New Life Games LLC
General NLG Chat => Rants and Raves (SEE DESCRIPTION BEFORE ENTERING!) => Topic started by: GameKingSlots on March 17, 2016, 08:51:13 AM
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A recent transaction.
I do not know if this buyer is a member here, but I wanted to share my latest experience with a buyer. Most of the time I would not do this but this particular transaction has gotten under my skin.
Table of events
February 2016
Buyer and I decide on price for 50 machines. Buyer had to leave town and asked us to save his machines and offer for 2 weeks. We agreed.
March 2016
He return and contacted me promptly. We finished the transaction via paypal. However up to that I had told the buyer these are "AS IS" machines. Same as we received from the casino. The same way they came in our door the same you will get them to your door. We will not guarantee everything is there, but we will do our best and even added some mei 6607 bill validators. (Attached will be the exact conversation). Buyer than asked for all the parts to be there again and I said "We will TRY to make them as complete as possible." I set up shipping had a truck pick up the 13 pallets and they were on there way. 3 days later I received a text message of the guy not happy that they were missing parts with the list of parts missing. I called him immediately and told him again that these machines were sold as is. Also listed on the invoice “AS ISâ€. He then got very hostile and started talking down to me. And by the end of the convo he said he would place a paypal dispute if I did not send additional parts.
Does anyone else see the problem here. I understand that the customers always right. I understand sometimes vendors mess up. I understand sometimes there is miscommunication. But I spelled it out for this buyer from the start. Buyer is asking for wholesale prices on retail machines. I gave him a very fair deal. Which some of you here would have jumped all over I'm sure. And now I’m getting threatened with a paypal dispute. Which all of you know the paypal always tends to side with the buyer.
I've seen less and less vendors here offering to reach out to help collectors/hobbyist on this site. I wonder why that is?
What most of you don't understand is how we receive our machines. Most of the time we receive our machines from the casinos not in the greatest condition. First off you are dealing with used casino equipment, second you are dealing with electronic components. Could be working one day and the next day you come in not.
I just wanted you all to hear this from a vendors point of view. Its not always rainbows and butterflies.
Well that’s my rant.
LOVE,
Jeremy
Attached are some of our conversations
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I agree that the buyer is out of line and didn't understand the description of the machines. He probably thought that when you said AS-IS it meant they may not be working but they would have all parts like they would have if they just came off the casino floor. Maybe he didn't realize that casinos sometimes remove parts (not just the player tracking and progressive stuff) from machines they are getting rid of so they can use them on other machines. You shouldn't have to list the parts that each machine is missing but that may be needed for some buyers.
just my opinion.....
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Definately save the correspondence in case paypal calls. You just can't make some people happy though
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The issue here appears to be what is the daffynition of parts complete as possible. That's a bad description, left up to the buyer and seller to mutually agree upon what is missing, if not good luck with a sale like that.
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Thanks for the response so far guys.
However, never in our dialogue did i ever say parts complete. I always said "AS IS"COULD BE MISSING PARTS" "WILL NOT GUARANTEE ALL THE PARTS WILL BE THERE." Not sure how you can misinterpreted that.
Check attachment.
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Hey, if it says "AS-IS" and there are "parts missing" like you told the buyer in your e-mail, then that's the way it is. Don't you guys just love the buyers that want a perfectly working machine that is 6 months old, filled with $500.00 worth of quarters and they are willing to pay you $25 for the machine. That's a little exaggerated, but I had a guy look at a completely working Alpha I had and he offered me $275.00 if I left the $40 that was in the cash box. Needless to say it turned out to be a "NO SALE" !
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Obviously there is a misinterpretation. The operative words are parts complete as possible in your last message you said you would do as you posted here, with a completely different interpretation by the seller and buyer. To me, that really doesn't tell me much about what will be missing and what my expectation would be when I receive them if I were the buyer.
