New Life Games LLC

Video Poker, Keno, Slots, 21 Gaming machines => IGT PE and PE Plus Poker Games => Topic started by: Hiram on October 12, 2018, 10:46:11 PM

Title: New Problem for Players Edge Poker
Post by: Hiram on October 12, 2018, 10:46:11 PM: First, I can't thank AMECHANIC enough for fixing my monitor !! But once I fired it up, a new problem showed up. There is no sound and the screen has a "CMOS Data" message. I found the reset key lock on the side but I have no key for it ..and that explains why someone disconnected the wires and put a jumper on them. The Door sensor works ..Once I shut the Door, the CMOS Data message left and I kept hitting the white reset button inside and the screens changed but look garbled. I hope the screen message doesn't mean my Board is fried since I know nothing about fixing it. I'll post pictures of the garbled screen messages and hope one of you recognize what the problem is.
Title: Re: New Problem for Players Edge Poker
Post by: rokgpsman on October 12, 2018, 11:35:15 PM: Is the battery on the mpu board good, has the correct voltage? The "CMOS Data" message refers to the cmos ram chip on the mpu board. If the data stored in the cmos ram chip gets garbled or corrupted then that message appears on the screen. The usual cause is because the battery on the mpu board has gone bad. You may have already replaced the battery, I think we talked about this before you got the monitor repaired.

After replacing the battery you try pressing AND HOLDING DOWN the white test button continuously for 10 seconds. That will clear & reset the CMOS ram data and should restore operation of the machine. On some PE machines it will ding when this process is done, but since your sound isn't working just hold the button down for 10 seconds.

For the no-sound problem make sure there is a speaker in the machine and that the speaker has its 2 wires connected on each end of the wires. Someone may have disconnected a speaker wire to silence the machine. If that checks ok then you can make sure the speaker is ok with a meter. Or step thru the setup menus with the white button to see if there is a setting that turns off the sound.
Title: Re: New Problem for Players Edge Poker
Post by: Hiram on October 12, 2018, 11:48:48 PM: Thanks roc ...that data message went away once I closed the door. Would that mean the battery is ok ? I have no test equip to check the battery and was planning on changing it but , I've been on vacation and then work kept me off line. What about that jumper someone put between the reset lock wires ? Is that a problem ?
Title: Re: New Problem for Players Edge Poker
Post by: rokgpsman on October 12, 2018, 11:51:05 PM: The jackpot reset wires should not be jumpered together continuously. You only want to connect those wires momentarily, then they get disconnected from each other. That's what the reset switch does. So disconnect the 2 wires from each other that normally go to the reset switch. If someone lost the reset key then they may have rigged that jumper wire to be able to do a reset. But it shouldn't be connected all the time. You can try undoing that reset jumper and see how the machine acts. The reset key for that reset switch is usually a standard key called a "2341" key because that's the number stamped on it. They are avail for low cost. So you may not have to buy the entire reset switch assembly, just a 2341 key.

If the cmos data message went away the battery might be ok, or it might be because you've pressed the white TEST button a few times and taken care of the cmos ram error. I thought in the other discussion thread you determined the battery was bad, or suspected it was? I think it would be a good idea to make sure the battery is good, either with a meter or having it replaced with a new one to be sure.

Did you try pressing and holding the white button for 10 seconds? That might clear up the screen random characters, not sure. The garbled text displayed in some of your photos above are the Test & Setup menu screens, I think some of that data shown is coming from the cmos ram chip. Each time you press and release the white TEST button the menu screen will step to the next screen. The reset key is used to step thru the bookkeeping screens by turning and releasing the reset switch, so if the reset switch wires are connected all the time it is confusing the machine.
Title: Re: New Problem for Players Edge Poker
Post by: Hiram on October 13, 2018, 03:30:31 AM: Rok , I followed your instructions and I disconnected the jumper , then I held the white reset button for 10 seconds and it made the bell sound ..closed the door and the game cleared and came on !! Thanks for that rokgpsman !! I tried playing it and it works BUT , when I win it asks me if I want to double down ...when I do , say I win 8 coins and try to cash out - the game will say it paid me 4 and show 4 in the credits ..but it never pays me the full amount when I double down, it only pays half and leaves the rest in the credits. If I hit cash out again , it will spit out what's in the credits. Have you ever seen this before ?
Title: Re: New Problem for Players Edge Poker
Post by: Rep on October 13, 2018, 04:01:10 AM: Yeah usually holding the test switch in for a few seconds will fix the CMOS DATA error. If you have battery issues (which I just recently fixed) it will say "Call Attendant low battery" on the screen. If you don't want double up that should be able to be disabled in the test menus. Also in those menus I always set the one screen (the name loses me at the moment) but there's3 3 options, credit, non-credit and player initiated credit and my guess is thats what its set to. If ya want it all in credits on the machine just set it to "credit" or "non-credit" should ALWAYS pay ALL coins thru the hopper IIRC. Just open your door and press the white test button and scroll thru the settings, you should see em all. Hope it helps, if not, keep us posted, we'll get ya fully up and running!
Title: Re: New Problem for Players Edge Poker
Post by: rokgpsman on October 13, 2018, 06:25:33 AM: Glad you got it going and fixed most of the problems. That jumper on the reset wires should not be there all the time, only connect those wires when you would need to turn the reset key. I'd suggest that you get a key for that reset keyswitch on the side of the machine. Then just connect those 2 reset wires on the reset switch terminals where they are supposed to be. The key doesn't cost much and will make life easier for you. Or you can replace the entire reset switch, it is easy to replace, just has one large nut on the inside portion of the switch that holds it in place.

http://www.spininc.com/01465-0 (http://www.spininc.com/01465-0)

http://www.ohiogamingslots.com/slot_parts/84-attendant-key-switch (http://www.ohiogamingslots.com/slot_parts/84-attendant-key-switch)

The "double-up" (double-down) feature is a game option that you can turn off if you don't want it. When you press the white TEST button (its not a "reset" button) the menu screens will appear, just press the white button and release it to change to the next screen. One of them will have the double-up game option listed and you can disable it. Not sure why it pays part of the wins directly to you and puts the rest on the credit, as Rep said it probably has to do with one of your other Test menu settings. Check the various payout options, credit and cash mode, etc on the menu screens. You can change a setting and then try it to see if that takes care of it. If not just change the setting back to where it was.

If you see that "CMOS Data" message again when you turn on the machine that means the battery on the mpu board needs replacing. Since you just got this machine and don't know how old the battery is I'd recommend you either check it with a meter or you have the battery replaced. You can get a low-cost meter at places like Harbor Freight or home improvement stores (Lowe's, Home Depot, Menards, etc).
Title: Re: New Problem for Players Edge Poker
Post by: Hiram on October 13, 2018, 09:57:48 AM: Ok , I just tried it , I see it now ...once I hit that test button it tells me what to hit or says to hit the reset to make changes. I did not see anything that controls why it only pays me half the coins and leaves the rest in the credits though. BTW ----now my Wife has been playing it on and off today so ..thanks gents , she likes it now, especially after I showed her how to open the door and take coins back out when she loses lol :thank_you:
Title: Re: New Problem for Players Edge Poker
Post by: BrianT on October 13, 2018, 10:21:06 AM: You clearly have missed matched program & CG roms. Please post picture(s) of the MPU board with clear shots of the program ROM and the CG roms with color CAP chip. Then I can tell you the correct graphics roms for your poker set.

BrianT
Title: Re: New Problem for Players Edge Poker
Post by: Hiram on October 13, 2018, 10:34:43 AM: overall board
Title: Re: New Problem for Players Edge Poker
Post by: Hiram on October 13, 2018, 10:45:25 AM: Hi Brian ...how could you tell the IC's are mis-matched ? Are the graphics suppose to look different or , is that why it pays less than it should ?
Title: Re: New Problem for Players Edge Poker
Post by: sixcardmark on October 13, 2018, 10:49:00 AM: I would replace that battery with the correct one asap. Wow, that's ugly.
Title: Re: New Problem for Players Edge Poker
Post by: Hiram on October 13, 2018, 11:24:55 AM: I didn't know that was the wrong battery ..no one mentioned that when I posted the picture before. Hope that's not damaging anything
Title: Re: New Problem for Players Edge Poker
Post by: sixcardmark on October 13, 2018, 11:34:46 AM: It may be the right battery but does not have the solder tabs or wires. Did someone solder a wire to the battery? Not a real good idea, but I guess it works. Here's what you want:
Title: Re: New Problem for Players Edge Poker
Post by: Amechanic on October 13, 2018, 11:59:50 AM: If you have a battery store in your area, I'm sure they could solder in a correct battery for your board. Your going to need a 1/2AA Size lithium battery with those solder lead. Nice looking picture on that game.. :dancing_2: :applause: :cool_thumb_up:
Title: Re: New Problem for Players Edge Poker
Post by: Badbaud on October 13, 2018, 06:00:22 PM: Solder does not stick well to the steel jacket of the battery, most likely excessive solder flux is sticking it in place for now.
Title: Re: New Problem for Players Edge Poker
Post by: rokgpsman on October 13, 2018, 06:43:23 PM: Quote from: Hiram on October 13, 2018, 10:41:10 AM
hope the pics are large enough to read the chips

Looks like most of the game chips don't have labels. To verify that you have the right graphics chip (as mentioned by BrianT earlier) you can have the machine tell you what the game software chip part numbers are by using the reset switch. Since you don't have a reset key you will need to connect the reset switch wires by hand with that jumper you disconnected earlier. Just touch the reset wires together momentarily, then disconnect them. The monitor should step thru the stats screens. The voltage is very low, only about 5 volts, so don't worry about getting shocked. On about stat menu screen # 9 the monitor will list all of the game chip software part numbers. Then you can post a photo of that screen, will save you from having to type all of that by hand into a message here. Below is a picture of what the software info screen will look like.

