New Life Games LLC
**Reel Slots** Gaming Machines => Bally Electromechanical => Topic started by: Phan000 on September 10, 2020, 10:22:28 AM
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Greetings,
I got a beautiful 809-N at an estate sale. No keys, did not turn on when plugged in. It was a gamble.
(https://i.imgur.com/EBtK18m.jpeg)
Turns out, everything is in nice shape, and worked pretty well after I drilled out the lock. It plays and pays, center reel spins a little slower than the others.
The first issue that I noticed is a clicking/grinding noise in the reel mech.
Sounds link it's coming from the lower back of the reels. Ill post a video of the sound here as well as a couple of photos. Obviously this machine needs some lube a cleaning, but does anyone have a though on this specific grinding noise?
(https://i.imgur.com/NMgRdiA.jpeg)
(https://i.imgur.com/qqLJVeC.jpeg)
(https://i.imgur.com/WtiZVQg.jpeg)
Here are the videos
https://youtu.be/MwPKEW1q57Y (https://youtu.be/MwPKEW1q57Y)
https://youtu.be/_-aaWCWH_Hw (https://youtu.be/_-aaWCWH_Hw)
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I took the reel mech out, tried to clean and lube. I also cleaned and lubed the wiper boards.
The chattering noise seems to have away.
The middle reel still seems sluggish compared to the outer two and will occasionally stop spinning after the third reel.
What is the best way to address this?
Also the hopper overflow is intermittently buzzing. Is there a way to fix this, short of clipping the wire?
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The middle reel still seems sluggish compared to the outer two and will occasionally stop spinning after the third reel.
What is the best way to address this?
Sounds like thhe index lever is sticking on the shaft. Pretty common case of old lube gumming things up. Spray some cleaner on the shaft and work the arm back and forth to free make sure it moves freely on the shaft.
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hopper overflow = coin diverter (the thing changing where the inserted coin goes)?
buzzing coils are usually caused by wear in the armature plate and/or the coil top. If the armature plate has dimples worn in, you can try whacking it with a hammer to smooth them out. Rarely works, but when it does it's satisfying.
The coil number should be an FE-33-2600. There may be an old coil number on the thing someplace which may be easier to find, or the slot parts guys probably know what to supply. Like this:
https://www.ebay.com/itm/Pinball-Coil-FE33-2600-Bally-NOS-Solenoid-Flipper-FREE-SHIPPING/174404725208 (https://www.ebay.com/itm/Pinball-Coil-FE33-2600-Bally-NOS-Solenoid-Flipper-FREE-SHIPPING/174404725208)
other options include running an emory board (fingernail file) or similar between armature and coil top while holding the armature down, sticking electrical tape on the coil top, and earplugs.
you've got an odd machine.
The 809's were 20 stop 5 coin multipliers - yours has been modified to only take three coins. Looks like a conversion to a 22 stop 1090 model ... especially since 1090 is stamped on the reel 1 index disc and that disc doesn't look like an original bally one :-)
the 809-N originally was a "lightning" model for kelley's nugget casino. The lightning models were jackpot only, with only 7, 5-bar and bar symbols.
if you get a chance to take pictures of the lamp panel behind the top glass, the wiring side of the reel wiper boards and the payout counter disc, that'd be interesting to see.
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I have found that by sanding the grooves made by the coil into the armature to a smooth, flat condition that will quiet the noise. also electrical tape will help.
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It appears the ratchet wheel mechanism is dragging on the blue spring.
This also may be causing the reel mechanism to malfunction.
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Thanks for the suggestions. What is the best cleaner/lube for the reel mechanism? Also, what should I use on the switches?
I am considering trying to clean the reel strips in place with just a light water/soap solution. They are pretty faded, but I’d hate to wreck them.
The vertical fluorescent bulbs behind the “all jackpots paid by machine†and the “play one to three coinsâ€, are burned out.
The numbers on them are illegible. They seem just under 6†long. Any idea the size, or where to source these? I’ve attached a photo.
(https://i.imgur.com/vmzfIir.jpg)
(https://i.imgur.com/KJJFfzf.jpg)
(https://imgur.com/gallery/bVYMKfQ)
(https://i.imgur.com/Er3A9Fg.jpg)
(https://i.imgur.com/86cxq9D.jpg)
(https://i.imgur.com/jlfocGJ.jpg)
(https://i.imgur.com/Ntaq3Nk.jpg)
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If the reel strips have tar, nicotine and oily grime on them.
Soap and water might clean them. I’ve used automotive cream wax/cleaner and it works well.
Best to test a small portion first when cleaning and be careful of the metal crimped edge, it is sharp.
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After carefully looking at the symbols on the reel strips, I was wondering if they are paper with the symbols stuck on as decals. I have seen reel strips like that. If they are paper with decals I caution about using too much liquid to clean. If they are plastic with the symbols embedded in then then there is no problem.
