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**Reel Slots** Gaming Machines => IGT S and S-plus Reel Games => Topic started by: hornetgod13 on September 17, 2015, 02:15:06 PM
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My 1988 Double Diamond IGT S2000 Model # 5136A is near death and I hope I can get some technical advice to see if its worth saving. I acquired it in its current condition for next to nothing.
When plugged in it hums but, no lights, or reel action occurs. The service light inside and can be turned on but, that's about it. The black and white wires going to the door switch have been cut and another set of black and white wires have also been cut in the same area but, I can't seem to find what they go to.
Could the cut wires affect the game powering up or could they have been bypassed by a previous owner? Not sure if I should start with a mother board, power supply or a trip to the dump.
Can it be saved or should I cut my losses?
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It is not an S2000, it is an early model S+. When you power up, do the reels feel stiff when you try to spin them?
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The model description says "Stepper Slot". I have another slot machine that is S+ and the inside looks different. I thought this was a S2000. I'm learning.
I powered it up just now and checked the reels. They are free spinning. The hum more like a pulsing whine every couple seconds.
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With the machine off, pull the mpu up and out and check the battery. Got to start somewhere.
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The model description says "Stepper Slot". I have another slot machine that is S+ and the inside looks different. I thought this was a S2000. I'm learning......
Do your machine fluorescent lights come on? If not that is pretty basic, check all fuses and lighting starters. There is a power supply that makes the other voltages needed. But usually at least the general fluorescent lighting works. Usually there are fluorescent bulbs behind the lower glass, the upper glass and a smaller one inside the door to light the reels.
Pushbutton bulbs are lit by lower voltage from power supply. Maybe you can narrow down where the hum is coming from. Might be a good idea to show us some photos of the inside of the machine, someone may have removed an important part that is causing your problem, such as power supply, mpu board, motherboard, lighting ballast box, etc.
The IGT S and S+ models are similar but they have their differences. The S+ was made for several years and the later ones look somewhat different than the earlier ones.
All reel type slot machines (vs video screen) for some time have been "stepper slots". That just refers to the stepper motor that rotates the spinning reel. It actually moves the reel in small steps, many steps quickly one after the other to give the appearance of continuous movement.
The easiest way for me to tell if it is an S2000 is they have speakers mounted very visibly on each side of the outer corners of the machine, see below.
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also they didn't make s2000 in 1988
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Not all S2000's have the ears. The easy way to tell for me is the VFD display on the bottom left side of the reel glass.
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The OP mentions a 1988 model year. I am thinking this could possibly be a model S, not S-Plus. Another hint was when he mentions turning on a service light inside. The old S model had a switched service light in the cabinet, S-Plus did not.
Interior photo would tell the story. Easier to help when we can be certain as to what you have. the oldest S-Plus I have geard of was made in 1989, a year later than yours.
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I have an old style S+ that doesn't have a manufacture date on the tag. How do you date them then?
Dave
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Not all S2000's have the ears. The easy way to tell for me is the VFD display on the bottom left side of the reel glass.
Whoa, thanks for the clarification, I thought all S2000's had the "ear" speakers.
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The vision ready cabinets had speakers in the same place, but they were flat and flush with the cabinet
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look mom no ears
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I took some detailed pictures of the inside of the slot machine and discover a few more disturbing things. More cut wires and what appears to be one or two missing parts. I'll post the pictures and you let me know what its missing.
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Here are more pictures of with the hopper removed, cut wires, and the top end. Missing parts, cut wires and unused connectors.....
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A few more pictures of the wires. I'm not sure where any of them go or even what parts are missing. Does anyone have a link to a wire diagram of this model?
Do you think the missing parts can be sourced and is it worth saving?
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I should have done more homework before buying this one. I wanted to save some money and I like the challenge of fixing things. When I discovered the ad on craigslist, I thought this might be a good deal. It was listed as not working but, the seller had said it was just running last week. He had it listed for $175 but, I talked him down to $70. Below is a text response I received from him when I asked if it was available and the working condition.