Also, now that you've reset the cmos ram and the machine is working can you post a photo of the screen with the 5 cards displayed for a hand during the game?

When you are stepping thru the menu screens did you see one for "Hopper Size"? Tell us what it is set to now, if a low number then you can try setting it to a high number, like 500 or so. See if that affects how the machine pays out when you win a hand on the double-up feature.
Title: Re: New Problem for Players Edge Poker
Post by: Hiram on October 13, 2018, 07:57:25 PM: Here's the screen now ..it still needs the focus adj a little but not bad. I'll try taking pics of the screens you mentioned and post them soon ...thanks
Title: Re: New Problem for Players Edge Poker
Post by: rokgpsman on October 13, 2018, 08:01:12 PM: The colors and graphics look ok to me, maybe BrianT was looking at that photo you posted earlier back when the machine had scrambled cmos ram data? Looking forward to more pictures showing the stat menu screens with game software chip info. Also check on that Hopper Size setting?
Title: Re: New Problem for Players Edge Poker
Post by: BrianT on October 13, 2018, 08:26:47 PM: Yeah, judging by the first pics you showed it looked like the wrong graphics. But based on the most picture of the machine up and running everything is fine, so you can disregard my comment about miss matched graphics.

BrianT
Title: Re: New Problem for Players Edge Poker
Post by: Hiram on October 13, 2018, 09:42:03 PM: That's great news !! Thanks Brian ...I just took the pictures so , here they are anyway ..plus it doesn't look like this machine has paid out very well ..I have a Scrooge Poker game LOL ..I bet which ever Casino had this game liked it
Title: Re: New Problem for Players Edge Poker
Post by: Hiram on October 13, 2018, 09:50:08 PM: Here's another pic of the Play Screen and you can see how I still have to somehow reach back and adj the focus a little. But it is still messing up the pay outs. If I play one game and win say 10 coins , I can hit cashout and get the 10 coins ---but if I use the double down option and win 20 coins - it will again offer the double down , if I say NO ...it will put only 10 coins in the credits and a message appears on the bottom saying I was paid the other 10 coins ..but I was not paid those 10 , it won't spit them out and the hopper doesn't even start up. The Hopper setting page says 1000
Title: Re: New Problem for Players Edge Poker
Post by: rokgpsman on October 13, 2018, 09:58:24 PM: According to your photo showing the stat screen for the game software chips your game software is called "PP0728". As you can see in BrianT's PE+ spreadsheet below your game has a player win percentage of about 91%. That's a lower payout percentage, below average, there are versions of DB with higher percentages. The spreadsheet also shows the chip numbers for the rest of the chips that make up this PP0728 Double Bonus Poker game. You could get a different version of Double Bonus Poker that has a higher player win percentage, up to about 100.2%, that would just involve replacing an eprom or two.
Title: Re: New Problem for Players Edge Poker
Post by: rokgpsman on October 13, 2018, 10:11:04 PM: When you were stepping thru the menu screens by pressing the WHITE test button did you see a menu screen with something about credit mode or non-credit mode?
Title: Re: New Problem for Players Edge Poker
Post by: Hiram on October 13, 2018, 10:16:24 PM: I don't remember ...I can check it out later and take a pic. You think the credit mode might be messing up when I double down ? Also ...You said the 91% is below average ..what payout would be normal for this machine ? I'd like it to be the same as what they typically use in Casinos. It wouldn't be much fun if it won all the time right ? :) Is it easy for me to change it ?
Title: Re: New Problem for Players Edge Poker
Post by: rokgpsman on October 13, 2018, 10:53:42 PM: I don't know why your machine is paying out partially when you win the double-up game but maybe it has to do with one of the settings in the TEST menus.

On the list of Double Bonus Poker games for the PE+ machine there are a variety of different payback percentages, up to about 100.2% for the highest I saw. They are all normal, over the years different casinos in different locations ordered whatever payback percentage they wanted that fit with their casino operation. So there are several for you to choose from. But even with the versions with a high percentage the player does not win all the time, just more often.

You're right that you wouldn't want to win all the time, no fun in that. But somewhere around 95% is a good spot from what I've experienced. However, if you are happy with your game's percentage that's all that matters. Changing to a DB poker game with a higher percentage would be done by changing out 1 or 2 chips, they are in sockets so can be changed easily.
Title: Re: New Problem for Players Edge Poker
Post by: sixcardmark on October 13, 2018, 11:06:22 PM: Payback percentages don't work the same with poker games as they do with slots. The different payback % is done by increasing the amount you win for certain hands like a full house, etc. You can punch up the see pays scale and tell what % it is set at if you know what to look for. 91% is prob what it was in casino for quarter machine.
Black jack is a little different, lower payback machines will reduce options like, not let you split, double down, etc.
Title: Re: New Problem for Players Edge Poker
Post by: rokgpsman on October 14, 2018, 07:50:26 AM: Actually there are Double Bonus poker machines all over Las Vegas that are well above 91%, even on the Strip at places like MGM and others. And downtown on Fremont St (Four Queens, Main St Station, etc) plus the off-strip places like Arizona Charlie's, Orleans, Sam's Town you can find DB vp machines that are the 100.2% paytables. The $1 and higher machines tend to have the higher paytables but even the quarter machines have decent percentages quite a bit higher than 91%.

https://www.vpfree2.com/casinos/by-region/las-vegas (https://www.vpfree2.com/casinos/by-region/las-vegas)
Title: Re: New Problem for Players Edge Poker
Post by: Hiram on October 14, 2018, 08:29:41 AM: I mentioned this to Lisa and , she asked what it would cost to change the % and , where can we find the chips ? If it's only 2 chips to change and they have sockets , I could handle that ---I think she likes the machine now !! lol
Title: Re: New Problem for Players Edge Poker
Post by: Amechanic on October 14, 2018, 08:38:44 AM: Isnâ€™t it funny how they tend to grow on the people who didnâ€™t want them 🧐🤔..

Poker programming chips tend to be a little harder to find then the regular slot machine ones, but Iâ€™m sure someone can help like Jim at MidWest Slot, or Alan out at KLar.
Title: Re: New Problem for Players Edge Poker
Post by: sixcardmark on October 14, 2018, 08:52:14 AM: I haven't been to Vegas in over 25 years LOL. Back then most all $1 slots on the strip were 98%. Big billboards everywhere.

On a superstar poker game king all poker games have different ranges. Most don't go lower than 93% and only a handful go over 100%. Most games that will go over 100% all involve wild cards I think. I will have to take a look. Either way your not going to win or loose any more hands or get dealt any different cards, so for home use it's really no big deal.
Title: Re: New Problem for Players Edge Poker
Post by: sixcardmark on October 14, 2018, 09:03:26 AM: OK on superstar poker there are only 4 choices for double bonus poker:

100.18
99.10
97.80
96.38

So 91% is pretty bad. I need to look and see what my pe+ double bonus poker game is set to. I guess I need to get chip number to find out?? I have a multi-poker pe+ would chip be same as Hiram's?
Title: Re: New Problem for Players Edge Poker
Post by: rokgpsman on October 14, 2018, 09:11:23 AM: Quote from: sixcardmark on October 14, 2018, 08:52:14 AM
I haven't been to Vegas in over 25 years LOL. Back then most all $1 slots on the strip were 98%. Big billboards everywhere.

On a superstar poker game king all poker games have different ranges. Most don't go lower than 93% and only a handful go over 100%. Most games that will go over 100% all involve wild cards I think. I will have to take a look. Either way your not going to win or loose any more hands or get dealt any different cards, so for home use it's really no big deal.

