and hooked up but did not work. Can you put it back in and hook it up like before and the push the black button on the bottom and see if it registers a credit? Also check to see if all the other connectors are hooked up on one and just hanging loose on the other. If it registers a credit when you push the button, see if it will play that credit. If it works that way, you should be able to change it out for a different one. My guess is, parts for that Azkoyen are going to be difficult if not impossible to find.
Dave
Hi,
I bought the slot with the azkoyen already out. The connection are not planned for this comparitor. I test but it dont work . I don’t know if it necessary to have a good comparitor to pass thru the error 21 ? Otherwise i will buy it in the US, you don’t find theses parts in France. But i prefer trying to repair or replace by a simple switch if it’s possible ?
I am not sure about the connection of 10 pins with this old optic board from the « s » modèle, it seems not the same connection with the « s+ ». I try to connect like this but it don’t take credit with the little button. I test with the test menu when you arrive to 10.0 and try to change to 10.1 but it don’t work.
Thank’s to all
Fred
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Fred I'm thinking someone was trying to make the S comparator work but it didn't and they gave up. Unless Jim or Ken have other ideas, I think you need to try and get a CC-16 comparator for the S+. Do you know anybody who has an S+ machine that would let you borrow one? I just don't think we are going to get correct results until we get a good coin comparator.
Dave
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The early S model machine did use a switch with a trip lever. , Don't know where you would find the parts for that unless someone was parting out a machine.
What I was trying to convey, remove all the added wiring that does not belong to the original wiring harness. re-install the coin comparitor bracket, the optics, connect the 10 pin connector to the optic board and turn on the machine, and see what happens.
the code 21 has nothing to do with cc-16, it has everything to do with the coin optics. the fact that the diode has been removed from that board will allow you to use a mechanical acceptor, an IMONEX acceptor or just fashion a chute that would deliver the coin from the coin head directly into the black coin encoder.
Jim
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Fred I'm thinking someone was trying to make the S comparator work but it didn't and they gave up. Unless Jim or Ken have other ideas, I think you need to try and get a CC-16 comparator for the S+. Do you know anybody who has an S+ machine that would let you borrow one? I just don't think we are going to get correct results until we get a good coin comparator.
Dave
Thank’s a lot for your response.
It s very difficult to find parts in France because theses machines are prohibited (like whisky in the prohibition in the USA... :waving_flag: ). But now, in 2017, you can drink whisky but in my case I couldn’t play on slot anymore... expect if you go to the casino because they earn a lot of money :Crazy: . All games for money is reserved for the french states. If you take one for you they close they’re eyes if it’s only to play at home. That’s why there a few slots in France. I bought mine in Belgium with error 12... the battery on board... I think it will be good after changing battery... but after I had this s... error 21 and i discovered the bad connection on the optic and the false comparitor that was connecting no matter how...
So, if it needs, i buy one in the states with the coin optic integrated. I think I need a cc-16d 24 volts with coin optic board s +. I don’t know anybody who has s+ slot or these kind of comparitor.
I have an old bally big spender with a coin comparitor but I don’t think it’s good because the power on connection is about 50 volts...
and the other is a s2000 triple seven hot out of order with an error « display netplex link is down ». I try to change the power but it’s the same... the comparitor is 13 volts on it...
Fred
The old bally comparitor
https://image.noelshack.com/fichiers/2017/43/2/1508859728-3f58b078-8b41-46f7-a086-87f6a0dae6c1.jpeg
https://image.noelshack.com/fichiers/2017/43/2/1508859727-f6008db2-ec02-48e0-8db4-d040e19f45af.jpeg
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The early S model machine did use a switch with a trip lever. , Don't know where you would find the parts for that unless someone was parting out a machine.
What I was trying to convey, remove all the added wiring that does not belong to the original wiring harness. re-install the coin comparitor bracket, the optics, connect the 10 pin connector to the optic board and turn on the machine, and see what happens.
the code 21 has nothing to do with cc-16, it has everything to do with the coin optics. the fact that the diode has been removed from that board will allow you to use a mechanical acceptor, an IMONEX acceptor or just fashion a chute that would deliver the coin from the coin head directly into the black coin encoder.
Jim
Thank’s jim,
Very interesting. This is moving forward .... It’s easy to modify my coin comparitor out of order by blocking the magnet inside to open gate. If I do that, it became a mechanical acceptor and all type of money will be accepted. But it’s not a problem because I will only put the good money inside. I was wondering if the comparitor has something to do with the 21 error and you told me no. So It’s cool. I will work to repair or shunt the optic board.
I put all the wiring like the s+ connection on the optic and turn on the machine but still display error 21 and its impossible to have credit with the little button under the optic. But I don’t know if the 24 volts is good, look at my previous post ?
I saw a post and picture who the guy shunt the optic board but he seems have error 21 and it was to difficult for me, with my poor English, to understand with all subtlety.