"Yes it's available. We have keys, and it takes quarters. But we were playing it the other day and after we hit the jackpot the machine paid out the small amount of quarters we had in it and then we pushed the credit button, the machine shut off and hasn't powered back on. It may be a fuse or the back up battery. We know nothing about slot machines, but it did work well prior to this. Hopefully it's an easy fix if your still interested we can negotiate the price and possibly even deliver it to if needed. It is quite heavy."
Seeing the missing parts and cut wires makes me mad that he outright lied to me. Almost makes me want to drive to his house and chuck it out on his lawn. The better part of me hopes it can be saved. I just don't want to spend more than it would cost to buy another matching one that works.
I also have a working 1989 IGT S+ Double Diamond Deluxe to comfort me for now.
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It's possible that some of the wires and connectors go to things not needed for the machine to work. For example, there is usually a cable that goes from the machine down into the slot stand to sense the stand's door lock, that's where the casino keeps the overflow bucket for coins when the hopper gets full. For home use that cable is usually coiled up or cut off. And there is usually a player tracking panel above the spinning wheels in the top cabinet where you insert your player's slot card, the casino often removes that panel and the tracking equipment but leaves the disconnected wires that did connect to all that. And if the machine was originally part of a progressive jackpot there would be loose wires that connected to that removed equipment.
So I'd wait to see what the experts here that are familiar with your model of machine have to say, it might not be as bad as it looks right now.
With that said, it is always best to open the machine and look inside before handing over the money, especially since the seller said they had the keys. At worst, for $70 you got some parts that can be used on other similar IGT models. I'd think the glass, reels, strips and other assemblies would be worth that much.
I couldn't tell for sure from the photos, did you find the mpu board (main processor board) in the lower cabinet behind or on the wall near hopper area? It will be mounted to a large squarish metal plate, often has a black pull knob on top.
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MVCO I think you are right. That looks like an S slot not an S+.
Dave
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It is an S slot. Most of the time the cut wires and such are for player tracking and casino back end hardware that is removed before it is sold. I would check fuses to see if they are not blown.
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I checked the fuses and they looked good. A lot of bulbs were removed but I have replacements. Should I just replace the fuses even though they look good?
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I checked the fuses and they looked good. A lot of bulbs were removed but I have replacements. Should I just replace the fuses even though they look good?
test fuse with a meter to play it safe
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Another IGT lesson I learned today. I have never seen an S slot with the board to the left of the hopper like early S-Plus. So they must have done that at the tail end of the S run.
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Experts.... Looking at the pictures, is there anything missing that is essential?
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We need to have a look at the MPU board. It is located in a tray that is in the back of the machine. That silver looking tray that is toward the back of the machine mounted vertically. That holds all the slot logic, including the software. We need a picture of that to look for obvious signs of something gone wrong, since everything else looks good to me.
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Another IGT lesson I learned today. I have never seen an S slot with the board to the left of the hopper like early S-Plus. So they must have done that at the tail end of the S run.
That's an S, and the MPU board is along the back wall (or behind the hopper, if you prefer to say that), not to the left of the hopper.
(https://newlifegames.com/nlg/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi58.tinypic.com%2F25r01ky.jpg&hash=4dc485d2083fd6403bbc7c64e1df4ac4a903eb72)
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Yes, I caught that just after I posted. I mistook the Power Supply as the board. :wave:
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It's alive!
I pulled the mother board and discovered two starters, a screw, two nuts, several zip ties, multiple nickels, a quarter and, a Bill's Casino Lake Tahoe, NV dollar token resting against the back wall and mother board. The battery read 3.663 volts. I read out the fuses even though they looked good. The two 6 amp fuses read good but, the 8 amp fuse was bad! I reinstalled the mother board, replaced the blown fuse, cleaned the inside of machine, replaced nearly every light and starter. I turned it on and it lit up! It had a error message #62 BAD EPROM CHECKSUM. Cycling power ON & OFF two or three times will clear the message. It accepts only quarters. I hit 3 single bars and it paid out 15 coins from the hopper with no issues. Besides the occasional error #62 on start up the only other issue is the candle light (call attendant) is not working. Not sure if its the switch of light itself. I'll have to research how to change that bulb.