I agree that for home play the lower percentages don't make a tremendous difference. But just knowing that I had a 91% machine and could have a 98% would drive me crazy. :garfield:
Title: Re: New Problem for Players Edge Poker
Post by: rokgpsman on October 14, 2018, 09:14:01 AM: Quote from: sixcardmark on October 14, 2018, 09:03:26 AM
....So 91% is pretty bad. I need to look and see what my pe+ double bonus poker game is set to.

An easy way is to bring up the software screen on the PE+ machine (by turning the jackpot reset switch a few times), get the "PPxxxx" number (or "XMxxxx" number for multi-poker chipsets) and then look it up in BrianT's wonderful spreadsheet. That spreadsheet is attached to his FAQ below:

http://newlifegames.com/nlg/index.php?topic=2547.msg12717#msg12717 (http://newlifegames.com/nlg/index.php?topic=2547.msg12717#msg12717)

(or you can look at the label on the game chip on the mpu of course)

Quote from: sixcardmark on October 14, 2018, 09:03:26 AM
OK on superstar poker there are only 4 choices for double bonus poker:

100.18
99.10
97.80
96.38

So 91% is pretty bad. I need to look and see what my pe+ double bonus poker game is set to. I guess I need to get chip number to find out?? I have a multi-poker pe+ would chip be same as Hiram's?

On the multi-poker chips sets they use a slightly different naming method, I think it is something like "XMxxxx". But BrianT's spreadsheet has several tabs at the bottom for looking up the various types of software so you should be able to find it in there. And if you have one that isn't listed in his spreadsheet he'd like to hear from you so he can get it added.
Title: Re: New Problem for Players Edge Poker
Post by: sixcardmark on October 14, 2018, 09:17:05 AM: :thank_you:

Here is pic of my pay scale:
Title: Re: New Problem for Players Edge Poker
Post by: sixcardmark on October 14, 2018, 09:38:27 AM: Here is pay set at 99.1% so you can see the difference:
Title: Re: New Problem for Players Edge Poker
Post by: rokgpsman on October 14, 2018, 09:55:21 AM: Did you find out the game's software number for your Double Bonus game in your 1st photo?
Title: Re: New Problem for Players Edge Poker
Post by: sixcardmark on October 14, 2018, 10:37:25 AM: Have to dload office software.

I have XM00005P data
XMP00020 game
Title: Re: New Problem for Players Edge Poker
Post by: rokgpsman on October 14, 2018, 10:47:26 AM: I think the XMP00020 chip is a companion chip, works with the XM00005P chips, the percentage is set by the XM00005P chips.
Title: Re: New Problem for Players Edge Poker
Post by: sixcardmark on October 14, 2018, 11:00:00 AM: So the 97% xm chip won't help the OP? He needs a higher pp chip?
Title: Re: New Problem for Players Edge Poker
Post by: rokgpsman on October 14, 2018, 11:34:30 AM: Quote from: sixcardmark on October 14, 2018, 11:00:00 AM
So the 97% xm chip won't help the OP? He needs a higher pp chip?

I think so. I'm not as knowledgeable on the PE+ games as others are. So if any of this is wrong someone please correct.

I think his Double Bonus machine is a single-game setup, it just has the game chips for the PP0728 Double Bonus vp game, no other poker games. The XM chips are for the multi-game setups that use the "super-board", have 5 poker games built-in to the software set, so he can't use them (unless I'm wrong and he does have a superboard). I think he'd only have to change out 1 chip (the GMO chip) to increase his percentage. The other chips would likely stay the same since it would be the same Double Bonus game, just with a different percentage. You can't mix & match chips from a multi-poker chipset with the chips from the single-game chipset. There are poker software chipsets made for the single board and different chipsets for the superboard.

The PE+ single board game chipsets consist of 6 chips. The GMO chip is the main software chip for the game. Then there are the other chips- the MRO, MGO, MBO and MXO chips. I think these 4 chips have to do with graphics, like the playing card images. And there is the special little CAPX chip that affects colors. All of these chips would probably be the same from one version of Double Bonus poker to the next, except for the GMO chip. Luckily many poker games use the same CAPX chip so you don't always have to replace it. His mpu board photo (below) shows that it is a single-game board. I've marked the game chips with a little yellow square, the main chip GMO has 3 little yellow squares.

On a superboard there is an extra socket next to where the GMO socket is, that allows the superboard to use another chip for the multi-poker chipsets.

The game software for PE+ poker games is fairly easy to download for free from the various MAME hobby websites. Then you just need some blank eproms and an eprom burner to make the chips you need. The only hiccup is if you have to make a CAPX chip, the blanks for them are hard to find and costly. But the good folks at KLAR can help out with that.
Title: Re: New Problem for Players Edge Poker
Post by: sixcardmark on October 14, 2018, 12:31:44 PM: Lots of good info there!

Here are pics of rule set of black jack at highest setting and at lowest setting:
Title: Re: New Problem for Players Edge Poker
Post by: rokgpsman on October 14, 2018, 01:39:07 PM: I've never played blackjack on a PE+ machine. How do you select the different percentages? Is it on the menu screen?

Here is the info from the PE+ spreadsheet Blackjack tab about the chipsets for Blackjack games:
Title: Re: New Problem for Players Edge Poker
Post by: Hiram on October 15, 2018, 12:29:11 AM: Thanks for that info Rok because , I'd like to change that GMO chip and get a better % --Is there a Company I can call and order that GMO Chip from ?
Title: Re: New Problem for Players Edge Poker
Post by: rokgpsman on October 15, 2018, 01:15:11 AM: Quote from: Hiram on October 15, 2018, 12:29:11 AM
Thanks for that info Rok because I'd like to change that GMO chip and get a better % --Is there a Company I can call and order that GMO Chip from ?

Not that I know of. But there are people here that may be able to help with that or know someplace to get it. Let's see if any of the PE+ folks have some ideas about it and I'll do some checking around. Is the game as it plays now not winning as often as you'd like?
Title: Re: New Problem for Players Edge Poker
Post by: Hiram on October 15, 2018, 09:22:25 AM: I'm not a Poker champ by any means but , it's not easy to win. Last night I played $150 worth of quarters (5 coins each time) and only won 3 times ..no Royal Flush or 3 of a kinds or anything special ..and it's still doing that strange deal when I "double UP" . If I win , it asks if I want to double up again ...if I say NO , only half my winnings go to Credits and a message pops up saying winner paid - but the hopper never starts and no coins are spit out ..I just lose those credits each time
Title: Re: New Problem for Players Edge Poker
Post by: rokgpsman on October 15, 2018, 10:11:32 AM: Perhaps that double-up problem is a quirk in the game software, that's just the way it is? That would be odd but if you've checked your machines TEST menu settings for credit, hopper, etc and they look ok I can't think of anything else that would cause what you are seeing.

It is difficult to know what is happening on the double-up problem. If you press the white TEST button and then take a photo of each menu screen that comes up, from start to finish, maybe we can see something in one of the settings that is causing it. You can post up to 5 photos on each message here, and as many messages as you need to. When you play the game on the poker hands that you win (not the double-up part of the game) do the wins go to credits correctly? Does the hopper work correctly if you hit the cashout button? In other words, does all aspects of the game work ok except for this double-up payout problem?

From what I've read the Royal Flush hand is very elusive on any video poker game. Even a skilled vp player only sees it about every 40,000 hands on a Jacks or Bettor game (that's the vp game I'm most familiar with). And to get it that often you have to hold and discard the correct cards to best increase your chances. So not seeing a royal flush is normal, some people play for months (or even longer) without seeing one. A Straight Flush is also difficult to get. I've played for 2 or 3 hours a day when on vacation and not had a 4 of a Kind or higher. Since the chances of getting the higher hands is so small a lot has to do with what cards you keep and which ones you discard, that is very important when trying for the higher hands. For example, in Jacks or Better say you are dealt 2 aces (ace of hearts, ace of spades), along with a king of clubs, queen of clubs and jack of clubs. Many people will keep the pair of aces and discard the other 3 cards. But the correct play is to keep the 3 clubs, throw away the 2 aces and go for the royal flush. If you never take those chancy opportunities for the royal flush then you will get them even less often.