Finally I don’t know if he could shunt the optic ?
This is the post and the picture:
http://newlifegames.net/nlg/index.php?topic=13622.0 (http://newlifegames.net/nlg/index.php?topic=13622.0)
http://newlifegames.net/nlg/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=13622.0;attach=36022;image (http://newlifegames.net/nlg/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=13622.0;attach=36022;image)
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The comparator and optic is separate.
The comparator compares the coin and if it matches it then passes. (first test)
The next test is the ABC optic. This is a small square board with 3 sensors.
The purpose is that the coin falls passing by A, sensor, B sensor, C sensor.
To cheat someone might use a string and pull the coin back up. In this case the optic detects a coin has passed in a bad order and you get the 21 error.
Use the small white button and go through all of the screens, close the door and the error should be cleared.
What can cause a 21....
1. Dirty Optic
2. Coin going in the reverse order
3. Wrong size coin not passing correctly (rubbing as it falls) and you need to increase the spacers in the optic.
A 0.20 euro coin is different than a US quarter - especially in thickness.
I would suggest to remove the optic - clean the optic using a wet wipe (not alcohol) and slide a coin through it and make sure it is not rubbing in any way. I might suggest using a US or Canadian quarter for testing.
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The comparator and optic is separate.
The comparator compares the coin and if it matches it then passes. (first test)
The next test is the ABC optic. This is a small square board with 3 sensors.
The purpose is that the coin falls passing by A, sensor, B sensor, C sensor.
To cheat someone might use a string and pull the coin back up. In this case the optic detects a coin has passed in a bad order and you get the 21 error.
Use the small white button and go through all of the screens, close the door and the error should be cleared.
What can cause a 21....
1. Dirty Optic
2. Coin going in the reverse order
3. Wrong size coin not passing correctly (rubbing as it falls) and you need to increase the spacers in the optic.
A 0.20 euro coin is different than a US quarter - especially in thickness.
I would suggest to remove the optic - clean the optic using a wet wipe (not alcohol) and slide a coin through it and make sure it is not rubbing in any way. I might suggest using a US or Canadian quarter for testing.
Hi,
Thank’s. I test the 0,20 euros and I think is good. Look at the photos it cover the optic on the left or the right and cover completely the 3 optics when the money fall.
https://image.noelshack.com/fichiers/2017/43/3/1508919113-56200974-0d70-4fd7-9737-90fb723fd0e6.jpeg (https://image.noelshack.com/fichiers/2017/43/3/1508919113-56200974-0d70-4fd7-9737-90fb723fd0e6.jpeg)
https://image.noelshack.com/fichiers/2017/43/3/1508919113-fcebb23d-bacd-478f-9e44-2a7b10f89fa9.jpeg (https://image.noelshack.com/fichiers/2017/43/3/1508919113-fcebb23d-bacd-478f-9e44-2a7b10f89fa9.jpeg)
https://image.noelshack.com/fichiers/2017/43/3/1508919113-91142e2a-7c27-4f86-b920-65382cb1becc.jpeg (https://image.noelshack.com/fichiers/2017/43/3/1508919113-91142e2a-7c27-4f86-b920-65382cb1becc.jpeg)
I already clean the optic but it the same. I said before I am not sure about a good wiring on the 10 pins because I have an old optic board from s model and it seems to have differents connexions from the s+ Optic board.
I think the optic board is dead or wrong Wiring ?
It’s strange because I have 24 volts ac on the 10 pins connections. When I test the 24 volts ac with the ground I only have 13,8 volts ac. When I go back on the wiring I found a 12 pins connections called jp301 with 24 volts ac and 24 ac return. When I test the 2 wires I have 24 volts. So I don’t know how the optic board is powered by 24 volts because I only have 24 volts ac and ground on the 10 pins connections (only 13,8 volts). I don’t know if it’s normal or not ?
Fred
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Fred, we will figure this out! I looked for a optic board like yours and for the schematic for that board, no luck. if you could trace the 8 used pins on that board to the component that it goes to I should be able to make sense of it. here is some information, your machine is obviously an S+ machine, so it only stands to reason that we should be able to get it working using the harness that you have. we can worry about a coin mechanism after we get rid of the 21 code.
you do not need 24vac to run the optic board, 24vac is only used to power the cc-16 and the diverter coil,there is a bridge rectifier on the coil that converts the 24vac to a dc voltage. you do need the following two dc voltages to run the optic board, +VB is approx. 8-10 vdc, should be measured at pin 7 (solid green wire, dc ground ) and pin 8 ( red & black wire.) the second is pin 7 (ground) and pin 2 (orange & brown wire) this is the LED voltage that should go to R1 to power the three emitters on the second logic board. this is also derived from +VB at J-1 of the mother board, +VB is distributed to many places via the motherboard, it is presented to R2 (180 ohm resistor on the motherboard) passes through R2 and now becomes LED- at pin 24 of J-1, it is sent to P203 pin 3.
