New Life Games LLC
Coin Comparitors and Other Coin acceptors => Coin Comparitors and Other Coin acceptors => Topic started by: Piney on July 24, 2017, 09:29:51 AM
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Newly obtained IGT S+.
Machine itself works well. Accepts bills Coin comparitor doesnt work.
From what I can find, one should be able to program this unit for various types of coins/tokens. The programming instructions state that one can put it in program mode with a rotary dial and as the settings are made, the LED light flashes-- Nope. The light isnt on when just in operating mode nor in programming mode.
It has a 3 pin connector on the unit itself. This connects to a wiring harness with another 3 pin connector. This side has 4 wires, two being in the center .
One suggestion I was given is that the coin system may not work if the door is open. The cable gets 24v. Is that the case on this machine so I'll need to fool the door sensors ? OR is the coin unit just dead ?
Side notes--
I can trip the optical sensor underneath with a slip of paper so I assume its OK
The case is set up for 50 cent coins/tokens. Where might one obtain acceptable tokens ?
I"d rather convert it to 25 cent but not sure its worth the trouble converting all the slots/paths/hopper parts.
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Welcome to NLG, and congratulations on getting your S+. :wave:
They are a very popular and rugged machine to own.
The X-10 should be able to be programmed for the coin you want to use with the slot machine door open. But I don't think the machine will accept the inserted coins and play normally while the door is open. Do you have another coin comparator to install into the machine and try? Or do you have another machine that you can try the X-10 in?
The X-10 has more flexibility that the ordinary CC-XX model coin comparators but it can be finicky to setup. A lot of slot machine owners don't like dealing with it and end up installing a CC-XX because on those you just insert a sample coin like a quarter and that's it.
There are some installation and setup videos on youtube about the X-10 that look helpful.
Possibly the hardest part about converting from one coin to another is the hopper. It isn't terribly difficult but you have to find and buy the coin-specific parts to swap out. So I'd figure out what coin the hopper is setup for, and if the decorative glass matches that coin, plus the coin entry slot then I'd think about leaving it and find a coin comparator that will work with that coin. If the machine is setup for half-dollar you can get some tokens that are that same physical size and use them instead of real coins if you want. US half-dollar coin is about 30.6mm or 1.2 inches. If you decide to convert it to quarter then the hopper may need changes, along with the coin entry slot, a coin comparator set for quarters, and any glass signage for appearance reasons.
People here on NLG sometimes have tokens for sale, also some slot machine and arcade places online have them. And of course you can get just about anything on ebay anymore. You can place a free WTB (Want To Buy) ad here on NLG for tokens and probably get some responses.
Or you can forgo using coins on your machine and just use paper money. However, hearing those big half-dollar coins or tokens hit the coin tray when you win can really add to the excitement of playing the machine.
Can you post a photo of your machine? That will help with other questions you might have.
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Here's a pic.
Got it from a yard sale. Folks had it in storage for a year while building new house. They got it out, said they plugged it in (after lugging it upstairs) and--nothing... Its got a little touch of water damage on the bottom pressed wood base. It looks like a bit of water dripped on it. Otherwise in good condition inside and out. It was beginning to rain so I just paid them, covered it in the bed of the truck, and headed home.
Quick inspection, a few spider webs and dust vacuumed out, reseated the main board just in case, 2 light starters and..... the magic power switch/quick reset later-- its running except for the coin part
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That's a good-looking machine! It's a good idea on any machine that is new to you to pull out the mpu board (the main logic board) and carefully look it over, make sure the battery is not leaking, that can cause severe damage to the circuit board. The battery is usually located near one corner, often it is cylinder-shaped and about 2 inches long but that can vary. They measure about 3.6 volts when new. The stuff they can leak out is very corrosive.
You probably know, but just in case, the mpu board is in the lower part of the machine not far from the hopper. It is mounted to a metal tray that has a round black knob, just pull upwards and the mpu assembly can be removed. The smaller board that the mpu plugs into is called the motherboard, it is a good idea to look it over too for water or beverage damage. The mpu is the vertical board, the motherboard is the horizontal board.
When you remove the mpu board post a photo of the 2 socketed chips that have labels on them, we can tell you more about the game software.
Located below the coin comparator are the coin optics boards. There should be a small pushbutton switch there that will let you simulate a coin getting accepted when you push it. This is called the "pseudo coin" switch.