From what sixcardmark said earlier, the winning poker hands will appear with the same frequency no matter what the payout percentage of the game chips is. The amount you win is based on the paytable of the game software, this is what the machine gives you for each winning hand and that is affected by the payout percentage. But getting a Full House or an other winning hand is the same, whether your game chips are 91% or 98%. The 5 cards the game gives you are selected at random from the 52 card deck without regard to the payout percentage. Then you discard some cards and the game gives you the replacement cards that are selected at random. So the cards you get are fairly drawn from the deck the same way for all payout percentage versions of the game. The higher percentage games just give you more money for those winning hands.
Title: Re: New Problem for Players Edge Poker
Post by: Amechanic on October 15, 2018, 10:25:53 AM: I have one in my garage. Let me see if I can get it powered on today a go thru the menu.
Title: Re: New Problem for Players Edge Poker
Post by: knagl on October 20, 2018, 01:02:42 PM: It sounds like something is corrupted in the memory based on what you're describing for the double-up, OR, it's possible you're just misunderstanding how it works. Are you able with a cell phone or other device to take a short video showing you playing a hand, doubling up, and where you think the issue is? It would make it a lot easier to see what's happening. You can upload the video to YouTube and then post a link here.
Title: Re: New Problem for Players Edge Poker
Post by: Amechanic on October 20, 2018, 01:23:42 PM: Iâ€™m wondering if this is in a dip switch setting? I have not been able to get at the one I have in my garage to check itâ€™s settings.. Possible in a submenu for how the double down bet works or is to be paid/credited back to the player. Iâ€™d be looking for a split pay option.
Title: Re: New Problem for Players Edge Poker
Post by: Rep on October 20, 2018, 09:19:11 PM: I haven't seen any submenu with the split pay option (at least in the sets I've used in my PE+) just the generic credit settings, player initiated, non-credit and credit, etc, never saw any submenu for double up pay methods, just on or off for doubling up
Title: Re: New Problem for Players Edge Poker
Post by: Amechanic on October 20, 2018, 09:31:05 PM: Thatâ€™s why Iâ€™m wondering if there could be a dip switch setting either on the MPU or if there are any on the mother board like on the Fortune II Poker machines? If no then it must have something to do with the jurisdiction on the Game Chips..
Title: Re: New Problem for Players Edge Poker
Post by: Rep on October 20, 2018, 09:51:31 PM: I don't believe there's any on the motherboard IIRC, MPU board IS a possibility but I believe the game chips override them. I can't swear to this info but I'm pretty confident. I know I messed with some dips on the mobo and set it against what the chips were set as in the test menu and it didn't do anything, but ya never know! The mobo I would have to check to be positive but I don't remember any dip switches being on them
Title: Re: New Problem for Players Edge Poker
Post by: Amechanic on October 20, 2018, 10:44:44 PM: I think your correct because the PE mother board is similar to the S+, and the S+ doesnâ€™t have any. I think I have a manual buried in my file drawer. Maybe itâ€™s mentioned in there. I know itâ€™s usualky to have the double down option on or off.
Title: Re: New Problem for Players Edge Poker
Post by: sixcardmark on October 20, 2018, 10:54:40 PM: That's only option I could find on pe+ superboard too: on or off

I say turn it off - problem solved. :rotfl:
Title: Re: New Problem for Players Edge Poker
Post by: Rep on October 20, 2018, 11:05:31 PM: I didn't wanna swear to anything unless I KNOW 100% for sure, but I was pretty confident that it was so. I have a superboard in mine as well and for double up all I have is on or off, NO other options for it.
Title: Re: New Problem for Players Edge Poker
Post by: knagl on October 22, 2018, 02:17:33 AM: It's either on or off. The only thing the DIP switches change are the line frequency for the power (ie. don't mess with the DIP switches). There's no option for a split pay -- my opinion remains the same, either something is corrupt, or there's a misunderstanding on how the double-up works.
Title: Re: New Problem for Players Edge Poker
Post by: ANIslots on October 22, 2018, 06:44:06 AM: Quote from: Hiram on October 15, 2018, 09:22:25 AM
I'm not a Poker champ by any means but , it's not easy to win. Last night I played $150 worth of quarters (5 coins each time) and only won 3 times ..no Royal Flush or 3 of a kinds or anything special ..and it's still doing that strange deal when I "double UP" . If I win , it asks if I want to double up again ...if I say NO , only half my winnings go to Credits and a message pops up saying winner paid - but the hopper never starts and no coins are spit out ..I just lose those credits each time

just remember no matter what percentage you have you will not win or lose any more "times" you willl only win more or less per win,

a 50% game has the same chance to get a royal flush as a 150% game just that the %0% game most likely would pay only half the amount a 100% game ie 2000 instead of 4000
whereas a 150% game would probably pay out 6000 instead of 4000

** disclaimer, the numbers and Percentages are made up and do not exist that i know of, they were used so show the point of how it works
Title: Re: New Problem for Players Edge Poker
Post by: Rep on October 22, 2018, 07:28:48 AM: Your payout percentages are controlled by your lower pays not the jackpot, they royal will always hit the same. It's usually your full house and flush pays that are affected. And in some games REALLY common hands which hurt like 10 for trips in Triple Double Bonus, and most all pay only 5 for 2 pair vs 10 in say jacks or better. That's where the % is rly affected, but unlike slots it's all there for you to see, you can know what % a video poker machine is set at just by looking at the paytable (9/5 8/5 etc) there's even percentage cards they make IIRC so you can look it up and instantly see the % the machine is set at
Title: Re: New Problem for Players Edge Poker
Post by: ANIslots on October 22, 2018, 07:58:17 AM: on the double up issue, can you take a picture of each step when you are doubling
or do a little video and post on youtube for us to see.
that way we can see exactly what its doing and the wording so its understood exactly what is happening

so a picture in each of the following
1. right after the win
2. just before saying yes to double up
3. right after a double up (results)
4. if you won the double up the one where you press no on double up

i havent set any machines up for double up so wandering if it may be applying the credits to your total credits before doubleing ie you have 100 credits, you win 10 now you have 110, you double up now you should have 10 more won not 20 more won for a total of 120 even though it says you won 20

so what we are looking for is to see how it actually pays win you win the double up
Title: Re: New Problem for Players Edge Poker
Post by: jay on October 22, 2018, 09:57:03 AM: I have enabled the double up on my slot.

If I won 5 coins, If I opt to double it deals 5 cards and displays the house card.
I choose the one of the 5 that I want, and if it's higher than the house then I win.
It would be a 10 coin win otherwise I get 0.

Kind of a fun ending.....
Title: Re: New Problem for Players Edge Poker
Post by: Amechanic on October 22, 2018, 10:11:39 AM: Quote from: jay on October 22, 2018, 09:57:03 AM
I have enabled the double up on my slot.

If I won 5 coins, If I opt to double it deals 5 cards and displays the house card.
I choose the one of the 5 that I want, and if it's higher than the house then I win.
It would be a 10 coin win otherwise I get 0.

Kind of a fun ending.....

The strange thing with this game is that when he decides to stop trying to double his winning and says no to the next attempt, the machine splits the winnings between coins paid and credits added back to the machine? Iâ€™ve only ever seen the winning totally go back to credits, never split before?
Title: Re: New Problem for Players Edge Poker
Post by: jay on October 22, 2018, 10:35:25 AM: Isnâ€™t that due to a max credit setting on the Machine ?
Title: Re: New Problem for Players Edge Poker
Post by: Rep on October 22, 2018, 10:52:08 AM: That's a possibility but if so it would have to be set pretty low if only doubling once and it exceeding the limit, but that could cause it
Title: Re: New Problem for Players Edge Poker
Post by: jay on October 22, 2018, 11:31:30 AM: Maybe there is already 290 credits on the machine ??

A win of 10 hits the 300 credit limit, doubling is 20.... 10 goes to the credit pile, and the excess to the hopper....

or something like that.....
Title: Re: New Problem for Players Edge Poker
Post by: Rep on October 22, 2018, 12:03:03 PM: Very possible, especially if set to a low denom like pennies. Pics/vid would help us a ton here just so we could see how the machine is acting and if we could see the test menu settings and see how everything is set but no pics or vid as of yet, but the credit limit could come into play but if it's split paying every single time then I question it. We just need more info to work with here I think, pics/vid so we can visually see what's going on here and we could iron it all out :)
Title: Re: New Problem for Players Edge Poker
Post by: sixcardmark on October 22, 2018, 12:21:47 PM: Why is the hopper not spitting out any coins or machine not locking up if it was a limit thing?
Title: Re: New Problem for Players Edge Poker
Post by: Amechanic on October 22, 2018, 12:29:07 PM: I just texted this guy. Hopefully we hear from him later today.. I know he has not changed the battery yet so itâ€™s as was setup before the previous person owned it before the monitor went out. Heâ€™s located over in NY., so maybe this game was over in a East Coast Casino?? It doesnâ€™t matter if he wins 10,20,40 credits. Half go to coin tray other half to credits? So I donâ€™t think itâ€™s a jackpot limit issue?
Title: Re: New Problem for Players Edge Poker
Post by: Rep on October 22, 2018, 06:55:56 PM: I got the impression it was always doing it which was why I kinda ruled out the credit limit, tho as jay mentioned if the credits on the machine were near the limit it could cause it. I just can't imagine the credits were always way up near the limit, so I felt it was something else, and not any setting I was familiar with from the test menu unless some kind of setting I had never seen before. Hope he gets back to you, and maybe gets pics/vid so we can see what's really going on here, then it'll be solved in no time :)
Title: Re: New Problem for Players Edge Poker
Post by: jay on October 22, 2018, 07:46:01 PM: Credit limit would not be a hand pay.

