Help with Bally 1008 72 model

[Akriegs]

Ballys 1008 72
i have a few questions regarding a craigslist find.
I Picked up game that i drove 400 miles to purchase .I plugged in and the bells were going off. I added coins and it paid off. I inserted quarter and pulled handle the wheel spun and finished rather quickly. I took out the entire wheel mechanism from the machine and spun manually. I put back and tried a new spin cycle. I noticed the wheels spin for a longer period than before.I also noticed the fan also spins for at least 5 seconds before it stops. Note  when i first plugged machine in a could insert quarter right after spin cycle had completed. Now i must wait until the fan stops before inserted and spinning again. Any suggestions??
Question 2 when a line hit is made the machine does not pay off and the winner paid light comes on and stays on. note that i did try manually to line the reels up for a payout and i was able to get 4 bars to pay out. I tried again but could not get to work. There are many combinations of 4 bars so some combos may work.
Some relevant info the hopper was bone dry when i first turned it on. The lock does not have a key so i cant close completely.
Any suggestion on how to fix? I have several Bally e series machines that have self test. I cant find any or even find a switch to turn on or off. I have to unplug to turn on or off.

[DavidLee]

There’s a switch related to the clock, if all the related mechanism moves slowly.

It will take longer for the insert coin light to come on.

It’s highly recommended to clean and or adjust no more than two areas at a time.
As if something happens and the machine becomes inoperable, then reverse diagnostics is manageable.

For the described situation do the following.

Clean all the mechanical parts that interact with other parts.
Just do this on the left side of the reels. See photo.
Possibly oil the clock gears.

[Akriegs]

The 3 places you recommend to clean are all coated with looks like white grease . Shouldn't that grease be there?
If not What cleaner do you recommend?

[DavidLee]

Remove all the old lubricant. Use a penetrating oil and or oil remover type cleaner.
PB blaster is a brand name with a few different use products.
I’ve used it along with machine oil.

Test a small area first and keep in mind some cleaners could effect non metal parts.
Light machine oil like 3in1 works well.
See photo of well running machine.

Remember only work on no more than two areas at a time.
I would consider removing all the old lube and re-lubing 1 area.

[wolftalk]

the 1008 72 is the serial number.  The model number is the top number.


you have a 1008 number plate, but the game isn't a factory 1008 since that machine was a 6 coin multiplier.  You may have a 1008 that's been modified for 3 coin play ... easy enough to hack the odds unit, replace the glass, and change the lamp wiring.  Got a picture of the lamp panel behind the top glass?


the reel tapes don't match any of the 1008 models I have info for.  There should be codes stamped into the slotted metal reel index discs ... what are they?


if the guts in the machine aren't a 1008, then trying to figure out what it is will let you match up a schematic.  For example, on a 1008-3 and most games, if the payout counter under the hopper doesn't reset, the winner paid light will stay on and the game will only pay if a later win is higher.


the EM games generally don't have power switches.  They were designed to be always on. 


the locks you can get from any of the parts suppliers, but if  you need more parts you may want to peek at the manuals to see what you are missing ... or post a picture of the inside of your door and someone can help.  There's a few pieces besides the lock itself that are similar to the parts on E series doors.


many of the manuals are on http://bingo.cdyn.com/slots/bally_manuals - the 2400 and 2600 manual should apply to your game.


if you poke around in http://bingo.cdyn.com/slots, you'll find a bunch of other paperwork like schematics for various models.

is that wire wound around the clock gear shaft next to the fan blade doing anything?  They didn't have a roll/tension pin so stuck a wire thru the hole and wrapped it around? 

when ya get done making sure all the stuff on the left side of the reel mech is sliding smoothly, look underneath.  All the stuff attached to the front shaft that the clock is slowly releasing during the spin needs to be moving and rotating easily too, or that can bog down the clock.