The Bill's Casino Lake Tahoe, NV dollar token might be a clue to where the slot machine was initially used. Could it have been a dollar or nickel slot at one time?
I attached a few more pictures.
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More pictures.
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Fantastic, glad you got it going. Good job and enjoy it.
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It's alive!
I pulled the mother board and discovered two starters, a screw, two nuts, several zip ties, multiple nickels, a quarter and, a Bill's Casino Lake Tahoe, NV dollar token resting against the back wall and mother board. The battery read 3.663 volts. I read out the fuses even though they looked good. The two 6 amp fuses read good but, the 8 amp fuse was bad! I reinstalled the mother board, replaced the blown fuse, cleaned the inside of machine, replaced nearly every light and starter. I turned it on and it lit up! It had a error message #62 BAD EPROM CHECKSUM. Cycling power ON & OFF two or three times will clear the message. It accepts only quarters. I hit 3 single bars and it paid out 15 coins from the hopper with no issues. Besides the occasional error #62 on start up the only other issue is the candle light (call attendant) is not working. Not sure if its the switch of light itself. I'll have to research how to change that bulb.
The Bill's Casino Lake Tahoe, NV dollar token might be a clue to where the slot machine was initially used. Could it have been a dollar or nickel slot at one time?
I attached a few more pictures.
Since you mentioned in a previous post that the seller had told you the machine had been working ok, then when they pressed the credit button the machine went dark and stopped working I'd look into that when you have a chance. That may have been when that 8 amp fuse blew. You might want to look carefully at the wiring on the credit button and nearby, there could be a bare or loose wire nearby that caused that to happen when the credit button was pressed. In some of your photos there were disconnected slip on wire connectors (pink color) on the inside of the door. Even though the connectors are insulated there might be an edge of the metal contact sticking out enough to touch the bare chassis metal somewhere. You can tape them up with electrical tape or some other way to isolate them.
This is good news, glad you hung in there. You can tie up or remove a lot of those cut and loose wires to get them out of the way. If unsure about removing the wire or cable you can just coil it up and wrap with a ziptie or something.
Previous owners may have changed the game denomination somewhere in the past. Or someone could have put those odd coins and tokens in there with the door open, hard to say. The battery 3.6 volts is good and they last quite a while. You are probably aware, but just to make sure, the blue adjustment knob on the mpu board controls the loudness of the game sounds.
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Do I go in the bottom or top to change the candle lights?
Should the occasional Error 62 concern me or should I learn to live with it?
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Do I go in the bottom or top to change the candle lights?
Should the occasional Error 62 concern me or should I learn to live with it?
On mine there is a little nut on top of the candle. Removing it allows the candle glass to be slipped upward and then I can get to the bulbs inside. Is yours like that? Also, there is a cable that goes from the bottom of the candle thru its base and into the machine, is it connected inside the machine?
The error 62 shouldn't be happening, you'll have to decide how big a pain it is as far as affecting play. Others here may have an idea what causes it. You could try removing the socketed chips and cleaning their little legs, then reinsert fully them back into the socket and see it that fixes it. The largest socketed chip is probably the microprocessor, the other medium-size socketed chips are likely eproms if they have a label indicating an IGT number on them. You'll need to be very careful if you do this, can easily damage things.
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Anyone have an idea how much it would cost replace the game EPROM?
I'll look at the candle light later today or tomorrow. Thanks for the assist.
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Depends on how you replace it......
You can get blanks for under $3.00
http://www.jameco.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/StoreCatalogDrillDownView?langId=-1&storeId=10001&catalogId=10001&search_type=jamecoall&freeText=27c256 (http://www.jameco.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/StoreCatalogDrillDownView?langId=-1&storeId=10001&catalogId=10001&search_type=jamecoall&freeText=27c256)
You read your existing chip and write it out to a blank. A PC and a Eprom Burner is all you need.
You can contact most of the dealers on this page and they could sell you a new ROM set for under $30, another member here might do you a solid and sell you a replacement for cheap. Make sure your profile is up to date with your email address.
If you are ordering from a dealer you might also be smart to ask for a SET and Clear chip.
