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**Reel Slots** Gaming Machines => Bally Electromechanical => Topic started by: hemiroid on August 23, 2017, 11:21:09 AM
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My first EM slot machine. 5 line quarter machine.
Said to be a good working machine before it got put away. Sat in a storage locker for a very short period of time before I acquired it.
The hopper was difficult to remove for the trip home. It finally let loose and now goes in and out easy. Hopper went in the front seat and the rest of the machine did have to lay on its backside for the 30 minute trip home. I got it home and dumped a roll of quarters in the hopper. Plugged it in, lights went on, it made some humming noise, I have never been with a EM machine before so I'm not sure what normal is.
Dropped a quarter in the slot and pulled the handle/arm and all worked as expected. Dropped in 2 quarters and pulled the handle/arm and again all worked as expected. Dropped in 3 quarters and pulled the handle/arm and it started paying out like I was a winner.
Hmmm...
3 lines and all I should have won was what, 2 quarters for the cherries?
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Well, the hopper paid out the whole roll of quarters and kept spinning like it needed more...
So I turned off the machine and pulled the hopper and I don't know what I am looking for/at? I had $50 worth of quarters and filled the hopper and plugged it back in. The machine spit out every quarter. I did this 3 or 4 more times with the same results. The hopper does not quit spinning and anything in the hopper pays out.
Now why can't this happen to me in the casino?
So...
I did some searching and reading on NLG for a fix. There is a lot of stuff about bad fingers and wheels and lube this or that, butt. I guess I'd like to start with any suggestions for a quick fix to get me over the payout/hopper issue so I can continue to check this new toy out or am I destined to do some major surgery here?
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more pics...
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Newbie myself but I have the $.05 version of this same Bally machine.
Mine has a different hopper from yours but,.. There should be a coin counter roller on the top of the hopper that connects to a payout counter mechanism. Each coin paid should pass under that and trigger the stepper below. Is that working? I can step it manually (with the hopper out) on my machine.
Also you mentioned that the hopper was difficult to remove. Are the Beau plugs in the back of the cabinet possibly cracked/distorted?
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Will post a photo of the payout step up unit and payout relay later on today.
The step up unit controls the amount of coins out.
Also stops the hopper when the correct amount is paid.
If it is working properly then I would check the coin payout relay.
Both mentioned are located on the hopper.
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here is a basic operation of the payout circuit. when a winning combo is detected through the reel switches (back of reel unit),it puts a ground on the wiper fingers of the hopper step up counter board (side of your hopper), this energizes the payout relay, this action will start the hopper motor, as the hopper turns the coins will come to the top of the hopper, they will push up on the roller which in turn will cause the step up unit to count up one position (either mechanically or electrically, depending on which hopper you have). as more coins are dispensed the unit will continue to count up moving the wiper fingers on the hopper board until the fingers move off the payline trace that activated by the winning combo. this will de-energize the payout relay which in turn will stop the hopper motor from turning.
hint for working on multi line EM machines. get the machine working on a single coin first before worrying about additional coins. the single coin circuits have to be working properly before additional coins could be considered.
as a side note, if all the circuits were working as they should, your machine should have gone "dead" before all the coins were paid out. there is a timer (back left corner of machine) has a push bar that runs under the hopper, has a red neon glow light on it, when the hopper turns on and the counting begins it keeps resetting this timer, if the timer never gets reset, then it will time out and remove power from the machine, thus saving the casino from losing all it s money. so the fact that your machine did not go dead, means your step up counter is not pulsing the time out timer.
hope this helps
Jim
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Great advice Jim,
Jim, do you think the Payout relay could be involved as it supplies power to the hopper motor.
Step up and payout relay photos attached.
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Thank you all for your input!
So I pulled the hopper and set it on the table to look at it. I moved the lever circled in yellow to see what it did. I noticed it was suppose to make contact with the white gear also circled in yellow but nothing was happening. The gear did not look damaged to me?
I noticed when I pulled the lever up it rotated the gear which in turn rotated the finger board on the side of the hopper. It seemed to pick a spot to stop and I put the hopper back in the cabinet to see what would happen.
The hopper did quit spinning...
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Now it will only take one quarter at a time. Insert any more and they just drop through. Everything seems to be lit up like I am playing 5 quarters.
I can play the slot on one quarter but I'm not sure what line is being played if any line at all? Unless my luck is really that bad it does not pay out at all?
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It looks to me that your spiral cam and 100 tooth gear have possibly maxed out how far they will turn. Your return spring is in a coil bind. You need to manually reset your gear and cam. There is a solenoid located behind the wiper board down low. Push that plunge in to release the 100 tooth gear, but I would try to put my finger on the spiral cam to keep it from snapping back to zero and possibly breaking the stop on the spiral cam.. I would make sure the beau plug contacts are clean and removed of tarnish.
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Thank you all for the good advice!