[Akriegs]

I did some cleaning up and left the machine plugged in for a while. The winner paid light is now off. The wheels spin without issues and the payout is now working. I took the back glass off and noticed that there is a little wheel that goes from 0-6 so i am assuming that WOLFTALK statement of having the wrong guts is most likely correct. Will this have any lasting affects on the payouts working in the long run? Do i need to make any other changes or will this be fine the way it is?
I attached the behind back glass pictures along with a shot of the wheels with the number 584/147. Any other relevant info i may need to know would be appreciated. 

ADDED>> as i was sitting reading other posts regarding 6 reel machines i could not think how my machine could handle that many reels. I have 4 reels and i cant fathom adding 2 more reels inside this tiny shell. I am still a little new to these old machine. Its almost older than i am.

[wolftalk]

not 6 reels ... 6 coins :-)


if the game is working fine, you are all set.  You don't have to read any further below :-)

tmi
----

your game glass is a 3 coin straight multiplier ... e.g. 2 coins doubles the payouts, 3 coins triples the payouts with no bonuses.  Looks like you have a 1008 machine, but it's been modified to only take 3 coins.


the 1008 had 6 columns of payouts for the 6 coins you could play, and if you played 6 there was a bonus pay for 7777.  On a nickel machine, max coin 7777 paid $2000.  The rest of the pays were straight multiplier, but I don't have a high enough res picture of a 1008 to see the pay table.


a pic of the lamp side of the upper panel is probably easier to see the vertical columns of lamps.


your index disc number looks like 584/247 ... is it 247 or 147?


584-247 index disc I don't have info on.  My docs stop at 584-160.  However, if it was a later model 1008, the number plate would say 1008-something for the model, so it's probably an aftermarket conversion.


your reel index discs and reel tapes definitely don't match the original 1008.  That used 22 stop P-684-[158, 159, 160, 161] discs, with different percentage payouts changing the first disc to 207 or 225.  Your game uses 25 stop P-584-xxx index discs.


in any case, you gotta assume the conversion was done correctly and the game will be fine.   There's no reason to revert the game back to 6 coin multiplier. 


If you have problems in the future that require the documentation to figure out, a schematic for any 1008 version will help, but your game won't match it exactly and certainly the reel wiring won't be right for the wiring between the reels and on the reel contact plates.

[Akriegs]

I went to Lowes and bought the cabinet and drawer lock for 5.88. Installed and the machine now locks. I played a few times and i noticed when i hit for 10 it only paid 9. I did this several times and they all paid 9. I hit 4 bars for 50 and it did pay 50. Very odd. Any ideas why only 9 instead of 10?
The wheels is definitely 584/147

[wolftalk]

the 584-147 disc was used on a game with code "3cm-mixed bars" and probably other games too.   3cm = 3 coin multiplier.


The tapes that match a game with that code don't have melon symbols, so I don't have any more documentation that would be useful.  Below is the index disc diagram which is not particularly useful either except it will help figure out what rivets the reels wipers should be sitting on for the tape positions.  You don't have a problem with that tho.


the second attachment is a payout disc used on a similar game.  Your disc should have an m-645-xxx number on it.  If it's not the same as the diagram, what is it?


when a 10 pay win is detected, the 10 trace on the payout counter would be energized.  As coins are ejected, the wipers (not shown) on the payout counter are stepping up/rotating counter clockwise on the diagram.  They should still be on the 10 trace after 9 steps, but step off the end on the 10th step. 


so, yank your hopper, manually reset the payout counter if necessary by pushing in the solenoid plunger on the back side, and then manually step up the thing 9 times / 10 times and see what the wiper contacts are doing.  Your hopper make be mechanically stepped by a linkage going up to a roller the coin lifts, or electrically stepped.  If electrically stepped, there'll be another solenoid with plunger on the back side of the payout counter.


typical problems are:
1] zero stop needs tweaking.  The zero stop is the position the wipers reset to.
2] end of trace is burnt/pitted
3] possibly the contact plate needs to be loosened and twisted a little, but not likely.
4] also less likely some stuff on the ratchet side of the unit is misadjusted and the first step of the unit is grabbing two ratchet teeth instead of one.  Zero stop can also cause this.


since you don't have smaller pays, just look at what step the wiper contacts leave the various numbered traces and compare to number on trace.  If they are all off, see how many ratchet teeth the first step is grabbing after reset.