A hand pay occurs when you exceed the hopper limit. Which is different than the max credits.
You could have a hopper limit of 300 and a credit limit of 600.
Assuming you had 500 credits and
you tried to cash out you would get 300 coins then it goes into a hand pay.

Of if you hit a Royal Flush for 1200 coins 600 would go to credit, and 300 would come from the hopper then you go to a hand pay.

A progressive is always a hand pay and nothing comes from the hopper.
Title: Re: New Problem for Players Edge Poker
Post by: sixcardmark on October 22, 2018, 08:32:10 PM: Mine are both set at 400. I am pretty sure if I get a win that would take the credit meter over 400 it pays by hopper instead of by credits unless the single win is over 400 credits then it pays nothing and just goes to hand pay.
Title: Re: New Problem for Players Edge Poker
Post by: jay on October 22, 2018, 08:38:44 PM: Depends on the game.
Title: Re: New Problem for Players Edge Poker
Post by: Hiram on December 29, 2018, 10:33:39 PM: Hi Everyone, between work and a few medical issues , I wasn't able to post sooner but ...I just wanted to thank you all and wish everyone a HAPPY NEW YEAR and all the best for 2019 !! AMechanic and all of you have been a HUGE help in bringing my IGT back to life (so my Wife can't say I wasted money buying it lol) and it turns out , she plays it everyday. I bought a key you told me about for the reset and it works great and overall ..we're both really enjoying it ...thanks to all of you !!

As far as the game -I have no clue why but , it stopped paying half from the hopper and putting the other half of the winnings in the credits - now if I win it only asks to double down ..if I win that and tell it I don't want to double down again , all my winnings go in the credits . The only glitch it has is ..if I win and by accident hit the far right button , it cashes all my credits out. But the far Left button says cash out , not the far right . That's a pain since we've hit that by accident 6 times now when I had credits built up to over 600 and I had to keep opening the door to refill the hopper lol. Maybe the wires are crossed ...but it's ok , I live with it. I am worried about that battery though so , I should change that soon. Also ..even when I turn up the volume , there are no sounds except the clicks when I put coins in or use the credits ..I'm not sure if that's normal or if there's suppose to be some background music or fanfare sound effects ?
My next "project" is going to be that old Bally slot machine. I was finally able to pull out the Hopper and the Reel assembly. I was thinking about spraying it all down with Contact cleaner to get the dust and years of yuk off it ..not sure if the solvents will hurt anything though so , I'll start a new thread with pictures about that. But Gents , thanks a million for all your help :thank_you:
Title: Re: New Problem for Players Edge Poker
Post by: jay on December 29, 2018, 10:55:52 PM: Open the door, Press the white button and step through the various screens and settings.
Most are pretty obvious such as enabling the double down option, win music, card sounds etc.
Title: Re: New Problem for Players Edge Poker
Post by: Hiram on December 29, 2018, 11:02:03 PM: Thanks Jay ..I'll try that for sure !!
Title: Re: New Problem for Players Edge Poker
Post by: Amechanic on December 29, 2018, 11:38:59 PM: Be careful of the reel strips on the Bally. Contact me if you need help or advice. Iâ€™ve got a few tricks and advice to help get it running.
Title: Re: New Problem for Players Edge Poker
Post by: Hiram on December 29, 2018, 11:50:45 PM: a friend (he's in the picture) helped me pull out the assemblies and he turned one of the reels one or 2 positions (he didn't spin it) ..I told him not to do it again in case it would damage something. Everything seems sluggish as if the whole things should be dipped and lubed . I hope he didn't mess anything up
Title: Re: New Problem for Players Edge Poker
Post by: Amechanic on December 30, 2018, 12:36:10 AM: It should be just fine. 👍
Title: Re: New Problem for Players Edge Poker
Post by: knagl on December 30, 2018, 03:48:21 PM: Quote from: Hiram on December 29, 2018, 10:33:39 PM
The only glitch it has is ..if I win and by accident hit the far right button , it cashes all my credits out. But the far Left button says cash out , not the far right . That's a pain since we've hit that by accident 6 times now when I had credits built up to over 600 and I had to keep opening the door to refill the hopper lol. Maybe the wires are crossed ...but it's ok , I live with it.

Open the door and press the white self-test button once. That should bring you to the Self Test Inputs diagnostic screen. You'll see a screen like the image I've attached.

When on that screen, you can test each of your buttons, and the "0" should change to a "1" when you press the button. For example, if you press the left hold button, the zero to the left of "HOLD 1" should change to a "1" when you have the button pressed. Test each of your buttons to determine if they are labeled correctly and/or if you have wires going to the wrong buttons.
Title: Re: New Problem for Players Edge Poker
Post by: Hiram on June 08, 2019, 05:11:17 PM: Hi Gents ...I just wanted to come by and thank you all again ...we're having a lot of fun with the Machine !!! Every now and then the "Call Attendant" message comes up and says either Door or Hopper issue but , I just turn it off and play with the white button and reset key and it goes away. I posted a short video of it (I hit 4 Aces !!) on my Facebook page. If you have a chance , please check it out https://www.facebook.com/mike.peters.5283/posts/2937690872939935 (https://www.facebook.com/mike.peters.5283/posts/2937690872939935)
Title: Re: New Problem for Players Edge Poker
Post by: knagl on June 08, 2019, 06:59:21 PM: Mike,

Glad to hear your game is working generally well and you're enjoying it. The video you posted on your Facebook page is not set to "public", so folks who aren't connected to you on Facebook can't see it.

If you can post the specific, word-for-word error message(s) you're getting, we can try and point you in the right direction to resolve them for good. You generally shouldn't have to power cycle or fiddle with the self test button or jackpot reset key if the machine is working normally.
Title: Re: New Problem for Players Edge Poker
Post by: Hiram on June 08, 2019, 08:31:33 PM: Hi Knagl , I just reset the Facebook post to Public ..nt sure why it was set at friends only ..try it now -- https://www.facebook.com/mike.peters.5283/posts/2937690872939935 (https://www.facebook.com/mike.peters.5283/posts/2937690872939935)
Title: Re: New Problem for Players Edge Poker
Post by: Hiram on June 08, 2019, 08:44:17 PM: I just played the machine and it did it again ...I took the pictures in sequence ..Slot 1 pic shows the first message that comes up . I open the machine but now when I push the white button , or hold it , or push it many times , it does nothing. I turn the key and it doesn't do anything .. Then I slam it shut to make sure the door contact works and sometimes the message changes and says Hopper ..sometimes the tube goes Blue and the game comes back on with no problem
Title: Re: New Problem for Players Edge Poker
Post by: Hiram on June 09, 2019, 09:09:46 PM: It didn't lock up at all today ..worked perfectly . This is really weird. Knagl ..Did you get a chance to try the Facebook link again ? It should work now
Title: Re: New Problem for Players Edge Poker
Post by: jay on June 09, 2019, 09:15:21 PM: I would speculate there is a short on the video output or possibly bad video output on the Mpu.
Title: Re: New Problem for Players Edge Poker
Post by: Badbaud on June 09, 2019, 09:21:16 PM: Hopper malfunction, extra coin out, usually means your hopper is coasting an extra coin out because your hopper brake is sticking or the brake spring is flacid.
Title: Re: New Problem for Players Edge Poker
Post by: Hiram on June 09, 2019, 10:01:35 PM: The strange thing is ..I let the winnings build up as credits , I don't want it paying out since it's easier to just play credits. I'll be playing and that's when the call attendant message ..the hopper isn't even running
Title: Re: New Problem for Players Edge Poker
Post by: Badbaud on June 09, 2019, 10:34:29 PM: With zero credits tap your white test button to go to "hopper credit limit" and set it for 9999.
That would be the amount of credits you can accumulate before the hopper tries to run.
Title: Re: New Problem for Players Edge Poker
Post by: knagl on June 12, 2019, 12:03:15 AM: Yes, the Facebook video works now.

In the first picture you posted, under the big "CALL ATTENDANT" banner is the real error message: "COIN-IN TIMEOUT". There are a couple of possibilities for this. You may have some loose wiring on the coin-in optics, which are located directly below the Coin Comparator, or the wiring that traces back to the motherboard could be suspect. Another possibility is if you got that message immediately after dropping a coin into the machine, you may have the wrong spacer ("encoder") for the coin-in optics, causing the coin you dropped in to not hit all of the optics in the correct order or with the correct timing. Is there anything you can identify that you did immediately prior to that "COIN-IN TIMEOUT" error appearing?