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I got the candle light working (loose bulb). I think I'll play it for a while and keep any eye on the error code 62 on random start up. At least I know now that the permanent fix is affordable.
All the push buttons light up and function as they should. No blown fuses (so far). Perhaps a piece of the metal debris, I found, made contact with the motherboard blowing the fuse. I'll let you know if I have any other issues with it. I will remove or wrap up and loose or cut wires to prevent and other problems in the future.
I plan to swap out the coin acceptor too to take both tokens and quarters like my other slot machine.
Thanks to all that lent assistance.
Here is a picture with the candle light burning.
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In my picture below, the chip with the IGT numbers on it is the EPROM, right? Could I order a replacement based on these numbers alone?
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I had the same issue on one of my old S-Slots. error 62 would come up occassionaly at power on. Replacing the RS chip did the trick. Yes, you need to replace that IGT chip that has a number that starts as "RS". You could look for the same number as you have, but personally I like to use the highest payback percentage chip available.
Ebay seller JJ slots would know what number RS chip has the highest payout, and he has them in stock. For around 20.00 that would replace that chip.
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Yes and No........
IGT will not sell to you. You are not a Casino.
Most of the vendors on our main page will sell you a replacement chip.
Based on the picture you posted you have an SS105
However the IGT game bible does not have that number listed as a 3 coin or 2 coin version of the game.
http://www.newlifegames.net/igtbible/IGT%202CM/Game%20Library%20-%20S-Plus%20-%20Double%20Diamond%20(2%20Coin%20Multiplier).htm (http://www.newlifegames.net/igtbible/IGT%202CM/Game%20Library%20-%20S-Plus%20-%20Double%20Diamond%20(2%20Coin%20Multiplier).htm)
http://www.newlifegames.net/igtbible/IGT%203CM/Game%20Library%20-%20S-Plus%20-%20Double%20Diamond%20(3%20Coin%20Multiplier).htm (http://www.newlifegames.net/igtbible/IGT%203CM/Game%20Library%20-%20S-Plus%20-%20Double%20Diamond%20(3%20Coin%20Multiplier).htm)
There are two chips that make up the IGT set.
SS & SP
The first is known as the reel chip. It controls the number of coins and payback % - Its specific to the theme listed on the strips and glass.
The other is the game chip and many different reel chips may be compatible with it. Some themes like Double Diamond deluxe which nudges up and down depending on the direction of the arrow would use a different game chip that supports this feature than the regular version that does not.
By changing these two chips (along with glass and reel strips) you can change your slot into any theme you want. For instance I have 3 slots and 60 game kits.
I also do not have a SS105 PAR sheet (Par = Paytable and Reel) that would identify this theme.
Getting back to the issue at hand. It is possible someone re-wrote the chip and its label is wrong.
Your problem may also NOT be that chip. The type of error you are receiving is bad Eprom information.
There are another two CMOS chips also socketed. One is on your removeable MPU board and the other is on the motherboard that the MPU board is plugged into.
From a gaming regulation basis these two chips keep track of the slot accounting information and must be in sync to prove that no one has tampered with the game.
About every 100spins you will see the S+ slightly take a pause this is where the information is sync'ed between these two chips.
If you were to get a different MPU board with a different game theme and slip it into your machine you will get an error and then you clear it and things work. The clearing process syncs these two chips. This is not a big deal in the home slot world but in a casino any game changes are overseen by a state gaming regulator and taken quite seriously.
If I was a betting man I would be more suspicious of this CMOS set than of your Reel Chip.
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Isn't RS of the older 'S' vintage as opposed to the S+ ???
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Just looked at the pictures again. There is no bill validator. It could be an 'S'
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It is a "S" would that explain RS3438?
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It is a "S" would that explain RS3438?
the info I read is that yes, the RS type eprom contains both the "SS" and the "SP" info and they are used on IGT S machines like yours. So on your mpu board there will only be the one game chip installed. On an S+ mpu you would find both SS and SP eproms.