If the bill validator (bill acceptor) does not work with some of the new-style paper money you may be able to update its internal software. We would need to see some photos of it to give suggestions. I think the $5 bill was the last one that got changed, so if your machine accepts it then it will likely accept everything $1-$100 (except $2).
(click to enlarge)
(https://s3.postimg.org/h5gwhho1v/New_IGT_S_Plus.jpg)
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"Pseudo coin " switch does activate a simulated coin acceptance.
The question remains-- how does one begin to reprogram the coin unit if it doesnt come on when in the door with the door open ? I can press the units test button (SW 1)--nothing NO LED. I can move the rotary dial to various positions and press the SW1-- nothing NO LED.
Does one have to take the unit out of the door and apply 24vAC ? That doesn't quite make sense as the cable to the unit has good 24VAC to it w/o the coin unit attached.
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Well, that's assuming your IDX-10 is a good working unit, we don't know that for certain, unless the previous owners said something about it. And even if it did work at one time the machine has been in storage for years unused, so it is possible the IDX-10 is bad. Hard to know for sure without swapping something around. But no, it does not have to be removed from the slot machine to be programmed. You should be able to set it up with the machine turned on and the main door open.
Do the instructions give any further advice on what to check? What if all of the coin programming settings on the IDX-10 are already programmed, does it say how to clear them out and start again? Since the previous owners were using half-dollars isn't the IDX-10 already programmed for that?
On the CC-XX style coin comparators the LED on the front of the unit will not come on when the door is open, only when it is closed. Maybe the IDX-10 is the same way, unless the instructions say otherwise.
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IDX instructions indicate that the LED will light when testing or operating. As the instructions are generic, no mention of device-specific use/troubleshooting. They're used in everything from slots to car washes.
As it gets 24VAC at the plug w/or w/o the main door open, it's LED should light up. Its only got 3 wires to it 24VAC , 24VAC (gnd) and it perhaps ?? a 6v pulse that it sends back to the machine (when it likes the coin I guess...). The machine will go into TILT mode if its booted and the coin unit is unplugged so I assume that the machine "sees" it as it boots. I ran the wire into the bottom area, so can get to it with the main door closed. There isnt a bottom door sensor as the machine runs with it open. Still NO LED.
I can send it into IDX for a $50 flat fee and two week turnaround. I hate to do that and then find its something else in the machine I'm missing. That seems to to be the problem--bad device.
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.....I can send it into IDX for a $50 flat fee and two week turnaround. I hate to do that and then find its something else in the machine I'm missing. That seems to to be the problem--bad device.
my 2 cents,,,,,
I would first find out what a working used CC-xx type coin comparator sells for, it may be several dollars less than the IDX fee plus shipping. I wouldn't surprised if one of the NLG parts sellers has one. The IGT S+ machine is so very common someone here will be able say what CC-xx model it uses. Since the machine works ok with paper money there is no huge hurry to solve this, I'd find out what your choices are and go from there.
Unless you are wanting to use different coins at the same time the IDX doesn't offer any advantage over the CC-xx comparators. And the CC-xx are easier to get operating. If you do use the IDX and set it up to accept different coins you will want to make sure the coins are the same physical size so you don't have any hopper coin jam problems.
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I bet Im going to need to replace the coin parts to use quarters or quarter-sized tokens. Im not having much luck finding (inexpensive) half-dollar tokens. One cant get 50 cent pieces from a bank any longer.
I' ll start collecting the parts needed-- coin slot and feed ramp parts, new glass with 25 cent signage, coin unit (CC model) and either a new hopper or the parts to mod this 50 cent sized one.
Thanks to all for the info-- Updates as they happen
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.....l'll start collecting the parts needed-- coin slot and feed ramp parts, new glass with 25 cent signage, coin unit (CC model) and either a new hopper or the parts to mod this 50 cent sized one.....
If I'm thinking correctly, your "award glass" (the top glass) may not have to get changed, since it shows how many coins you win for different spins and not the actual amount you win, so it would work ok for quarters. If so, then the only signage you'd need to change is the reel glass 50 cent insert to a 25 cent one.
Have you had a chance to pull the mpu and take a photo of your game chips?
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Piney- The CC-16D is the coin comparator used on IGT S+ machines. (Thanks Shaggy!)