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Lamp F4T5 Cool white
Lamp excluding the pins is 5.25 inches.
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What is the best cleaner/lube for the reel mechanism? Also, what should I use on the switches?
Check the sitcky "Link to OldReno's Troubleshooting Tips" at the top of this forum topic. There is a LOAD of useful information there. Specifically, this post addresses the reel mechanism. http://newlifegames.net/nlg/index.php?PHPSESSID=41f332193115885d8d14ac18b57bd44f&topic=19336.0 (http://newlifegames.net/nlg/index.php?PHPSESSID=41f332193115885d8d14ac18b57bd44f&topic=19336.0)
Light sewing machine oil with a needle point applicator for metal on metal and bearing surfaces. By switches I'm assuming you're referring to the blade switch contacts? They are cleaned with isopropyl alcohol and possibly a Flexstone (if that doesn't do it). They must be dry, there is no lubricant. OldReno mentions a light application of oil to the wiper board buttons but I use a very light coating of PBR contact grease on my EM machines. Flexstones and contact grease (along with a bunch of other useful stuff) are available from http://www.pbresource.com (http://www.pbresource.com).
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Thanks for all the helpful advice. Did a lot of lube and cleaning this weekend. Running much more smoothly. The chattering noise returned & turned out it was coming from the hopper gears. Cleaned and lubed, and the noise abated.
I still cant get rid of the buzzing from the coin diverter, even with sanding and electrical tape. I will be replacing that coil.
Yesterday I replaced the two vertical florescent tubes. The left one went in easy, worked great. The right one was hard to get in, but did light up.... for a minute. Two minutes later the ballast smoked.
I have an old ballast, that is pretty similar, but has slightly different amperage. Can this be used as a replacement, or should I try to source an exact duplicate?
original
(https://i.imgur.com/aJ8cJmh.jpeg)
Replacement??
(https://i.imgur.com/5UbYNgC.jpeg)
Another thing I noticed, is that the 3rd reel seldom lines up with the payline. It always seems slightly off. Is there a way to adjust this?
(https://i.imgur.com/aHle5xE.jpeg)
Thanks in advance- John
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the F4T5 is a 4 watt lamp, so your replacement ballast should be fine.
if nothing is frozen up on the reel 3 indexing arm and the arm is going all the way into the slots on the index disc, I think your only option is to move the tape on the reel tin. If the arm is frozen, you'd probably see differing alignment depending on the symbol (slot depth in the index disc).
you could try loosening the screws that attach the tin and the index disc to the hub and see if there's enough slop in the screw holes to alter the alignment.
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Thanks for the tip Wolf, I loosened & adjusted the 3rd reel. Lines up perfectly now.
My spare ballast was no good. Any thoughts on where to buy another?
The main problem noise has returned & it's definitely coming from the hopper. I thought it was a mechanical sound, but it may be electrical. The top finger of a switch has a tip broken off. There is a ton of electrical arcing as seen in the video attached.
How do I source a replacement for this part, and does it make sense that it would be the cause of this noise?
https://youtu.be/9ttWOTdA1ms (https://youtu.be/9ttWOTdA1ms)
(https://i.imgur.com/VYrTa9K.jpg)
(https://i.imgur.com/q8nl9sz.jpg)
(https://i.imgur.com/DDcxL1C.jpg)
(https://i.imgur.com/p0mbx3n.jpg)
(https://i.imgur.com/7Ktr8BB.jpg)
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are you sure the ballast is bad and not the starter?
the ballasts are pretty generic and the slot parts guys should have them. However, I'd be inclined to toss the ballast and use a LED replacement tube - you have to get rid of the ballast for those anyway, and they are probably cheaper than a ballast.
the short switch blade isn't really a problem. It's unlikely the blade will slip off the peg when the payout counter steps up, but you can push down the solenoid plunger and make sure. If you want to replace the blade, it's a standard pinball part. I probably have lots of used ones that would work fine.
the arcing you need to fix! Do you know which switch is doing it so you can clean and adjust the thing?
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I think I have isolated the arcing from this hopper switch.
It appears to be missing one of the blades, but I'm not positive how it is supposed to look.
Any repair/ source suggestions would be greatly appreciated.
Also, if you happen to have a photo of how the functioning switch should look, that would definitely help.
(https://i.imgur.com/BX0fSeH.jpg)
(https://i.imgur.com/2pxPOcY.jpg)
(https://i.imgur.com/UNndAqn.jpg)
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It appears to be missing one of the blades, but I'm not positive how it is supposed to look.
yup. There should be a long, flat (no contact) blade there. The plastic disc on the reset arm pushes that blade, which pushes the two with the white cylindrical spacers to open those two switches.
sounds like the disc may be pushing the spacers directly, but not enough to open the switches.
swiped below pic from an ebay listing for a payout counter. If nobody volunteers the pieces in the next couple days, I'll see what I can scrounge up. The $50 for then entire unit on ebay is kinda overkill for what you need.