Pretty sure your machine is an S, your mpu doesn't have board edge connectors that plug into another board's (motherboard) connectors which is the way an S+ mpu gets connected. Your mpu has wiring cables attached to the mpu, this is the method used on S machines. Also your machine doesn't have a bill acceptor, which is typical of an S. Plus some of the experienced folks here have said earlier that they believe it is an S based on your photos. And finally, from what I've read the mpu boards that use an "RS" eprom were in "S" model machines from the factory. So it is an S, not an S+.
Also, I don't think you'd benefit from obtaining a SET chip, since it is only used to enable/disable the bill acceptor, which your machine does not have. I'm not sure if a CLEAR chip would be handy to have or not, they may not even be used on an S machine.
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I found JJ Slots website. http://www.jjslots.com/IGT-S-slot-RS-Game-Reel-chip-rs.htm (http://www.jjslots.com/IGT-S-slot-RS-Game-Reel-chip-rs.htm)
So I need the RS3438 chip right? What if I want to up the hit frequency or payout?
RS3436 95.084 Double Diamond 3CM
RS3438 90.105 Double Diamond 3CM
Does the higher percentage mean pay out or slot machine retention?
If I replace the chip is there anything else required (memory reset or restore)?
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I can answer one of your questions. The percent is the amount the machine gives back over the life of the machine based on however many millions of spins. A 5% payback difference will be noticeable to the home user mostly in an increased number of smaller wins
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I found JJ Slots website. [url]http://www.jjslots.com/IGT-S-slot-RS-Game-Reel-chip-rs.htm[/url] ([url]http://www.jjslots.com/IGT-S-slot-RS-Game-Reel-chip-rs.htm[/url])
So I need the RS3438 chip right? What if I want to up the hit frequency or payout?
RS3436 95.084 Double Diamond 3CM
RS3438 90.105 Double Diamond 3CM
Does the higher percentage mean pay out or slot machine retention?
If I replace the chip is there anything else required (memory reset or restore)?
Since you are going to replace the eprom anyway might as well order the one with higher percentage (RS3436), which is a higher slot payout to the player. That will make it more fun for whoever is playing since the wins will happen a little more often.
I don't think there is anything else you have to change when doing this, but someone will correct me if that's not right so stay tuned.
After you get the new eprom installed please let us know if that corrects the random error 62 you are getting, that will help future users.
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Great info. Looks like I'll go ahead and order the RS3436 95.084%
Its only $15.99 plus shipping.
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So you'll have about $100 bucks in this machine? I think you did ok! :cool_thumb_up:
PS> there is a dipswitch on your mpu, you might look into what options settings it gives you, there should be an IGT S manual online somewhere, or maybe someone here has a list showing the switch definitions. It might give you some choices that you prefer better over how it is set now.
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I already found a manual online. I've been studying it. Dip switch options are covered on page 4-11.
http://www.slotsdirect.com/igtmanual.pdf (http://www.slotsdirect.com/igtmanual.pdf)
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I already found a manual online. I've been studying it. Dip switch options are covered on page 4-11.
[url]http://www.slotsdirect.com/igtmanual.pdf[/url] ([url]http://www.slotsdirect.com/igtmanual.pdf[/url])
That's a nice manual. I snipped & attached the dipswitch settings chart to make it easier for others to see, for both the IGT S and the IGT S+ models.
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cowboygames (or other NLG staff) - can we get this IGT S manual uploaded to the NLG library, I didn't see one in there when I checked earlier?
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The S+ dip switch settings can be found on page 10-6.
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I already found a manual online. I've been studying it. Dip switch options are covered on page 4-11.
[url]http://www.slotsdirect.com/igtmanual.pdf[/url] ([url]http://www.slotsdirect.com/igtmanual.pdf[/url])
That's a nice manual. I snipped & attached the dipswitch chart settings to make it easier for others to see.
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cowboygames (or other NLG staff) - can we get this IGT S manual uploaded to the NLG library, I didn't see one in there when I checked earlier?
If you've got the file go ahead and upload it, as a contributing member you should have access
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I already found a manual online. I've been studying it. Dip switch options are covered on page 4-11.
[url]http://www.slotsdirect.com/igtmanual.pdf[/url] ([url]http://www.slotsdirect.com/igtmanual.pdf[/url])
That's a nice manual. I snipped & attached the dipswitch chart settings to make it easier for others to see.
