Author Topic: 809 project questions (Read 8746 times)

Amechanic · « **on:** March 07, 2015, 06:40:18 PM »

Ok, I've had this one since last fall.. It's a Bally 809 fruit.. When I first got it, the machine did pay out anything over the cherries.. After adjusting the reels wipers it started to pay out on all combinations, but only on a single coin.. I've removed the feature and hooked up my extension cable.. The feature is resetting on the first coin, and advances on coins 2,3,4, &5.. I used my meter on the features contacts, and the all show to be working? The lights on the front of the feature don't advance, they always stay on coin 1? I do not see any of my odds units rotating? They are not frozen, and rotate nicely.. I have also noticed that it will pay coins and shut off, but not by lifting the coin roller.. This hopper is not 100% mechanical on counting coins, it has blade switches that open and close as the coin are paid, but they do not advance my spiral cam? If I push down on the solenoid, the spiral cam advances and shut off..
I'm wondering if the no advance of my feature lights is tied into the same circuit as my hoppers blade switches not working? I've never had a hopper with this type of setup on the payout roller, blade switches instead of the click/lever type switch.. What am I missing?? I'm not sure what relay controls those contacts for counting coins?

Gary

The Fatman · « **Reply #1 on:** March 07, 2015, 08:35:31 PM »

I would check the Zero switch first and then the set of switches in front of the coil on the fan side of the mech. The switch stack and the switches above them should be right (no pitting on the contacts). I had an issue there that would only take 1 coin and not advance on any other coins. `The set right behind the spring should cose at the last second of the travel of the arm and the shortest period of the star ratcheted wheel (randomizer). This changes the timing of the stoping of the reels but the switches should close after the last reel stops at the longest time of running. If it stops too soon you dont get a proper payout or one at all depending. Now this wont effect the advancing of the lights across to header for the 5 coins. I would check the advnce unit behind the front board. If you dont have jumpers for the unit, you can unscrew it from the frame and look into it. I am thinking you might have a beau plug connection problem because out of the blue it didnt work right anymore. I had one like that and had a bad connector on one of the pins and when I pullet the unit out, the pin slid out and I saw no problem. It want until I started tracing the wires for that circut and when I got to the plug, it moved inside the plug. So when I slid the unit back in, it pushed it back and didnt make a good connection. I got lucky finding that one. Since you worked on the wipers as well, you can check them to make sure they are contacting the boards well. Pull the small arm out gently and let it go. I t should snap back. Be sure that the advance unit in the top works well with the switches making contact. I had intermittent problems with my 809 and it took a good while to get them all fixed. The 809 was one of my first machines and OldReno and the repair logs from others really helped getting it going again. Ultimatly, it was a pitted switch on the switches in front of the coin stack, that looked like it made good contact. Moved when the switches closed, but it made no contact. Had to file that switch down to get rid of the pits on both sides, and its been working fine ever since.
Hope all this helps ... I know its not your first rodeo but it aint mine either, and I can use all the help and ideas I can get from NLG's members and the repair logs.

Dave F

Amechanic · « **Reply #2 on:** March 08, 2015, 07:18:05 PM »

Well Dave those switches all test working.. I was able to get the coin lights working for a bit, but I seem to have a badly worm 30 pin beau plug on the hopper. I'm hoping to have enough spare connections to repair the problems.. I also noticed on closer inspection that I only have 1/2 of one of the reels round male beau plug pins.. I did get to see my odds unit work twice, and the hoppers payout switch to work twice too.. So it looks to be mostly the hoppers beau plug.. I'll try to do the repairs on Monday..

Gary

The Fatman · « **Reply #3 on:** March 08, 2015, 08:14:16 PM »

When you have the intermittent problems like you are having, good chance it is a beau plug. Keep "plugging" away and let me know how you progress with it.
Dave F

Amechanic · « **Reply #4 on:** March 09, 2015, 09:37:18 PM »

Well I repaired the questionable connections on the hopper beau plug. Now my coin light work as the should, but I'm still no closer on why I only have single coin payout, no matter if I play 2,3,4 or 5 coins.. The stepper advances for each coin played.
Does anyone have a Fruit 809 machine that I could get a picture of the top box feature unit? I noticed that it has a couple taped off wires on one relay stack, like a set of contacts were removed on the top switch. I did also notice that 2 wire from my features stepper are removed and nicely shrink wrapped on the side? Hopefully if I can get a picture or two of another 809 stepper I can see the wires colors. I think tomorrow's game plan is to check the operation of all the features contacts on the machine.

OldReno · « **Reply #5 on:** March 11, 2015, 12:51:07 PM »

Gary, the odds unit selects which of your X-units for payouts. You should be able to trace the wire from each individual X-unit coil back to the odds disc. If they don't get signal from the disc, they won't advance, and won't send pulse down to payout counter step up coil. Send pics of what you got in the top unit.