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found a switch stack with the piece you need. PM or email me your mailing address to slotpics@cdyn.com and I'll send it to you. I'll dig around for a step-up arm switch blade too ... should have something off a bingo machine that may work.
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Pm sent, thanks Wolf!
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While messing with the Florescent lights, I ended up causing a short & burning up the coin lockout coil.
Does someone happen to know the number of the coil?
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Where is that coil located?
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the one behind the coin mech is E-101-58A per the bally 400 manual, newer number is M-37-2700 per the 2400 manual.
grab manuals from http://bingo.cdyn.com/slots/bally_manuals/ (http://bingo.cdyn.com/slots/bally_manuals/) ... there's exploded parts diagrams in them with part numbers.
you can prevent the armature tab from poking into the coin mech until the coil is replaced. The game will keep coins if you drop them in before the game is ready to accept them, so that's the game to steer your friends to if you are letting them play with their money and keep any winnings :-)
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Thanks to Wolf, this machine is working almost perfectly again.
No more arcing, pretty much paying properly. I replaced the ruined jackpot bell and now has great sounds!
Only issues now- skips payment on a few combinations of wins. Most do work.
Coins get hung often in the slide to the coin mech, and in the coin mech itself. Typically a Fonzee style bang on the machine will get them to drop.
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The skip payouts could be dirty contacts on the wiper boards.
Clean inside all the parts prior to the coin mechanism itself.
Use compressed air on the coin mechanism and check for any moving parts that might be dragging.
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per david's post, clean the wiper board rivets with alcohol and green scrub pad or similar non-abrasive. Anything that doesn't scratch the surface is fine.
if still have problems, the easiest thing is yank the reel mech and using the schematic and an ohmeter, verify almost zero ohms thru the reels by probing the appropriate pins on the beau plugs. However, you don't have an 809-N anymore, so the trick will be to figure out what version of the 1090 the game has been converted to. I'd guess from the reel strip symbols in your pics it's the base model 1090.
you can find the docs for that game at http://bingo.cdyn.com/slots/1090 (http://bingo.cdyn.com/slots/1090). The 1090 used molex plugs and your game probably has the older jones plugs, but for payout you only care about the reel mech beau plugs and hopper beau plug.
to check the reels with an ohmeter, you'd put one probe on the plug pin for wire 90 and the other probe on the appropriate pin for the win on the wire that goes to the payout counter ... e.g. wire 23 for bars, wire 41 for plums, etc. If you don't see almost zero ohms, push down on/wiggle the reel wipers fingers onto the contact plates to look for poor connections.
there's no guarantee the conversion is wired exactly like the 1090 would be. Wire colors and the locations on the plugs could be different. The way to tell for sure is:
- look at the wire color attached to the payout counter trace for the pay you want
- see where that wire goes on the hopper beau plug
- yank the hopper and reel mech. Use an ohmeter/continuity tester/buzzer with one probe in the female hopper socket at pin position you just determined. Probe the female reel mech socket to find the other end of that wire from the hopper socket.
- you can look at the wire color attached to the reel mech pin at the found position or just stick your probe on that pin and the other probe on wire 90 ... after you make sure you know where wire 90 or it's equivalent ...
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Right Wolftalk,
The 90 wire gray should have continuity on every payout coming out of the left wiper board.
Another low tech test it to nudge the reels when they land on a pay and nothing happens.
If the machine starts to pay, one of three things.
Dirty contacts, wiper blade bent or the wiper blade arm needs adjustment.
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Cleaned wiper contacts. Paying properly now.
Coins still sticking on occasion, but 99% machine is back in business.
Thanks for all the help and on to the next project!
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coins sticking in the mech or the chute down to it? Sticking is usually just accumulated crud in the coin path that needs a solvent like alcohol or acetone to remove.
got another mech to swap in?
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The coins stick in the chute & in the coin mech. I swapped coin
Mech & Still has issues.
Probably need to get aggressive with some acetone.
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Where exactly are the coins sticking?
If they don’t travel fast enough the coin won’t rock the cradle. If they go to fast the coins returns to the tray.
The magnetic sensor helps control the speed.
Magnetic sensor could be to close. There’s an adjustment screw for fine tuning the magnet.
Make note of the present adjusting screw position, then turn it in 1/8 to 1/4 turn.
Clean the interior of the coin chute. Apply a small amount of silicone lubricant, then wipe dry.
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the manufacturer has manuals online for the coin mechs:
Welcome to Coin Mechanisms (coinmech.com) (https://www.coinmech.com/products.cfm?parent_id=521)
there's adjustment, maintenance and theory of ops information.
suggest dealing with coins sticking in the chute first. As david said, the speed the coin enters the top of the mech can change what happens in the mech.
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I cleaned the chute and the coin mech. I also made a small adjustment on the magnet screw.
Ran 100 or so coins through, no issues. Seems much better, thanks.