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cowboygames (or other NLG staff) - can we get this IGT S manual uploaded to the NLG library, I didn't see one in there when I checked earlier?
If you've got the file go ahead and upload it, as a contributing member you should have access
Well, I don't see an "upload" button or choice anywhere, I can't see a way to do it when I visit the library. Admittedly I'm a little bummed and tired since Ark Razorbacks got their butt kicked tonight so maybe I am just missing how to do an upload. More likely I don't have full access.
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Well, I don't see an "upload" button or choice anywhere, I can't see a way to do it when I visit the library.
If you want to send it to me, I'll get it uploaded to the file library. I'll PM you my e-mail address.
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Well, I don't see an "upload" button or choice anywhere, I can't see a way to do it when I visit the library.
If you want to send it to me, I'll get it uploaded to the file library. I'll PM you my e-mail address.
ok, thanks!
PS> am I not seeing how to do an upload, or maybe I don't have that capability? either way is ok, but I think I'd prefer you saying I don't have the capability vs being too dumb to figure it out. :garfield:
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PS> am I not seeing how to do an upload, or maybe I don't have that capability? either way is ok, but I think I'd prefer you saying I don't have the capability vs being too dumb to figure it out. :garfield:
Actually, it looks like you figured it out, although due to the way the file system is setup it's not really clear where to upload stuff to, and you uploaded the manual to the Anchor Games > Wheel of Gold section. Don't worry, you're not the first person to do that. I did go ahead and move your upload to the IGT S Plus Manuals & Schematics category. I also found that what you uploaded was already in there in a different category, in the IGT Member Docs & General Docs category:
http://newlifegames.com/nlg/index.php?action=downloads;sa=view;down=985 (http://newlifegames.com/nlg/index.php?action=downloads;sa=view;down=985)
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When I did the upload I remember seeing the Anchor games name in the pulldown, I guess it is the default section shown when you get to that screen. So I clicked on it and selected IGT from the pulldown menu but maybe it didn't stay selected. I was looking for a way to put the manual into a section called IGT S games or a way to create a new section with that name. There were several IGT choices listed, most had the same name, didn't know why it was organized that way. And there were generic choices like "Manuals". Anyway when the uploaded finished I could see it in "MYFILES" area but not in the main library list, but I didn't look in the Anchor section.
Is the MYFILES section an area that shows you your uploads, and those uploads are also listed in the correct section, provided you selected the right section when doing the upload?
Jeepers - I thought CP/M and COBOL docs were hard to wade thru. :odie:
Thanks for fixing it!
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Is the MYFILES section an area that shows you your uploads, and those uploads are also listed in the correct section, provided you selected the right section when doing the upload?
Yes. When I look at the "MYFILES" section as I'm logged in, I see the files that I've previously uploaded to the file library.
I don't think standard users are able to create new categories. A moderator or administrator can. If there's ever a new category that's needed, let me or another one of the staff members (http://newlifegames.com/nlg/index.php?action=staff) know, and we can add a new category.
When I have some free time I'm going to clean up the category and sub-category names so that it will be easier to find the right place to upload files to. Right now there are several sub-categories simply called "manuals". While they make sense in the index as sub-categories to a main category, they only get listed as "manuals" in the drop-down to select where to upload a file (with no indication as to their parent category), which is where the confusion starts.
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That confirms what I was thinking about the categories in the dropdown menu.
Thanks for the explanation and for the work keeping things organized.
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I checked the fuses and they looked good. A lot of bulbs were removed but I have replacements. Should I just replace the fuses even though they look good?
Get a multi-meter. It doesn't take anything fancy. You can find one for $5-$10 that will work just fine. Much better than guessing!.
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I gutted all the old, unused wiring out of the machine and installed a new game chip. It's working perfectly now with no error codes. The new game chip has the highest payback available. I also installed an IMONEX coin accepter with the magnet removed so I can use the 1000 cherry tokens I just purchased. I prefer this type of accepter because it will take both quarters and tokens and has a great track record for both durability and hassle free operation.
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looks good! :cool_thumb_up: