Big Win 1019-1 pay problems

[tuna]

When I bought the machine nothing worked, lots of parts missing and many wires going to wrong beau plugs.  Cherry's thru Bell's pay correct, also on  multiple coins. 

No pay on Melons, Bars or 7's.  I have continuity between the correct wiper wires on the reels per the schematic.  Continuity From the reels to the hopper 100 pay disk via the 56 wire for melons.  If a manually hold the payout relay coil in they will pay on melons, bars and 7's.  I know I'm missing something reading the schematic just don't know what it is. 

If anyone knows where I might find the chrome trim piece that goes behind the coin tray, I'd be most grateful.  Have checked the usual places to no avail.

Not sure how to rotate the pics.

[DavidLee]

What is the approximate width of the plate.
Might have one that will fit the machine.

[wolftalk]

where are you putting the probes for continuity/resistance check?

the single point of failure that would affect melons, bars and 7's - assuming nothing wrong with the wire 90 rivet connections on reel 1 - is bad wiper<-> rivet contact on the third set of fingers on the reel 1 wiper board. 

if ya get a chance to email highest possible resolution photos of machine to slotpics@cdyn.com, I'll add them to the https://bingo.cdyn.com/slots/1019-1/ info.  I also just uploaded the correct reel wiper wiring diagram there.

[tuna]

David the trim plate I need is 21"x 3 1/4" approximately.


Wolftalk I placed my probe on the rivets of the wipers, also on the wipers themself.  I do have continuity between 56-1 and 47 (schematic shows it as 48, pen and ink change) that you highlighted for melons.  My reel checks,
Reel 1 to 2 wire 18-2
       1 to 3        48
       1 to 2        54-1
       2 to 3        65-1
       2 to 3        35-7

[DavidLee]

Okay, I’ll take a look for the plate.

Also on the no pay on the 777 melons, seems to be at the payout relay.
As you described it works when you manually depress the coil armature.
I would assume there’s an open between the 1st wiper board and the coil pertaining
to the 3 payouts.

[wolftalk]

wire 45 -> 18-2 -> ... is the 6V bell circuit.  You want the 50V circuit that is wire 90 -> to the payout relay coil.   The circuit goes from 90 -> reel 1 (54-1) -> reel 2 (65-1) -> reel 3 (48) -> reel 1 (56-1)

looks like the reel wiper wiring diagram doesn't match the revised schem.  The melon wire between reel 1 and 2 is 54-1 on the schem and 53-2 on the reel wiper diagram.  You'll need to see what wire color you have connected to the lug.  Likewise, the schem says 48 and the wiper diagram says 47.  Is the wire green/orange or green/black?

if you're just poking the wire ends/rivets between boards, that's not testing the most likely problem - the wiper <-> rivet connections.

might as well test end-to-end ... at least on the reel mech.  Ordinarily on games with no diodes in the circuit you'd want one probe on the reel wiper board and the other on the payout trace on the payout counter.   In this case, you know that bells paid 100, so the wire 56-1 connection from the reel mech to the payout counter is ok ... or was if plug connections are flaky.

pull out the reel mech and put one probe on wire 90 on the reel 1 wiper board wire lug, put the other probe on 56-1 on reel 5 wiper board lug.

Better (but more hassle to find) is connect to 56-1 on pin 9 on the reel mech plug ... and wire 90 on pin 16 of the same plug.

rather than continuity, look for almost zero ohms when you have the melon win that pays 100.

in general, continuity testing is not reliable.  You have to ensure the only possible path between your meter probes is the path you want to check.  A round-about circuit path thru lamps, transformer, coils, etc. can show continuity, but it's a false positive.

measuring resistance is better as you can distinguish between almost zero ohms (good) and more than a couple ohms (not good).

the best test is measuring voltage WHEN current is/should be flowing (the circuit should be closed).  Stick a meter probe on wire 70 and another probe on 56-1 when there's a winner.  If you don't see 50VAC, move the probe from 56-1 "up" the circuit until you find where the voltage jumps up to 50V.  The spot it falls from 50V to whatever - typically in the 20's - is the problem.

[tuna]

wire 45 -> 18-2 -> ... is the 6V bell circuit.  You want the 50V circuit that is wire 90 -> to the payout relay coil.   The circuit goes from 90 -> reel 1 (54-1) -> reel 2 (65-1) -> reel 3 (48) -> reel 1 (56-1)

looks like the reel wiper wiring diagram doesn't match the revised schem.  The melon wire between reel 1 and 2 is 54-1 on the schem and 53-2 on the reel wiper diagram.  You'll need to see what wire color you have connected to the lug.  Likewise, the schem says 48 and the wiper diagram says 47.  Is the wire green/orange or green/black?

A.Have both 47 and 48 wires between 1-2 reels no continuity on either.

if you're just poking the wire ends/rivets between boards, that's not testing the most likely problem - the wiper <-> rivet connections.

might as well test end-to-end ... at least on the reel mech.  Ordinarily on games with no diodes in the circuit you'd want one probe on the reel wiper board and the other on the payout trace on the payout counter.   In this case, you know that bells paid 100, so the wire 56-1 connection from the reel mech to the payout counter is ok ... or was if plug connections are flaky.
Checked from beau plug inside the reels to the 100 pay on hopper pay board, continuity -.003 ohms. 90 wire continuity -.002 ohms reel mech beau to hopper beau.

pull out the reel mech and put one probe on wire 90 on the reel 1 wiper board wire lug, put the other probe on 56-1 on reel 5 wiper board lug.

A.Continuity, -.002 ohms

Better (but more hassle to find) is connect to 56-1 on pin 9 on the reel mech plug ... and wire 90 on pin 16 of the same plug.

A.Continuity, -.002 ohms


rather than continuity, look for almost zero ohms when you have the melon win that pays 100.

in general, continuity testing is not reliable.  You have to ensure the only possible path between your meter probes is the path you want to check.  A round-about circuit path thru lamps, transformer, coils, etc. can show continuity, but it's a false positive.

measuring resistance is better as you can distinguish between almost zero ohms (good) and more than a couple ohms (not good).

the best test is measuring voltage WHEN current is/should be flowing (the circuit should be closed).  Stick a meter probe on wire 70 and another probe on 56-1 when there's a winner.  If you don't see 50VAC, move the probe from 56-1 "up" the circuit until you find where the voltage jumps up to 50V.  The spot it falls from 50V to whatever - typically in the 20's - is the problem. 


A. 56 wire at beau plug on reel mech had 55V when setup for melon pay. 90 wire from reel beau plug to hopper beau plug good with 0 ohms. 56 wire good to 100 pay board on hopper.   Cherrys thru Bells go thru the 100 pay relay, pay correctly.

[wolftalk]

wire 56-1 goes to the 100 trace on the payout counter, then through the outboard wiper fingers to wire 92-2 on the F trace on the payout disc.

the most likely thing is an outboard wiper finger contact is not good ... probably the one sitting on the F trace ... is the trace pitted/burnt where the wiper is sitting at reset? 

use your meter between wire 70 and the F trace on the payout disc and see if you have 50V.  If not, verify the 50V on the 100/200 traces depending on payout.

in theory, the reason a 5 bell pay works is because 3 and 4 bells circuits are also powering the 18 and 40 pay traces, so that gets the pay started and the outboard wiper position will be different by the time the outboard wipers are needed, which is after 40 steps of the payout unit.  For a 100 pay, the outboard wipers need to get the main wipers onto the CarryOver trace, then the main wipers take over to get an exact 100 pay.

I just noticed the 1019 letter phil anderson wrote to someone about a payout issue in the 1019, which is why the games/paperwork were revised.  I dunno if an added wire between reel 3 and reel 1 is 47 or 48, but phil's letter and the schem say 48.  I made a revised reel wiper diagram that corrects the wire ids to conform to the schem and put it on https://bingo.cdyn.com/slots/1019-1.  If you can email a pic of your reel 1 and reel 3 wiper boards showing the wires attached to the lugs (as best you can get since it's crowded in there), I'll fix the diagram if it's still not right.

[tuna]

This board is Awesome!  It was a dirty contact on the carriage( feed strip next to the 100 pay) that I had neglected to clean, when cleaning the wiper and pay board. 

Wolftalk I sent the pics of reel 1 & 3 high res.

[wolftalk]

based on your pics, I tossed the revised reel wiper diagram.  The original reel wiring diagram matched your game. 

I revised the revised schematic to match the reel wiper diagram :-)

the reel wiper diagram made more sense anyway ... according to the revised schematic, there would have been two 48/48-x and two 54/54-x wires on reel 1, which would have been a manufacturing nightmare.

thanks for clearing up the revision!