As Badbaud said above, for the "extra coin paid out" message, there could be an issue with the hopper brake. If you don't plan to use it, his suggestion in the reply directly above mine of increasing the hopper limit to 9999 is a good, quick fix for that.

The tube "going blue" after you close the door is normal behavior. Newer PE+ software displays a message along the lines of, "Verifying game memory, please wait." Older PE+ software just shows a blank screen with the selected background (blue) for about five seconds, then returns to the current game display.
Title: Re: New Problem for Players Edge Poker
Post by: Hiram on June 12, 2019, 04:37:57 AM: I understand and thanks for answering me ....maybe I could try changing the quarter I placed in there as an example ? I try to keep 500 credits in it and I just keep hitting the play Max buton ..that's when it locks up . Then I have to do my open & close door dance lol . But that white reset button use to work ..now it doesn't and I'm wondering if that means something here as well ...maybe ? Checking all the wires for a break without a meter doesn't sound like fun so ..I'll try changing the coin first and wiggle all the wires.
Title: Re: New Problem for Players Edge Poker
Post by: Hiram on June 22, 2019, 08:26:06 AM: Update -- I tried changing the coin , checked all the wires and plugs as well as the door sensor and wires seem ok ( I didn't use a meter) ..The game kept working but 4 days ago the same message came up and ,,now it won't reset itself. I can open the door and tap or even hold the white button and it does nothing , the reset key does nothing ...it's totally dead now. Maybe I jinxed myself by posting pictures of it on Facebook raving about it ..the "Slot Gods" are not amused lol . Lisa is bummed since she loved playing it ...if you have any ideas or something else I could try ..please let me know
Title: Re: New Problem for Players Edge Poker
Post by: Badbaud on June 22, 2019, 10:21:15 AM: The white test button is not for reset, the key on the side is used to clear a jackpot, it is not a reset.
Reset is only accomplished by closing the door and shoving the door latch all of the way down.
That lines up the door optics and resets the game and clears a tilt.
Title: Re: New Problem for Players Edge Poker
Post by: knagl on June 23, 2019, 10:00:57 PM: Open the door and go to the Self Test Inputs screen, by pressing the white button once. Please take and post a picture of that screen.
Title: Re: New Problem for Players Edge Poker
Post by: Hiram on December 26, 2019, 02:21:25 AM: I hope you all had a fantastic Christmas and , best of luck to everyone in 2020 !! As far as my game , I'm pretty sad about it but ...the game has been dead since my last post in June. It's a shame because we had a blast with it and my wife even got hooked on it. I tried the reset key , pushing that white button , pulling out the hopper and putting it back , even unplugging the CPU can and sliding that back in (with the power off of course) . I didn't post earlier because we've been busy feeding Troops this summer so , I thought I'd give you a follow up on it now that things slowed down. I wish there was a way for the game to tell me what's wrong ....probably does but , I don't know where to find it
Title: Re: New Problem for Players Edge Poker
Post by: jay on December 26, 2019, 05:15:11 AM: What do you mean by dead ? Is the screen just blue ? No power ?

You could also grab another MPU board and transfer your game chips - most of the vendors on our home page and there is also EBay.
Title: Re: New Problem for Players Edge Poker
Post by: Hiram on December 26, 2019, 05:43:02 PM: It powers up but ..I'll take some pictures and post them tonight so you can see the screen
Title: Re: New Problem for Players Edge Poker
Post by: Hiram on December 26, 2019, 10:34:30 PM: This was the first time I tried turning it on in 2 months and , still won't play . It says call attendant...then if I open and slam the door kinda hard to make sure the contacts catch , the message changes (I included pics of it) I tried that white CPU button , held it and then pushed it 3 + times , tried the reset key ...nothing. At least before when you all helped me wake it up , that white button did something and the screen showed a menu ..not now. Is there something I'm missing ?
Title: Re: New Problem for Players Edge Poker
Post by: Amechanic on December 26, 2019, 10:58:05 PM: When you push the little white button do you hear a ding or does your on screen message change? Iâ€™m wondering if that button could be bad/broken? For your machine have door optics or just respond to the large white door switch buttons? One thing with these machine, is that you should never have to slam a door.. That tell me that you have a bad door switch or that itâ€™s broken or out of adjustment.
Title: Re: New Problem for Players Edge Poker
Post by: Badbaud on December 26, 2019, 11:36:17 PM: The key on the side of the game is a Jackpot reset key.
It is used to reset jackpots only, it's other function is setting software options and enabling test operations.
Closing the door, lining up the door optics, is how the game errors are reset.
A extra coin out error means that after the game senses the final coin is counted and the computer removes voltage from the hopper motor the hopper motor is suppose to stop
spinning. A spring loaded plastic brake on the back of the motor locks the motor in place before any additional coins come out of the hopper.

Your hopper brake is sluggish and the spring brake is not stopping the hopper motor at once. The motor "coasts" and as it does it spits out a EXTRA COIN OUT.
Check your hopper motor brake, manually activate it and find out which pivot joint needs some light oil. Make sure the brake spring is tight, you can cut a couple of loops

off and re-string it if necessary.
Title: Re: New Problem for Players Edge Poker
Post by: jay on December 27, 2019, 12:43:45 AM: The white button is not going to do anything while there are credits on the machine or while it is in an error condition.

If you have a â€œcall attendantâ€ it generally means you are in a hand pay situation and a turn of the reset key clears it.
Title: Re: New Problem for Players Edge Poker
Post by: knagl on December 27, 2019, 01:12:02 AM: Quote from: jay on December 27, 2019, 12:43:45 AM
If you have a “call attendant” it generally means you are in a hand pay situation and a turn of the reset key clears it.

Per the pictures Hiram posted in Reply #99 (http://newlifegames.com/nlg/index.php?topic=21710.msg140607#msg140607), the machine is not in a hand pay situation -- it is displaying two different error messages along with the "Call Attendant" message -- they are:

- Coin-In Timeout
- Hopper Malfunction - Extra Coin Paid Out

There is also a "Door Open" notice on the screen.

First of all, Hiram, does the "Door Open" message ever disappear if you close the door? As was mentioned earlier, there is no need to slam the door. Hold the latch up, close the door, then firmly and completely slide the latch down. Does the "Door Open" message go away (regardless if other errors are still visible), or does the machine continue to display the "Door Open" message?
Title: Re: New Problem for Players Edge Poker
Post by: Amechanic on December 27, 2019, 02:30:00 AM: Can this machine have stacked error messages like a S2000 machine? If yes then maybe just opening and closing the door 4-5 times in a row will clear them?
Title: Re: New Problem for Players Edge Poker
Post by: Hiram on December 27, 2019, 01:07:02 PM: I started having problems with the machine months ago and learned that if I kinda slammed the door shut , it would clear and the game worked ...but that trick stopped. Now (if I remember right ) no matter what I do the door open stays on the screen at first ..then after I try opening & closing the door the other messages show up. Now you guys have me hoping this is a simple fix and nothing to do with the CPU ...I'll post pictures of the door contacts later ..could that be the problem ? ....Thanks for this Gents
Title: Re: New Problem for Players Edge Poker
Post by: jay on December 27, 2019, 02:50:25 PM: A new MPU board will run you between $50 and $200 Depending on where you buy it.
I have 5 of them with different game sets already installed.
I donâ€™t believe you issue is the MPU.
Not much in these units that canâ€™t be repaired.
Title: Re: New Problem for Players Edge Poker
Post by: Hiram on December 27, 2019, 11:44:59 PM: Thanks Jay , ..I just spend over 30 min with it again trying everything . When I first turn it on , it give the 1st CALL ATTENDANT door open message. I pressed the white button but as you all said , it does nothing. So I closed the door normally and the 1st message stayed there ---I opened it up again and slid out the hopper and slammed it back in , then slammed the door shut (not super hard though) and the message changed to the 2nd one about the Hopper BUT , this time I noticed that the Coins Paid went up by one coin (weird ) ..so I opened it , shut it off , turned it back on and the 1st message came up again ...I wiggled all the wires , the plugs ..1st message stayed up. Slammed the door again and poof ..2nd message pops up AND the Coin Paid went up another Coin !! I turned it on & Off ..closed the door (still 1st message) but this time I wondered if there was a Tilt switch so I grabbed it from the top and tilted it to me , then let it down a bit hard (not slammed though) and Yes , the screen went Blue , then the cards all came up , then the 1st message came up ..but this time , the Coins Paid went to 0. You all know I'm not a tech but , I've tried everything I can think of short of unplugging it and spraying it with Holy Water lol ...I'm hoping that something I wrote above will give you a clue to what's wrong ..this must have happened to someone else at some point. Could it be a door contact ? I only see one .....should I make a short jumper and try bypassing the contact to see if that's the problem ? I didn't change that battery on the board , maybe it started leaking ? . I took some new pictures and added them here ..you can see the payout change and the messages ...I appreciate the help with this and have my fingers crossed
Title: Re: New Problem for Players Edge Poker
Post by: Badbaud on December 28, 2019, 08:11:09 AM: If you pll out the hopper and plug it back in WITH POWER ON you will always get a "extra coin out".
Title: Re: New Problem for Players Edge Poker
Post by: Hiram on December 28, 2019, 08:44:53 AM: I think I tried it with the power on , and then off ...but I'll try it again with the power off just to be sure ..thanks
Title: Re: New Problem for Players Edge Poker
Post by: jay on December 28, 2019, 10:40:06 AM: You donâ€™t need to be slamming the unit around.
The machines are built for abuse (casino life) after all they are stealing your money and people get Pi**ed but tilting the machine forward and dropping it back is not healthy for anything. Even in a casino they are bolted to the stand. The monitor is connected much like the hopper is with a plug. The slamming could easily be shaking the video line loose giving the plain blue screen.