Amechanic · « **Reply #6 on:** March 12, 2015, 09:51:47 AM »

I think that this machine has had the top feature unit replaced at one time in it's life.. The number on the side of the unit in marker doesn't match the letters after the 809 on the machines cabinet.. Also on the side of the feature unit it mentions 7's.. My machine doesn't have 7's as the high payout, mines a triple bar... Here are pictures of my top box feature unit.. You can see where wires have been cut off, and the others going no where..

Amechanic · « **Reply #7 on:** March 12, 2015, 09:54:51 AM »

a few more...

The Fatman · « **Reply #8 on:** March 12, 2015, 10:10:02 AM »

If you look at te ods relay pic, you will see these contacts look rough. A little bent and could possibly need a file and burnish. This is on the biger round contacts. They can take refileing and burnishing but the small ones it is not suggested. The heavier switches, like the heavy end of stroke switches in a pinball, can get pitted and not seat well. This picture shows that to me.
Dave F

The Fatman · « **Reply #9 on:** March 12, 2015, 10:11:24 AM »

Amechanic · « **Reply #10 on:** March 12, 2015, 11:45:38 AM »

Dave,
I took those pics before I took the relay stack off to check. I did straighten clean and inspect those contacts using my VOM on ohms to check for any resistance. They all show a good contact with a zero (0) on meter.. My next thing to check might have to be my beau plugs wiring to make sure I don't have a wire loose, or crossed? Wire by wire, and color to color.. I did fix out one new thing and its not a good thing. For some reason the only bulbs in my feature unit were the two on the far left that shows payouts. None of the 1-5 coin were in. I put bulbs in and found out why?? When they powered on it was a bright flash and they blew up?

Gary

The Fatman · « **Reply #11 on:** March 12, 2015, 03:34:33 PM »

Somehow 50V might be introduced to that lamp circut. Dont think 110V would be present since it runs the florescent lamps. Might have a shitch touching one that is involved with a coil. I would look really well at the odds unit and its switches. As you mentioned, could be a crossed wire or one broken off a Beau plug resting on a coil connection wire. ALso might just be shorted to ground. I have found a dime on a machine that had been over fused and the dime was welded to the bracket and was blue. Almost burned out the transformer, staarted to drip wax right be fore I bought it. That was a 100$ discount for me.
Let me know.
Dave F

OldReno · « **Reply #12 on:** March 12, 2015, 11:22:44 PM »

Gary, remember that you can remove the 4 screws holding your top unit light board in place, and drop it down so that you can watch the action. Coin it and play 1 through 5 coins, and ensure that the odds disc does step up the right amount. I note one of your odds disc solenoids has been replaced by the burn marks on the white toothed gear, so it may be resetting itself as you play. Probably not though.
I want you to notice if any of the X units moves during a payout when you play 2 3, 4 or 5 coins in the machine and set up a pay.
When you play 2 coins, the x2 moves for every coin out, but the hopper steps only once per 2 coins out.
X3 is same but with 3 coins played, it steps one step for every coin out, and only steps hopper once out of every three coins one time.
etc.
IF your odds disc steps right, then it should select which x unit to use. Note, only one x unit should be on at a time.
Keep us informed. Good luck.

Denny · « **Reply #13 on:** March 14, 2015, 10:55:24 AM »

Gary, Do you still need some pictures of the top box of an 809 fruit machine ?? If you do let me know and I will dig mine out and take some shots for you. Anything in particular that you need???
Denny

Amechanic · « **Reply #14 on:** March 14, 2015, 02:41:31 PM »

I'd gladly take the pictures.. Is your a fruit machine with or without 7's? Mine doesn't have the 7's and only pays left to right.. I have seen some fruit machine with the 7's that pay both L-R & R-L.. I'd like to see pictures if the relay stack, and the odds disk contacts and wiring around the outside..

Thanks Gary

Denny · « **Reply #15 on:** March 14, 2015, 03:04:32 PM »

Gary, It has NO 7s and only pays left to right so we are on the same page. I am away for a few days but should have pictures by Thursday. You can see my 809 in my profile pictures.
Denny

Denny · « **Reply #16 on:** March 19, 2015, 09:58:33 AM »

Gary, here are the pictures of my 809 fruit machine. Man, there are a hell of a lot of wires so I hope this helps. If you need other more specific places let me know. GOOD LUCK !!!
Denny

Denny · « **Reply #17 on:** March 19, 2015, 10:01:02 AM »

Gary, Here are 2 more shots. If you need something else let me know....... Denny

Sunrise Side · « **Reply #18 on:** March 19, 2015, 10:38:05 AM »

Denny , It's amazing there is machines out there in factory fresh condition at over 40 years old like the looks of yours. Amazing!

Amechanic · « **Reply #19 on:** March 19, 2015, 10:39:30 AM »

Denny,

Thanks for taking the time to get me those pictures. I already see that there are many differences between my feature unit and yours. You might want to get some oil or contact grease on those contacts. I see a lot of brass shaving on the wiper board.. I found that Pinball Resource has a nice contact grease that works well..

Gary

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Author Topic: 809 project questions (Read 8746 times)