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**Reel Slots** Gaming Machines => Bally Reel Games => Topic started by: George on February 23, 2016, 09:35:19 AM
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Hi all,
I was given a bally 5000 plus "stars and bars" that was completely dead.
I've repaired the power supply and replaced the battery.
When I power up I get the number 82 on both "WIN" and "CREDIT" and the "insert coin" and "coin accepted" flash rapidly 4 times and then pause a while and flash again and so on.
Nothing else is happening.
The problems I immediately see are:
-The door switch is broken. I would like to have the part number of the switch (or equivalent) so I can replace it. In the mean time it would be useful to know which wires to sort to get it going.
-There is a 24 pin connector flying around that I have no idea if it should go somewhere. Anybody knows?
-There are 2 cables unconnected that go to J14 (handle box) on the backboard. The wire colors are gray-orange and gray-brown. Something is missing?
-There is a switch at the right hand back side without anything connected to it and I can't see any means of activation. I would thought the 2 wires above go there but the cables are too short to reach the connectors of the switch.
Is there somewhere a technical manual I could d/l.
Thank you.
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The broken white switch for the door is often called a "Cherry" switch because there is a popular company with that name that makes them, along with several other companies. You can find them for sale from most electronic parts places, slot machine vendors and even on ebay. Prices can vary a lot. You will want the style with 6 flat spade terminals so the wires in your machine can easily slip on. Since the wires are still connected to the broken white switch you will know how to connect the new switch.
http://www.jameco.com/1/1/17142-f79-30a-switch-push-button-n-o-n-c-snap.html (http://www.jameco.com/1/1/17142-f79-30a-switch-push-button-n-o-n-c-snap.html)
http://www.8linesupply.com/p/door-switch-6-pins.html (http://www.8linesupply.com/p/door-switch-6-pins.html)
http://www.ebay.com/itm/Cherry-0E79-00A0-Pushbutton-Switches-10A-DPDT-MOM-QC-TERM-FREE-SHIPPING-New-/331391188923?hash=item4d28743fbb:g:37YAAOSw2XFUcK3C (http://www.ebay.com/itm/Cherry-0E79-00A0-Pushbutton-Switches-10A-DPDT-MOM-QC-TERM-FREE-SHIPPING-New-/331391188923?hash=item4d28743fbb:g:37YAAOSw2XFUcK3C)
The unused switch towards the back of your machine, as well as some disconnected electrical cables & connectors, may have been for some optional equipment that was removed when the casino got rid of the machine. Casinos usually have equipment inside the machine for player slot club tracking, for progressive jackpots, security reporting and other reasons. They often keep this equipment for use on other machines, and most home owners don't need it. That may be part of the things you are asking about.
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Thanks for the hints about the switch.
The wires in mine were loose as the connector was broken. I've read a post in this forum on their possible position, so I placed them temporally accordingly.
There is a side switch behind the handle that from what I understand is some kind of reset when there is a jackpot. This is missing.
Should this be normal on? normal off? If I use a push-to-contact would it do the job?
Any other ideas about my problem?
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Thanks for the hints about the switch.
The wires in mine were loose as the connector was broken. I've read a post in this forum on their possible position, so I placed them temporally accordingly.
There is a side switch behind the handle that from what I understand is some kind of reset when there is a jackpot. This is missing.
Should this be normal on? normal off? If I use a push-to-contact would it do the job?
Any other ideas about my problem?
If that sideswitch is a keyswitch (a round "barrel shaped" switch that can be turned by inserting a key) then it is likely the RESET switch. They are available for less than $10, it simply mounts in the round hole with a nut on the inside to tighten up. It has 2 terminals, the wires that slip on can be installed either way, they should be laying or hanging inside the machine nearby. You could rig some kind of switch until you get the correct one, or just touch the 2 reset wires to each other, then disconnect them. It is low voltage but don't let them short to the machine chassis. The switch is normally in the "open" position, meaning the 2 wires are not connected to each other. When the switch is activated the 2 wires are connected momentarily and that sends a signal to the mpu board.
Here is an example of a RESET keyswitch:
http://rudysdeals.com/index.php?route=product/product&path=56&product_id=773 (http://rudysdeals.com/index.php?route=product/product&path=56&product_id=773)
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The previous owner has hacked (with a drill) the reset switch, perhaps he lost the key. I will install a key switch as I have plenty around.