Also, take a look at this other discussion thread about a similar problem. You can contact the folks in that thread to find out where to possibly get any parts you need.
http://newlifegames.com/nlg/index.php?topic=16679.msg88883#msg88883 (http://newlifegames.com/nlg/index.php?topic=16679.msg88883#msg88883)
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.....l'll start collecting the parts needed-- coin slot and feed ramp parts, new glass with 25 cent signage, coin unit (CC model) and either a new hopper or the parts to mod this 50 cent sized one.....
If I'm thinking correctly, your "award glass" (the top glass) may not have to get changed, since it shows how many coins you win for different spins and not the actual amount you win, so it would work ok for quarters. If so, then the only signage you'd need to change is the reel glass 50 cent insert to a 25 cent one.
Have you had a chance to pull the mpu and take a photo of your game chips?
I ran the test mode chip info page--
Game Type=0
Game Chip = SP1048
Reel PROM= SS3343
Is this the same info one would get off the printing on the chips ?
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There are 2 socketed eproms on your mpu board, they contain the software for your machine.
The SS3343 chip is the "Reel" chip, it is for Type 0 games, has a payback percentage of about 87.6%. This chip is specific to your game theme (Sizzling 7). The Type number determines the features present in the game.
The SP1048 is the "Game" chip, it is used in a variety of other similar game themes, controls overall operation of the machine. Here is more info about the many SP chips used in IGT S+ machines.
http://newlifegames.com/nlg/index.php?topic=303.0 (http://newlifegames.com/nlg/index.php?topic=303.0)
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I found a CC-16 mechanism.
Well-- neither the original X-10 nor the elderly CC-16 will light their LED. The CC came with its optics unit.
I switched the original optics unit . Still no LED but got a 21 error
Cleared that
Im suspicious --What's upstream of the coin system that would prevent either from working ?
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I think the CC-16 LED won't light up with the door open, so you can't go by that. Also, is it a CC-16D model? There are different models of the CC-16 for different machines and they are not all compatible/equivalent. For the IGT S+ you need a CC-16D.
Did you install a sample coin into the CC-16? If you look at the CC-16 there is a solenoid coil on the back, what color are the wires that go to it? (Gray, black, white, etc)
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I found a bad wire on the wire harness connector . It gets power now. With the door closed, it will accept a quarter and trigger a single credit.
But-- subsequent quarters dont add to the credits.
THe machine itself was set up for 50 cent pieces. Its possible that the pathways are too " loose" to properly feed a quarter. I assume that if the acceptor unit likes the quarter and passes it on through to the optical sensor, any coin that makes it that far should trigger a credit eh ? I assume the optical part is set for larger coins. Does this part of the path make a difference in triggering a credit ?
If I can get the acceptor to work, I have the hopper parts to convert it to quarters. I didnt want to go through all that if the coin system didnt work.
Is there any programming that needs to be changed ?
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Good job on finding that bad wire.
What happens to the subsequent quarters that don't add credits? Are they rejected back to the coin tray, or do they go into the hopper? If they go into the hopper but don't add a credit see below.
Underneath the CC-16D (or X-10) coin comparitor are the coin optic boards. They are 2 small circuit boards, the coin falls between them and if the optic sensor on the circuit boards sees the coin pass by then a credit is added. There is a coin spacer between the coin optic boards to direct the coin so that it passes in front of the coin optic sensor. This spacer is peculiar to the size of coin being used. Your machine probably still has the 50 cent coin spacer, you need the quarter spacer. A US quarter has a diameter of .955 inches, the quarter spacer should be close to that size. A half-dollar is about 1/4 inch larger diameter.
The coin comparitor (X-10 or CC-16D) verifies the coin or rejects it. The coin optic boards below the coin comparitor are what signals the mpu board to add a credit.
There are probably parts vendors here on NLG that can provide the correct coin spacer for your machine. This will give you an idea what it looks like, but I think this one is for nickel machines:
http://www.spininc.com/03005-0 (http://www.spininc.com/03005-0)
Here is another recent discussion thread where someone had a similar problem as you have, likely due to the wrong coin optic spacer after converting a machine to a different coin. Would probably be good for you to read thru this and maybe pickup some helpful info:
http://newlifegames.com/nlg/index.php?topic=16679.msg88901#msg88901 (http://newlifegames.com/nlg/index.php?topic=16679.msg88901#msg88901)