without these two voltages the optic board cannot run. the +vb provides the voltage to run the chips, and the LED- is used to power the emitters. When the emitters are powered, they emit an IR beam which is sent to the detectors on the front board of the optic assembly (the IR beam passes through the three holes on the encoder board) when the detector detects the presence of the beam, it conducts and places a ground to the pull up resistor network which in turn will tell the cpu that everything is working. NOW, WHEN A COIN IS INSERTED, the cc-16 will pass it on to the optic board encoder, the coin will pass through the open space and as it travels downward it will break each beam which will signal the cpu that a coin has passed through, so go ahead an issue a credit.
the plug in the machine is P203, the harness you have has three or four connectors on it, one plugs into P203,(P301) the other is the 10 pin connector ,which plugs into the optic board, the three pin connector will eventually plug into a harness that will power the cc-16, and the two pin connector usually will power the diverter.
the harness plug P301 is a 12 pin plug, 9 wires are used,
#1 red&black goes to pin 8 of P50
#2 orange /black to pin 1 of P50
#3 orange/brown to pin 2 of P50
#4 orange/red to pin 4 of P50
#5 no wire
#6 orange /yellow to pin 3 of P50
#7 orange/green goes to pin 2 of the 3 pin connector for the cc-16
#8 orange/blue goes to the two pin connector for the diverter
#9 orange/violet goes to pin 3 of the three pin connector for the cc-16
#10 solid green wire to pin 7 of P50
#11 no wire
#12 nowire
check all your wiring and voltages, then we will proceed.
hope this helps
Jim
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Hi Jim,
You are wonderful ! :thank_you:
I trace the 8 used pins on the board to the component with this shematic :
https://image.noelshack.com/fichiers/2017/43/4/1509026015-042bc975-acf0-43c0-ab2a-c4d457dc2b8e.png (https://image.noelshack.com/fichiers/2017/43/4/1509026015-042bc975-acf0-43c0-ab2a-c4d457dc2b8e.png)
I am ok about pin 1, 3, 4 and 7. But on this schematic the +vb (pin 1 from j301) goes to pin 8 on j/p50 like you said. But after it should go to the resistor R1 on DS1, DS2 and DS3. In my board it’s not the pin 8 but the pin 2 look at this photo:
https://image.noelshack.com/fichiers/2017/43/4/1509054253-65229f0a-a608-4529-ac16-f87379fb940d.jpeg (https://image.noelshack.com/fichiers/2017/43/4/1509054253-65229f0a-a608-4529-ac16-f87379fb940d.jpeg)
But if I understand what you said, the wire orange and brown named « coin in led » must be connected to pin 2 to go to R1 to power the 3 emitters. So I think you are right and the schematic does not match to my board.
I think the wiring is good now. Thank’s a lot. :cool_thumb_up:
I measured +vb at pin 8 on the j/p50 at 10,8 volts DC and the same voltage on the pin 2 (coin in led). So I think it’s good.
I test the wire continuity and motherboard continuity check that indicates in the schematic and everything is good.
I try to power on the machine but I still have the same error 21. I think the optic board is dead. But now, with the good wiring I can have help to repair electronic.
I forgot to tell you that my diverted coil is also dead but I don’t think it’s important ...
Thank’s a lot ! You teach me a lot of informations to successfully solve this anomaly.
Fred
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got to thinking last night, how to get rid of the 21 code so you could see if the machine will actually work. this bypass plug should fool the machine into thinking the optics are working and allow you to test the rest of the machine using the test feature. then you could parallel the test button on the optic board (run a set of wires up to the service button), unplug one of the door optics, and now you could close your door, put credits on the machine using the service switch (which is now an extended coin optic push button) the machine will act just list a normal machine.
this went back to 2009 ,here is the link http://newlifegames.net/nlg/index.php?topic=2077.50 (http://newlifegames.net/nlg/index.php?topic=2077.50)
Jim
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With your help, I could test the optic board. 1 receptor (Q1) is dead. The 2 others are ok.
I will change the receptor now. :thank_you:
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got to thinking last night, how to get rid of the 21 code so you could see if the machine will actually work. this bypass plug should fool the machine into thinking the optics are working and allow you to test the rest of the machine using the test feature. then you could parallel the test button on the optic board (run a set of wires up to the service button), unplug one of the door optics, and now you could close your door, put credits on the machine using the service switch (which is now an extended coin optic push button) the machine will act just list a normal machine.
this went back to 2009 ,here is the link [url]http://newlifegames.net/nlg/index.php?topic=2077.50[/url] ([url]http://newlifegames.net/nlg/index.php?topic=2077.50[/url])
Jim
Thank’s a lot Jim :thank_you:
I drink a beer in France for your healt. :wave:
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I change one of the three phototransistors and it’s work again !!!!
Cool
Thanks to all !
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Impressive collaboration.
kudos to all involved.