Thanks for clearing up the normal position of this switch (for operation is open, for reset is closed).
This reset switch, is actually resetting the mpu board, like the one (push switch) onboard the mpu pcb? Right now, sorting the wires produces no result.
The only switch that does something in my machine (it resets as it should) is onboard the mpu pcb.
I can't get the thing to do anything else pass the "82". Does the flashing of the coin lights indicate some kind of error code?
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Here is a table (below) listing the tilt or error codes the machine can display. I'm not very familiar with your machine but it is possible the error code 82 is due to the machine thinking the door is not closed. I'd try getting that broken door switch (Cherry switch) fixed and go from there. I've attached what I think is a manual for the Bally 5000 Plus, in case you don't have it.
I don't think the RESET keyswitch on the side of the machine is to do what we sometimes think of as an mpu reset or reboot. I think it is to send a signal to the mpu board to resume play after the machine has paused for a jackpot handpay event, and maybe for other times. But it isn't like a reset button that resets the microprocessor to start things all over fresh like after a power up. They put the reset function on the RESET keyswitch so that casino slot people can come over when you hit a jackpot because the machine pauses when a jackpot occurs. It stays paused until the jackpot is taken care of by someone handing you money, then they insert the reset key and turn the switch to let the machine start playing again. Turning the reset keyswitch probably won't have any effect except at times when it is needed. If I am wrong about all of this maybe someone that is familiar with Bally machines will chime in and give correct advice.
These machines were built for use in a casino. It isn't going to play or let you do much if it thinks the main door is open.
I don't know about the flashing of the coin lights, maybe that is covered in the manual.
After you get the main door Cherry switch replaced and then with the main door closed see what happens.
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George!
Did you make Ram clear after replace battery?
When write Error code on display is only one display,
I have bally 5000 plus "stars and bars".
Tomorrow I can send picture from inside.
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The machine was out of power and with a dead battery for several years. And it was stored in a really dusty place.
Unfortunately, in the attempt to clean the inside of the cabinet, they took all parts out and disconnect all connectors. So I was given basically a pile of stuff, not an assembled unit.
I'm an electronics tech guy so for me is easy to do any required work, but I lack experience with this kind of machines.
So right now I'm in the reading phase to get acquainted with the inner workings of this beast.
After replacing the battery, I did not make a RAM clear because I could not get the thing to respond to any procedure found around the net.
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Try this:
Switch power off machine:
Pull out IO (upper) board from cage (on front ribbon cable still )
Switch power on:
if display showte CP an CL ..
Ram will ceared.
Switch poer off, and push IO board back.
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I did try this, but still only "82" is shown. Nothing else.
I've checked the ram chips on my programmer and they are ok, so the fault is elsewhere.
I think I might start exchanging logic chips on the board.
BTW the battery is of rechargeable type. Should the board try to send charging current to the battery? Because in my board there is no charging current when the machine is on. I would expect the board to try and keep the battery charged. Otherwise I see no reason for a rechargeable battery there.
EPROMS have this date on their sticker: 03-31-93
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Try this clear method:
Turn off power. Move the JUMPER on MPU board from J15 to J14 power up the game. Wait a few seconds and observe the LED display. When you see the "CH/CL" then ram has been cleared.
Most of my Bally 5000 and 5000+ board on solders side is diode with some wire and cut.
Some of them I convert to lithium battery cr2030 like in pc cmos battery. I put battery socket from bad pc motherboard.
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Moving the jumper has no effect. Still the only responce is "82". This will not change even if I leave it for long time.
I will do a better check on the mpu board and see if I can find any fault. There might be corrosion around the area of the older battery.
Is there any kind of service diagram for these?
The way the machine is made is not easy to do a live test on the board. I might need to make some extensions to work on the board and probe voltages etc.
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...Moving the jumper has no effect. Still the only responce is "82". This will not change even if I leave it for long time.....
Did you get the main door cherry switch replaced and wired correctly? That error code 82 you keep having relates to a DOOR OPEN problem according to the Bally 5000+ manual. Looks like the old cherry door switch has broken contacts.
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The door switch is not the problem.