I found a post on the old site, more like a "how to" guide from Old Reno on How to fix/check [Y]our new machine that is full of pictures. Part 3 is all about the hopper. I need to take some time and sit down with my hopper, his guide and your advice to see if I can make some more headway.
I got the machine to play for me. I can play ONE quarter, any more and they just drop through. Needless to say I don't know what line is being played since everything lights up except for line 2. Bad bulb? I don't know yet. I have got a few small pays but I don't see a line that should have gotten a pay?
Every so often after the reels are done spinning I get a loud HUM? Nothing happens. If I drop in another quarter the hum stops and I can play that quarter.
If I manually turned the hopper did I throw off the timing of the machine? Are these EM machines that fragile? I guess I got a lot to learn. I'm going to spend some time with Old Reno's How To guide and I'll be back...
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Re the loud Hum, could be the hopper is jammed by a coin or something else like a small screw.
Next time it happens remove the hopper thus cutting power to the hopper. If the hum continues, this would eliminate the hopper.
BUT before reinstalling the hopper, check to see if it will spin freely. Do this by turning one of the drive gears in the direction that would turn the hopper in the right direction.
IF the hum stops when pulling the hopper. It doesn't necessary mean the hopper is at fault.
As this also cuts power to other parts of the machine.
In summary, check the hopper for jamming.
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A couple of things you can do to make working on the machine easier.
You can simulate coins being dropped into the machine by depressing the coin in switch.
Also you can set the reels on a winning combination by stopping the clock then manually move the reels on a payout.
Then let the clock go to finish its cycle.
Photos of clock and switch attached.
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The hum is the deflector plate solenoid below the coin switch.
It turns off then the add coin light goes out.
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I believe the loud hum could be the coin diverter under the coin mech buzzing, or the scavenger coil behind the coin mech..
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I do get a hum from the relay below the coin mechanism that corresponds to either the payout or coin accepted light. [I'll have to pay better attention as to which]
There is a worse/louder buzz that seems to come from the top/light box or the behind the reels up high I need to track down. It might have to do with my cabinet being lit up for 5 coins even thought it will only accept one coin. The noise/buzz is not consistent, it is not making the noise all the time.
I removed the top light assembly and just by being nosy found that there are 2 relays that step up and down a gear with the coins being played. For some reason the reset relay is not working or not getting a signal to step down to one or no coins. [could that be the louder noise?] If I manually press down on the relay it will allow the gear to reset. Then for every coin I play the other relay will step up the gear to the max of 5 coins. If I do not manually reset the upper relay all I can play is one coin and then any additional coins I try to play just fall through and do not register.
I thought I had an electrical issue because one of the lights for playing a second coin was lit when it was not suppose to be. Turns out it is not electrical, it is cosmetic. There is a wooden wedge [I don't know what else to call it] between lamps missing/broken and gone. I never thought I'd be using any woodworking tools to repair a slot machine!
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Back to the original problem with the hopper...
Is the spiral cam suppose to have some spring tension on it?
I can release the 100 tooth gear and the spiral cam will make 2 1/4 rotations. At first it seemed tight. After I have turned it a few times it seems to be loosening up and it seems to have a little bit of spring tension to it.
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Where do I set that spiral cam or does it have a neutral/default position?
It was set all the way to the right. I set it all the way to the left. I am playing only one coin. When I got what I thought would be a winning spin I got NO payout.
Shouldn't these spins be winning spins playing one coin?
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So I set the spiral cam to a midpoint, about 1 turn and a little bit. I hit 2 cherries and got a 5 coin payout. Sweet!
After that one payout nothing else pays. I even hit a BAR-BAR-BAR and nothing?
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The spiral cam should have enough spring tension to return to the stop switch. The switch is located just left of the center on the mechanism. The cam returns in a clockwise direction.
When it steps up it moves counter clockwise.
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Do you have a Bally EM slot machine manual. The first thing your machine is going to. Red is a good basic cleaning of the contacts and beau plug for the hopper, reels and top feature unit. Those plugs tarnish and loose there connections causing the machines not to function. I would go to the down load section and down load a PDF manual and do some reading. There is a lot of very basic, but very helpful information in the manual on how these machines work.
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Hemiroid:
Welcome to the forum and congratulations on your Bally 873. WHEN working they are lots of fun to play. Reportedly they have the most frequent pays of any of the old bally EM games. I have 2 and they are the favorites of my guests in my game room. If you are going to get a few of these machines, and you will, (obviously already bitten by the EM bug)then I would suggest you get a set of cables so that you can operate the hopper, reel mech, and even multiplier unit out of the cabinet. There is a member here, I believe his name is Jim, who makes an EXCELLENT set of cables.
I have a folding work horse that I set the components on when I have problems. The cables are about 6 feet long so you can see the whole component operate in real time.
I have never experienced a runaway hopper that was not related to the timer, which it seems that you have already checked so I dont have any specifics on your problem. Please keep up posted.
My opinion is free and worth every penny.
Ra