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This is pretty much a prime example as to why I've stopped with the wholesale altogether... Not a lot of money to be made in the first place unless you're wholeselling high end games. Now Id just rather part the machines out rather than maybe make an extra $5-$10 and listen to how bad the machines are, and how nothing works. Most buyers dont understand how this stuff comes in.
As always love to all NLG family
Chris
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He bought them sight unseen I'm guessing? Personally, when you said "We will TRY and make them complete as possible" (or however you worded it exactly), as a buyer (without history with you), I would assume they are being sold AS IS, and I get what I get. I would not expect you to invest more time, energy, or parts into games that you are selling cheap (just to move for room or whatever).
If you're invoice says AS IS, and he paid based on that invoice, that's the binding issue in PayPal's eyes.
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And it's 50 machines at wholesale, unreasonable to even as you to go through them and make sure they are parts complete in my opinion. Hell, I can't even sell a barcrest in mear mint condition at wholesale price because they see the shipping and want a better deal to cover it, lol. I have myself talked into not selling East of the Mississippi anymore cause it'll only cost me headaches to set it up and either lost money or no sale. I'll keep them or sell locally, I don't need the money, I'd just like the room...
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Hey, I'm East of the Mississippi, BUT :agreepost:
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Thanks Denny, it definately helps me see things from the brown grass on the other side of the fence better though:)
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Well folks if Jeremy would have been even a little bit honest this would have never happened. I was very clear in what I wanted. I had to have complete dbv,s with all the harnesses and bezels including the adapter. I even sent him pics so there would be no confusion. Jeremy did tell me that all the machines would not have ticket printers maybe 15 he said. I said that will be ok as long as the face plate is there. This deal went on for over a month with a 100 or so phone calls and texts. He seems to think that his 1 text trumps all the conversation and negotiations. I have dealt with many other dealers and I will never deal with gameking or Jeremy again. I suggest that anyone thinking of buying from him to go and pick them up and inspect and never buy sight unseen. After I opened the first few pallets and saw that the dbv's were not complete or missing I sent him a text. All went down hill from there he has a terrible memory of all the conversations that we had. If he would have been honest and told me that the dbv's were going to be missing and the harnesses would be incomplete I would have renegotiated the price or passed altogether, but he didnt tell me and I figured he was referring to ticket printers not being there. He promised me the world until he got my money. He says he is going to get me the bezels and adapters, he wanted me to pay half though, but too bad on all the missing dbv's, monitor, ticket bezels etc. I hope you now get the real picture as I feel I am out a couple thousand dollars because of his dishonesty.
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This is why I did not post to this earlier. I figured the Buyer would chime up. Now we can hear from both sides. Thank you for posting and I know you probably would wished not to. Things like this upset the buyer and the seller so I can relate to that. Hopefully there will be some resolve in a diplomatic order.
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when they came from casino I bet they had dbv ,s which were pull and sold , we have never got slot right from the casino missing them , why would anyone buy them missing them uba,s are worth more the the slots sometimes just my 2 cents
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Yes, I agree. Many do this-pull the bv's and printers if they are good stuff. Then they usually put junk in them if they sell as a "parts complete" or scrap them out. The scrap them out is going more than the latter these days. I assume this must have been a bunch of alpha's by the bv#. I also would put real $ on that there is another involved and I think I know who. Who knows, The buyer may have paid nearly nothing for those 50 machines and the shipping was his biggest expense.
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You guys can bet and speculate all you want. You did not buy these particular loads. You guys don't know the crap vendors get from casinos obviously. And your right Barry, Scott did get a great deal.
Scott everytime you asked you got the same answer. You could have ask 20 different ways and you would have got the same answer. We continually told you that these machines were sold as is, how we recieved them from the casino, and how there would be parts missing. You agreed and paid the invoice. The invoice attached even says as is. I'm sorry you were confused and didnt understand. But really it could have not gotten any clearer.
Thank you for all that voiced there opinion. I will leave it at this.