I've patched it temporarely while I wait for a new one to arrive.
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Here is the fix for the nagging 82 code. See attached.
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This procedure is been carried out - perhaps by the factory. There is already a short between the 2 points using the same patch cable as other places on the back side of the board.
I can't get the thing to do a RAM clear. I tried all suggestions with no result. I think in my case there is a fault elsewhere and this is indicated by the 4 flashes.
If the flash error code list is accurate it means there is a problem with RAM chips, but I tested the chips and are OK. Which suggests a problem with some logic chip.
I even have the same error (82) even if I remove completely the EPROM daughter board! Which means the machine is not booting properly.
I will try to find the problem if I can find a way to check the board outside the cabinet.
By the way, I notice that in order to get the NiCd (NiMh) battery to charge is to insert jumper J16.
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Interesting about the jumper for charging the battery. Are there dipswitches or other jumpers that may be set to the wrong position that could be causing a problem? Someone before you got the machine may have tried different things and changed some of them. We haven't see a photo of your mpu (main logic board), perhaps someone here might notice something if you posted a photo. You mentioned earlier that prev owners had removed all the main assemblies from the machine, maybe there is a cable or connector somewhere not connected, or a security switch that is disconnected, causing the machine to malfunction, particularly around the cash storage box and mpu card cage?
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Indeed the machine was a pile of parts.
Here are the photos of my mpu board before I replace the battery.
By comparing photos found on the net I see that on my machine there is no J7 jumper installed. (next to J14)
If I install J7 the number of flashes changes from 4 to 7 (if I remember correctly) but still the error remains 82.
All other jumpers seem identical.
On the bottom side of the board at the right top hand side as you see in the picture, there are 2 short blue wires. These are "fix" for the 82 error as pointed out by user Badbaud.
The board had this modification perhaps from factory.
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On the lower right side of the board are two 40 pin chips. Remove the bottom one (permanently, it is not needed) and try clearing again.
If that doesn't work you may need clear chips to clear the board.
You may want to send the board to Larry and we can check it out on our tester.
702-363-9998, tell him Badbaud sent you.
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I will try this and report.
Unfortunatelly I'm not in USA so it might not worth the cost to send for repair.
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Where do you live?
I think your board converted in factory to use non rechargeable lithium battery.
It doesn't charge battery.
Yo can put the small llithium battery like in PC.
I put my bally cr2032 lithium battery 5+ yers ago, an it's good now.
Did you checked powersupply otput voltage?
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I think I found the problem.
The CPU is faulty. 2 Data lines are dead. I will try to find a replacement.
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Try to cut the dead signals leg databus driver IC, this way can you check this is wrong or other IC.
Try replace data bus driver IC this is 74ls244 or 74ls255 , (if I remember good).
Its cheap.
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I've removed the CPU and did a check on the data lines.
I found a problem in one HC245.
I've replaced this and the CPU and now I have a different flash code.
Now it flashes 6 times. Anybody with the list of what the flash codes mean?
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What type battery in your CPU?
NiCd NiMh or lithium?
Battery voltage checked?
Did you make RAM clear?
It maybe flash display without RAM clear.
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Battery is new Ni-Mh, fully charged at 3.7V.
I've also checked that I have 3.7V at the RAM chips when power is off.
Which chip checks the voltage level? Maybe I have another chip faulty.
What might also be bad in my case is the location and setting of the jumpers. What is the most usual jumper settings for these machines?
For example, in my case (see picture in me previous posts) there is no jumper in J7. Perhaps during cleaning some fell off and / or placed in the wrong position.
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It's a foto of my Bally 5000+ spare CPU board.
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Remove U23.... forever.
The jumper just south of the battery should be removed.
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What about J7?
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my board:
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OK, I'm getting somewhere ...
I found the list of flash codes which seems correct (I've tested the responces by removing the relevant chips):
1 Main EPROM Checksum error
2 Supplement EPROM checksum error
3 Personality EPROM checksum error
4 Volatile RAM read/write failure
5 NON-Volatile RAM read/write failure
6 NON-Volatile RAM error , Battery removed , ect.
My first problem was 4 flashes. I've replaced CPU and U6 because D11 and D15 data lines were dead and inserted J7 which was missing and got 6 flashes.