[Akriegs]

I am kinda happy where the game stands now, it accepts quarters , spins and pays out. The next step for me is to clean the machine up a little. I noticed a lot of the light bulbs were missing or blown out. Do  you know the bulb type that needs to be used?
I have seen #55, #89, #873 for sale on ebay and some other sites. Some are ridiculously over priced. 10 bulbs for 60 bucks.

[DavidLee]

Check out what is in the machine presently.
Buy them by the box of 10 or 20 and they shouldn’t be more than a $1.00 each.

[Simple Sam]

I am kinda happy where the game stands now, it accepts quarters , spins and pays out. The next step for me is to clean the machine up a little. I noticed a lot of the light bulbs were missing or blown out. Do  you know the bulb type that needs to be used?
I have seen #55, #89, #873 for sale on ebay and some other sites. Some are ridiculously over priced. 10 bulbs for 60 bucks.

You obviously need to check your particular machine but the bulbs in the award glass are probably #44, the reel glass bulbs are #63 and possibly some #44, and the belly glass (and probably one in the reel glass) is going to be lit with fluorescent tubes. When you replace the fluorescent tubes, replace the starter as well.  You may want to consider going LED for the lights; I did a thread asking about LEDs and then my experience.  I'm pretty pleased with how the LEDs turned out and have added them to all of my games.  See this thread: http://newlifegames.com/nlg/index.php?topic=29173.0


Looks like your coin tray light isn't working.

[wolftalk]

the common 6V mini bayonet style lamps are 47, 44, and 55 in order of dimmest to brightest (and hottest).  You can use any of them, but 55's tend to make burn marks on the ink and speed up ink cracking.  The pinball guys generally replace them with LED's or a dimmer lamp to save the glass and plastics.


a box of 10 of any of the above should be around 2-3 bucks at the pinball parts suppliers or ebay.  Shipping costs more than the lamps.


the 63's are also on the 6V circuit, but have the big bayonet base.


an 89 is a 13V lamp, and an 1873 is 28V.   I don't recall any EM slot that uses those.


if you want bright, LED's are the way to go and won't have any heat issues.  Sam's post covers the details.   



the flourescent tubes lighting the reels are 120V.  LED replacements are available for those also, but you need to remove/bypass the ballast and starter when using them.

[Akriegs]

I ordered 44/47,  555 mini and  63 super 7v ac/dc bulbs from cointaker. I hope i order the right ones. I took the belly glass to check bulb and it appears to be working fine. Where do i find the coin tray light assembly so i can see if there is a bulb present or not?

[wolftalk]

a 555 lamp has the rectangular base ... your machine has some of those?


the 47/44/55 base is round.


if you oopsed the 555 purchase and have no use for them, I'll buy them from you.  Use them all the time in pinball machines.


assuming your front door is like most, the coin tray lamps are behind a couple rectangular plates near the bottom of the door which you remove the screws to take off.   Part #52 and #53 in the bally 2400 manual on page 80 (download manuals from http://bingo.cdyn.com/slots/bally_manuals/)


post a pic of the entire inside of your door if not sure.

[Akriegs]

I attached the bottom of the door. Can you circle the screws needed to replace the bulb for coin tray? I also attached the coin in bulb that needs to be replaced. Are these the 63 super 7's?

[DavidLee]

The lights are behind the covers circled in red.
A few of the screws are missing, but no big deal.
The chute assembly will most likely need to be removed.
Make note of the adjustable coin slide plate located below the coin chute.
This would be a good time to clean the plastic rectangular lenses.

[wolftalk]

I also attached the coin in bulb that needs to be replaced. Are these the 63 super 7's?

yup.  Those are the large Ba15S bayonet sockets - about 5/8" (16mm) in diameter.   The 44/47/55's use the smaller Ba9S socket which is around 3/8" (10mm).


the glass part of the lamp also has a code for it's shape.  A 63 is a G-6,  the 44/47 is T3-1/4,  the 55 is a G4-1/2.