Thanks
Jeremy
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I would like to clarify a few things. Vendors do not buy squat from casinos unless it is tribal or a ho-bunk rig. You have to be a broker, make your bid on the manifest and high bidder wins unless they back out. A broker license is very expensive-You do not have one. Most of the time unless completely overloaded the major vendors sell overseas and to the big state of TEXAS to support their parlors. Brokers buy all these machines for vendors. Here is where the majority of sheet generates from- Ohians, Californians, Virginians, and Floridians -then texas as it is just a dump point. Many machines come out so they have to go somewhere even if they are parted out etc. I am not here to mediate this topic/beef towards You or the Buyer. I will not sling stones at either.
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I would like to add my two cents here..I have known Scott the buyer for many years...he is very honest..a straight shooter...we discussed this deal and based on my one deal with this seller which had a similar outcome I was skeptical...I was with Scott on a few occasions when he was on the phone with the seller...trust me Scott crossed all the T's and dotted all the I's with this deal verbally....bottom line the BUYER is a good person to deal with. Don't fear doing business with him. Bob
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Like idesign said earlier, it looks like an unfortunate situation where one person's idea of parts complete as possible was not the same as the other person.
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Curious.... Were PICTURES not exchanged on what was being bought and sold??
Over 2 decades of on-line, 4 and 5 digit sales (sometimes only conversing via text on a computer screen), But NEVER were pictures not sent to let the buyer know EXACTLY what they were getting. We even started taking videos of games being played prior to shipment to prove machines worked before leaving our shop.
It seems photos (with doors open) of what was being sold/bought would have avoided this unfortunate situation.
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I have to put my 5 cents in. Never bought from seller. Scott is a fair & honest guy. A few years ago when I ran out of room I sold Scott a bunch of stuff & he was a straight shooter. Not taking sides, just saying Scott is OK.
Ford
PS. If BV & HARNESS are missing in my opinion someone removed after leaving casino.
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Thanks for all the kind words guys!!!! I just want to give an update on what has transpired over the last couple of days on this situation. Jeremy promised me parts to replace some of the missing stuff. He was going to get me the mei bezels and the harness adapters so he said. Well then he had to post a rant here and I had to respond to tell my side which is nowhere near what his story is. Well because I said he is dishonest in my post he will no longer be replacing some of the part. How much nicer can you describe a f****** liar, I thought I was pretty nice about this. Anyway I did forget to mention that 9 machines of the 50 did come with complete dbv so with my math thats 18% and when and where I went to school thats an F. Doesnt seem like there was much effort to make them complete. I did make another deal with a great person and told him the same that I told Jeremy, THEY MUST HAVE COMPLETE DBV, no exceptions. Guess what they all came with complete dbv's. So this tells me that I must not be the issue as I do understand the English language. Thanks for starting this post Jeremy!!!!
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Look at the posters here, I can attest and back all except one. I have dealt with all that posted in this thread. Some Think they know it all. And on that I drop the mike -Peace out.
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I have said enough. Please look at the complete dialog attached and you can voice your own opinion. I continually said the same thing over and over again and buyer still decided to go through. I am done with this on this for such a small amount of money. Some people here are out for blood.
Please look at the time stamps. I have never lied or decieve customer at anytime. Btw offered a full refund to customer once machines are returned.
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I have purchased about 20 machines from Jeremy and have found him to be an honest, fair, dealer. Everything he has sold me has been as he said it would be. I feel he has gone above what was expected to make sure I was happy after every sale.
Just my two cents.
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Great post---AND look at your location!--FLORIDA , You probably knew exactly what you were getting.
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I get what I order every time. I don't think being if Florida has anything to do with it!
But I guess some just want to bash.
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All pm's etc. will and can be submitted-any here say yea or nay. -Rant's topic here but I have a feeling it's going to the upper "officials".
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As I said in my first post: Just my two cents
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:I_agree_1: :24:
Great post---AND look at your location!--FLORIDA , You probably knew exactly what you were getting.