Since my RAM chips are OK, the problem is related to RTC. /CS line of U30 is stuck high. If I force this low, the machine boots and I have now a proper error code "80" and 3 flashes.
Now off to find what blocks my RTC chip.
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The board will work without a RTC chip in it.
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I could not work for long time on this project.
I've revisited a few days ago and made few more observations.
- Even if I remove the RTC chip I have the same error. 6 flashes and error 83.
- If I ground pin 1 of RTC chip (to enable it) I get different error: 3 flashes and error 80 -> which I read is personality EPROM checksum error.
Any idea if these EPROMs have a specific checksum?
I see
U3 has 00
U4 has B9
U12 has 00
U15 has AC
U18 has 40
U20 has C5
Now I believe there is a serious fault, either on the PCB or in one of the PAL chips.
Anyhow, a friend is visiting the states (UTAH) and I can give him the board. Any suggestions on who might be able to check and fix it at a resonable price?
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Your board does NOT use a rechargeable battery. It has been modified to use a Li Ion battery. If you put in a rechargeable battery it will never charge.
You must clear the board after a battery replacement.
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I have installed a CR2032, but still can't pass the POST (flash) errors to get to a working state.
I get either 82, 83 or 80 as described in above posts. And these numbers come on the "credit" display.
Unfortunately original battery has corroded the PCB and this could be one of the problems despite the careful cleaning and check.
And I've cleared the RAM chips manually using an external programmer.
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You have to do the jumper option to clear the whole board, not just the RAM.
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Can you suggest somebody to look at my main board?
I tried to contact K-Lar - which is mentioned a few times in this forum but his email seems disabled.
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Ha! Larry doesn't even own a computer. Call him, he doesn't use emails. If one needs to be received or sent he uses my email addy. His number is 702-363-9998.
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I'm not in US and have no option for calling.
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I have instructed Larry to change the email on his website to my email address. His daughter, the IT expert, will make the change in the next couple of days.
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Badbaud, are you and Larry still in the business of keeping these Bally 5000+ alive? If so, I would love your expert advice and likely services to revive mine. Just purchased one from someone who tried in vien to revive one, and now I'm taking a shot at it. I was able to diagnose a failed power supply and jumper wire their replacement battery. In my excitement at the rebirth startup (wheels slowly spinning and self testing mode) I stupidly touched the unknown white and black striped power fail wire to the 24v side of the power supply. Now all I can get is error code 82. I've performed every RAM clear mode described on Google (actually get the read out CH/CL on the display), but still error code 82 in the end. I'm at wit's end, do I parts out this beautiful machine or is there hope for bringing it back from my mistake?
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I fix them all the time so call Larry next week at 702-363-9998 to send the boards in.
We have a tester for the board and the power supply.
Larry is currently hold up in the VA hospital so next week should be better.
He is the one who sets the prices for our services.
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Alan, it was good talking to you the other day and greatly appreciate the advice. I still have my radar on for the spare parts you suggested.
Just curious did you end up working on George's (the original author of this string) MPU? If so, what was the fix? I wonder if my PAL chip (U101) was damaged from my mistake. As the power fail traces through the simple logic chip (U45), I replaced, to the PAL. I just have no way of testing this or replacing it without knowing how it was originally programmed.
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Were you looking for a working I/O board? I have a whole box full of good ones if you need to purchase one?
I don't think it is the PAL chip but easy to test by swapping a PAL with a known good one.
Maybe you should send both boards, if your board is 100% tits up I can always sell you a known good one and keep your board.
A board swap lowers the price of buying a good one as I fix the bad one and put it back in stock.
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Sounds like a plan. Give me a call tomorrow to discuss the costs to see if it's within my budget for this project.
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Mr. Badbaud of KLAR Slot Machine Repair, you are the man. I was about ready to give up on this old Bally. I received the boards back from you yesterday and installed them today. This old Bally is back from the dead, thanks to you! The machine is working great and I didn't even have to reprogram the settings. Thanks for all your help in giving this old girl new life!
Caution to others replacing the power supply with the 'economical' aftermarket, leave the extra wire with no where to go (which is a power sense wire connected to sensitive MPU circuits) disconnected - just wirenut or tape that one off.
Thanks again Mr. Badbaud!
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Thank you, glad to help.