Bally 1114 full restoration

[David Walz]

did you disconnect the capacitor and see what happens?

it's one of:

1] the capacitor is shorted
2] you have a wiring problem
3] the relay coil is shorted or way too low a resistance, so too much current is heating up the resistor
4] the 47ohm resistor is wrong

it's most likely a shorted cap or relay coil if the diode is failing.

Getting closer.
 
I found the wire between 13 and 15 was not attached. After I put that in, no more melt down like before. Now when I activate the handle release I get a small amount of smoke at start.

I am going to replace the capacitor, then the actual relay if need be, I just don't like to guess which one one it maybe. I can activate the relay on a bench test without any issues.

[wolftalk]

wire between 13 and 15?  You'd be shorting out the capacitor and relay coil if you did that.

the only thing visible between 13 and 15 is the capacitor.  Internal to the relay the coil connects between 13 and 15.

there's no way to know what relay was originally in the game.  The bally 5000 manual says part number for an ice cube "CR" or "C-R" style relay on the hopper was E-146-788.  The 2400 manual shows some CR relays as E-146-709.

if someone else looks in their game, it may or may not have been the original relay. 

[David Walz]

wire between 13 and 15?  You'd be shorting out the capacitor and relay coil if you did that.

the only thing visible between 13 and 15 is the capacitor.  Internal to the relay the coil connects between 13 and 15.

there's no way to know what relay was originally in the game.  The bally 5000 manual says part number for an ice cube "CR" or "C-R" style relay on the hopper was E-146-788.  The 2400 manual shows some CR relays as E-146-709.

if someone else looks in their game, it may or may not have been the original relay.

 

Back to the drawing board. I am really going to have to work on this mess.

[David Walz]

OK, just sat down and went over everything again. Good thing is time is on my side. 

It may look like a mad scientist was at work, however their is a reason for the insanity.

I took the ice cube relay and confirmed that it was working 100%, then I verified the open and closed contacts.
 I put the wires on the worksheet and written down which switches were open and which ones were closed.
I determined that the wires, switches were correct, also I determined that the capacitor, resistor and diode were in the correct place, and orientation.

So putting it together, the relay powers up with no problems. The wires don't have any shorts. I ordered a new capacitor and resistor since I eliminated everything else.

[David Walz]

The ice cube relay.

[wolftalk]

technically, that's an AC relay.  Try the 1315 series with the 48VDC coil.

finally found a spec sheet.  The 1310 has a coil resistance of 600 ohms.  The 1315 is 2600 ohms.

lots less current in the DC coil, which will make the resistor happier and the cap won't discharge as fast.

[David Walz]

technically, that's an AC relay.  Try the 1315 series with the 48VDC coil.

finally found a spec sheet.  The 1310 has a coil resistance of 600 ohms.  The 1315 is 2600 ohms.

lots less current in the DC coil, which will make the resistor happier and the cap won't discharge as fast.

Great, you helped me out, I really tried to figure this out, thanks.

[David Walz]

OK!
I removed the resistor, capacitor, and the relay. I replaced all three, and got the fire extinguisher close by. 

I ran the system check, and after the initial start up no smoking. I proceed to run the reels, then the hopper. I was keeping my fingers on the resistor until my table top shocked me.

So, the tilt light activates when the hopper is activated. The tilt light goes off when I activate the pull handle. This way I know the relay is working since the tilt light is wired into the relay. 

After burning up some  I finally succeeded with a lot of help from Wolftalk.

[David Walz]

Now, I really didn't like the idea of the relay being mounted where the wires are so close to the bottom of the hopper frame, so I inverted it up. Now the wires are protected, and we don't have to worry about the hopper smoking.

[David Walz]

The wires for the hopper were soldered to this part in the photo, supposed to be a fuse maybe, I need to figure it out. 

[wolftalk]

notice the labels that say "common", "normally open" and normally closed".

it's a DPDT switch (double pole double throw) - two switches that operate at the same time.  You'll have to see if it's momentary (gotta hold down the button) or if it's push and release to flip-flip the switch state.

if ya prefer the gottlieb terminology, it's two make-break switches that operate at the same time. 

to figure out why it was there, ya'd need to see what wires were connected to it.

wrt mounting the ice cube relay upside-down ... is there anything holding it into the socket?  If not, I'd stick a zip tie around it so gravity doesn't do it's thing.

[David Walz]

notice the labels that say "common", "normally open" and normally closed".

it's a DPDT switch (double pole double throw) - two switches that operate at the same time.  You'll have to see if it's momentary (gotta hold down the button) or if it's push and release to flip-flip the switch state.

if ya prefer the gottlieb terminology, it's two make-break switches that operate at the same time. 

to figure out why it was there, ya'd need to see what wires were connected to it.

wrt mounting the ice cube relay upside-down ... is there anything holding it into the socket?  If not, I'd stick a zip tie around it so gravity doesn't do it's thing.

I thought it was a regular DPDT door switch, that's why the syndrome.
The Ice cube relay is not going anywhere. 

[David Walz]

It's a door switch. 

[David Walz]

Back on the path of ferreting out more problems. 

[Badbaud]

Are those roll over cheaters I see on those disks?

[David Walz]

Are those roll over cheaters I see on those disks?

Unfamiliar with that term. 

I am assuming you are talking about the reels, and they have been remove, tossed out. In fact, the reels had the most issues, alignment from wear, missing rollers, pretty FUBAR before I sorted things out. 

[David Walz]

On to the next issue.
Pulling the coin switch down activates the COIN UNIT RESET RELAY and that's it, see arrow. I need to investigate why it's not completing the circuit. I did resolve the HOPPER CUT OFF RELAY fiasco, it's now working. So I'm up for another challenge.

[David Walz]

So now I have a total of 200 coins in the hopper.

[David Walz]

I had a issue with the other lock not functioning. I received this one in the mail and rekeyed it to my keys.

Have to get back to chasing wires again. 

[Badbaud]

Are those roll over cheaters I see on those disks?

Unfamiliar with that term. 

I am assuming you are talking about the reels, and they have been remove, tossed out. In fact, the reels had the most issues, alignment from wear, missing rollers, pretty FUBAR before I sorted things out. 

The reel index disks are the thing I am referring to.
I saw this done at some small downtown casinos I managed for a short time.
Lets say the big payout for the game is 777.
They take one of the 7 spots and block the gap that would allow a 7 to lock in.
It is called a "roll over" cheat. There is no way the game will ever hit a 777 payout.
The index arm rolls over the blocked disk notch.
When I saw this on multiple games, plus the extra coin cheat, where an extra coin put in is stolen by the game via a bolt placed just right instead of rejecting the coin and dropping it back to the tray I got the hell out of there.