Per your posts you had a number of credits on your machine ~500
Perhaps someone â€œcashed outâ€ or you hit something that exceeded the max credits and the machine is now paying out, subsequently you are having hopper errors etc as it didnâ€™t sound like you used it much. [size=78%]Are there a lot of coins in the hopper. If not I would fill it up and let it pay out.[/size]
You might continue to get a hopper error every time it runs out but I would keep doing it until it finishes it cycle. An empty hopper brings up call attendant.

I would also look at that hopper brake per earlier posts.
Title: Re: New Problem for Players Edge Poker
Post by: Amechanic on December 28, 2019, 12:04:20 PM: I asked a question a few post back.. Can a Players Edge Machine have stacked errors like a S2000? With all the problems and turning it off & on, just makes me wonder if that could be one of the machines problems? Next I would check the white button with a multi-meter to see if itâ€™s working.
Title: Re: New Problem for Players Edge Poker
Post by: knagl on December 28, 2019, 02:53:51 PM: I don't think it does stacked errors like the S2000.

Coin-in timeout is an issue with the coin-in optics not correctly talking to the machine. If you have a loose connection to the optics, it's possible that you've been temporarily resolving that when you've been slamming the door, as you've essentially been jiggling the wires. As Jay said, please stop slamming the machine though -- there's no need to do that, and there's no tilt switch like on a pinball machine.

If the "door open" message never goes away, that's got to be the first thing that gets addressed, as you will never get errors to clear unless the machine detects the door as closed.

I would also recommend not removing or inserting the hopper with the power on right now, as that is just serving to muddy the real issue with your game.
Title: Re: New Problem for Players Edge Poker
Post by: Hiram on January 04, 2020, 01:19:34 AM: Guys , thanks for tracking this and I appreciate the help a lot . I know better than to slam it hard but at that point I was frustrated and hoped a nudge would get some results , it didn't. So now I kept it shut off and removed the hopper ...emptied out the coins and looked it over. I think I found the brake system on the back of the motor (2 plastic parts) they seem to be ok and I was very careful with them. I slid it back in the game without the coins and you can see the message . I tried the white button , nothing , no sound either (it never made any sounds before though since the audio has been off) I shut it off , turned it back on while holding the white button in ...again , same message. I wiggled all the connectors and shook wires carefully , even looked to make sure no wires were getting pinched when the door closes ..nothing. Changed the coin in the optic sensor ...no difference. The door sensors are not loose at all, they are in there tight but , when the door is closed and locked , I can still move the door about 1/8" + ...maybe that's the problem ? here are the pictures I just took
Title: Re: New Problem for Players Edge Poker
Post by: Hiram on January 04, 2020, 09:40:54 PM: would it help if I just bypassed that door sensor by soldering the wires together ? I know it sounds like I'm getting desperate here but ,I don't know what to do at this point
Title: Re: New Problem for Players Edge Poker
Post by: Badbaud on January 04, 2020, 10:20:02 PM: No, the optics are pulsed just to defeat that hack, shorting the receiver would prevent the pulse it is receiving from being seen by the CPU chip.

Get two pieces of insulated wire about 3 feet long.
Cut the wires on the door side transmitter optic.
Extend those wires an extra 3 feet, wire nut the wires together.
Hold the transmitter optic up to the receiver optic and see if you can get a door closed indication.
Title: Re: New Problem for Players Edge Poker
Post by: Hiram on January 04, 2020, 11:35:18 PM: I understand ...ok , I'll go to Home Depot and get some wire ...thanks for this Badbaud

:thank_you:
Title: Re: New Problem for Players Edge Poker
Post by: jay on January 05, 2020, 12:39:54 AM: I am not near my PE+ but doesn't the door-open message stay on after the door has been opened and closed. Until you put the first coin in the machine.
On the PE+ you should also be able to repeatedly press the white button until you get to a screen that has all the different tests - there are button tests, etc.
Title: Re: New Problem for Players Edge Poker
Post by: Hiram on January 05, 2020, 01:10:56 AM: back when it worked , all I had to do was close the door and the "door open" would go away and it worked ...until that message clears , it won't accept any coins. But when I first got the machine and that message was up , I could push the white button and different options would come up ...now , I can push that button as much as I want and nothing happens. I even tried holding it in for 15sec , nothing
Title: Re: New Problem for Players Edge Poker
Post by: Amechanic on January 05, 2020, 05:42:43 AM: Could the white test button have failed or gone bad? That would explain why nothings happening? Iâ€™ve seen the ones used on the 502 and 504 MPU boards for the S2000 slot machines go bad. Does the PE+ use the same door optics as used on the later S2000 slot machine?
Title: Re: New Problem for Players Edge Poker
Post by: Badbaud on January 05, 2020, 08:16:16 AM: +Vb and related electronics produces the door optic transmitter pulse.
Check your low voltage fuse 7 or 8 VAC I believe.
Title: Re: New Problem for Players Edge Poker
Post by: knagl on January 05, 2020, 02:04:53 PM: Quote from: jay on January 05, 2020, 12:39:54 AM
I am not near my PE+ but doesn't the door-open message stay on after the door has been opened and closed. Until you put the first coin in the machine.

No. The machine only says "door open" when it detects the door as being open.

This thread got marked as "topic solved" but I don't see any indication from the OP that it has been resolved. Has it been?
Title: Re: New Problem for Players Edge Poker
Post by: Hiram on March 06, 2020, 04:35:11 AM: Hi Knagl ...Nope , it has not been resolved ..it's still not playable. I didn't want to bug you guys by posting again and , I appreciate all the help here . Since I'm not a tech and don't even own a soldering iron , I did not want to risk affecting the wire insulation or worse , cut back the plastic and wrap a jumper wire ...so I unscrewed both of the door contacts and carefully held them together as you can see in the pictures I'm adding ...it didn't make any difference . I can push that white button or hold it and it won't give me the menu , won't reset ...that door message and call attendant thing keeps coming up. Maybe the contacts went bad ? ...I don't know what the hell is going on , just bummed. And now I'm starting to get an earful from the boss LOL (ugh) ...she really liked it . Here are the pics ---
Title: Re: New Problem for Players Edge Poker
Post by: Hiram on March 06, 2020, 04:40:27 AM: and now I might end up in real hot water because , I won another PE+ Poker ...she doesn't know yet . But , I couldn't pass it up for only $75 ...I can hear it now ...why'd you buy another one when these don't work ...oh boy :)
Title: Re: New Problem for Players Edge Poker
Post by: Badbaud on March 06, 2020, 06:26:28 AM: No door detect, if caused by a defective computer board, is easy to fix. Maybe you should send the board to my shop to get it working 100%?
Title: Re: New Problem for Players Edge Poker
Post by: Amechanic on March 06, 2020, 01:57:14 PM: Does this machine use the same optics that are in the S+ and S2000 machines?
Title: Re: New Problem for Players Edge Poker
Post by: Badbaud on March 06, 2020, 03:05:44 PM: The PE's I have seen in the shop used a mechanical switch but My Fortune II has the same optics as any other IGT. I guess it was the choice of the buyer to order with optics or without.
Title: Re: New Problem for Players Edge Poker
Post by: Amechanic on March 06, 2020, 03:20:59 PM: Just curious. I fix the Ceronix I his machine. I have optics here I could send if the are the same...
Title: Re: New Problem for Players Edge Poker
Post by: Badbaud on March 06, 2020, 07:19:43 PM: They are.
Title: Re: New Problem for Players Edge Poker
Post by: Hiram on March 07, 2020, 12:44:49 AM: hi gents ...so , my door switch might be an optical switch that went bad ? maybe I'm not understanding -----and by the way ...I told Lisa I bought the other machine lol ...she looked at me cross-eyed , not happy :fryingpan: ...then asked what it's going to cost for shipping and why don't I get interested in collecting stamps LOL ....think I'm ok though, especially if this one comes back on line
Title: Re: New Problem for Players Edge Poker
Post by: jay on March 07, 2020, 09:46:47 AM: A PE had a physical switch.

A PE+ has door optics. They are a security measure.
The fact that your white button is not working when the door is open seems like a different problem.
Bad door optics will prevent the machine from playing with the door closed but the button should always work the door open ?

Ave you tried turning your jackpot reset key ? With the door open then try the white button again.
If itâ€™s still not working try holding the button for 10secs and then releasing it you hear a ding.

If itâ€™s still not doing anything I would turn the machine off, pull the MPU board out.
Examine the back edge card if it seems excessively dirty then use a white pencil eraser to clean both sides.
In either respect Put it back in and see if the white button works.
Title: Re: New Problem for Players Edge Poker
Post by: Hiram on March 08, 2020, 03:26:00 AM: I just tried a few things that were mentioned plus took some new pictures incl close ups of the door contacts and of the board (I didn't see anything burned but) , I took out the hopper and removed the main board looking for contact pins I could use an eraser on ..I can't , they are small and in plugs so I can't get at them . So I replaced the board and made sure it was in tight , then slid the hopper back in and turned it on . I tried holding the reset key as mentioned -- nothing. I pushed and even held the white button in ...again nothing. Then I tried moving the door contacts around and shut the door --no difference , same message . It looks like my only option is sending the board to Badbaud for treatments . Here are 5 pictures and ,I'll add the other 3 pics incl the contacts on the door on the next post...hope this helps
Title: Re: New Problem for Players Edge Poker
Post by: Hiram on March 08, 2020, 03:27:35 AM: Here are the last 3 pics --
Title: Re: New Problem for Players Edge Poker
Post by: Badbaud on March 08, 2020, 06:45:30 AM: You have a PE PLUS poker, not a PE poker. The PE+ does use door optics and not a mechanical door switch.
There are electronic drivers and detectors on the main board relating to door detect that do go bad.
Yes, send the board, your optics could be fine.
badbaud
Title: Re: New Problem for Players Edge Poker
Post by: Hiram on March 08, 2020, 07:02:14 AM: wow ...Gents , I can't thank you all enough ..glimmer of hope and Badbaud you just made my day !! I'll follow your packing instructions and send it out Monday . I can't wait to fire this up again finally !!!
Title: Re: New Problem for Players Edge Poker
Post by: Hiram on March 27, 2020, 02:04:09 PM: UPDATE --Alan has been a huge help with this (and my other Game King) but ...this one is turning into a real nightmare. As you saw in my post above on March 8th , Alan had me remove the optic sensors from the door and send them with my CPU to him ...he changed that Battery , The CPU was ok and he mailed me back 2 new Optical door sensors with it. UPS took 9 days to get it back to NY (Corona Virus) and as soon as I got it , I carefully put everything back in place. Now it showed a new message - " CMOS DATA DOOR OPEN" ...I called Alan , he said push and hold the white reset button until the tone sounds ...I did , no tone. I held it for 4 min , no tone. Alan said the switch must be bad and the speaker could be fried so , he mailed me replacements . They came in fast !! He provided wire nuts , I installed the new white reset switch then the new speaker ..power it up ..same message , no change ..pushed the button , held it , no tone. Alan said it must be a wiring issue and I'd need to find someone here in NY. But I couldn't figure out how the game had been playing for months and this problem popped up ..he said connectors tarnish ..so I unplugged the game , and removed and plugged back in every connector I could find several times hoping to scratch them clean. He also told me to check the fuses ...It has 3 ..I looked and they all look fine ...he suggested I use an ohm meter ..I don't have one ..not sure if maybe walmart might. Anyway ..Alan suggested I remove the bottom Circuit board that the CPU plugs into and send him that board plus my CPU again ..so I boxed them up last night and sent them out today. ...you know ...most of us are stuck at home right now and many (like ourselves) are now out of work for 3 weeks - being able to enjoy the IGT would help take the edge of things -- but it seems like this machine has a mind of it's own and refuses to work. As I said on my other tread ..I can't thank Alan enough for taking the time and putting up with my phone calls and his trying to talk me through things . Post Office said he should have the box by Monday ...I hope he finds the problem on that back board ..fingers crossed ----and THANKS AGAIN ALAN !!
Title: Re: New Problem for Players Edge Poker
Post by: Hiram on April 04, 2020, 03:16:34 AM: I spoke with Alan yesterday ...he received my 2 boards and plugged them in- they work perfectly. So now we know my CPU and back board have no issues and the game has 2 brand new optic switches installed ...but the door open message will not clear so I can't play the game. Alan will be sending my boards back soon
What else could be causing this ?
Title: Re: New Problem for Players Edge Poker
Post by: Amechanic on April 04, 2020, 03:42:06 AM: Sounds like you might want to invest in a ohm meter, and start tracing the wiring looking for a broken wire. Iâ€™d start by tracking the optic wires back to the mother board. Quick thought. You donâ€™t have a door button stuck or broken. If you had the ohm meter you could be checking your reset key locks, to see if they are working.
Title: Re: New Problem for Players Edge Poker
Post by: Hiram on April 09, 2020, 01:46:51 AM: << GREAT NEWS !! >> ..After not working for about 10 months , we're finally able to play the game and it works PERFECTLY !!! After Alan changed the Battery and sent the Board back with the new door switches ..I plugged it in and had that new CMOS Data message ..and it wouldn't clear, the white button did nothing. So Alan had me remove the bottom Board the CPU plugs into and I sent him the CPU again with the bottom board ....he showed me a video where they worked fine. Alan sent the Boards back to me and I installed them last night and "POOF" , everything booted up and the game WORKS ..no more CMOS Data or door open messages ..nothing. It just eats quarters now the way it's suppose to LOL. I went upstairs and Lisa looked at me and said no luck again right ? ...she was starting to regret we ever bought the games ...I told her nope , it works Great !! She smiled ,ran downstairs and had a blast . She even built it up to 220 credits now :). This will help take the edge off our NY Quarantine !! Now at least 1 of the 2 games we have works and I am really hoping we can get the Game King going next since that offers other games as well ...fingers crossed on that one. Anyways ...I called Alan and hoped to catch him so I could thank him ..I have no idea what the problem was or if it was a combination of issues but ...I'm afraid to hit that white reset button or jinx anything so ...it works and that's the main thing..I'll leave the settings where they are. Guys ...thanks for all your help and putting up with my questions and frustration.
--Mike
Title: Re: New Problem for Players Edge Poker
Post by: Badbaud on April 09, 2020, 06:02:04 AM: Glad to help. The fix was to replace the power input header on the backplane.
Title: Re: New Problem for Players Edge Poker
Post by: Amechanic on April 09, 2020, 06:09:25 AM: Quote from: Badbaud on April 09, 2020, 06:02:04 AM
Glad to help. The fix was to replace the power input header on the backplane.

Great Job 👍👏👏👏👏
Title: Re: New Problem for Players Edge Poker
Post by: shortrackskater on April 09, 2020, 09:27:34 AM: This is great to hear!! :propeller: :applause: :applause: :propeller:
Title: Re: New Problem for Players Edge Poker
Post by: Stayouttadabunker on April 09, 2020, 11:06:16 AM: Seven pages, 135 Replys to fix a machine... :rotfl:
Title: Re: New Problem for Players Edge Poker
Post by: jay on April 09, 2020, 11:38:57 AM: Its fixed, and its all due to the kind participation to all involved and that is what matters. :applause:
Thank you for being part of the community.
Title: Re: New Problem for Players Edge Poker
Post by: Paul on April 10, 2020, 08:34:13 AM: That why itâ€™s a hobby. :duh:
No way we could make money this way. :24:
But itâ€™s fun. :applause:

Quote from: Stayouttadabunker on April 09, 2020, 11:06:16 AM
Seven pages, 135 Replys to fix a machine... :rotfl:

New Life Games LLC

**Video Poker, Keno, Slots, 21** Gaming machines => IGT PE and PE Plus Poker Games => Topic started by: Hiram on October 12, 2018, 10:46:11 PM

Video Poker, Keno, Slots, 21 Gaming machines => IGT PE and PE Plus Poker Games => Topic started by: Hiram on October 12, 2018, 10:46:11 PM