Bally 742A - Coin Switch not registering

[nullvalue]

So I acquired this machine today..  seems in pretty good condition but I've never owned a slot before and know next to nothing about them. I do have a pretty good understanding of electrical components, schematics, etc though. I plugged it in, it lighted up - dropped a quarter in, pulled the handle.. everything seemed to work. Even got a couple of doubles and the payout seemed to work.. then it stopped taking my coins. Well, it would take them (and deposit them to the hopper), but not 'register' that I deposited (the coin accepted light does NOT come on, no relay sounds). I do have the key, so I opened it up - first thing I thought was to try manually triggering the coil accepted switch.. Nothing. I got out my meter and verified the switch itself is working fine. I have got it to work a few more times (powering off, on, playing with switches etc) but can not find a rhyme or reason for when it works or not... Not really sure where to go from here and looking for some advice.. I have no idea when this machine was last used let alone serviced. Maybe it's just dirty/corroded contacts or something simple but wanted to ask first.
 
 Also does anyone have a checklist of things to do when restoring one of these EM machines?
 

[wolftalk]

paperwork by model number can be found in http://bingo.cdyn.com/slots/ - grab one of the 742A schematics (they start with w-1046-) and you'll have no problems.


there's also a directory with many bally manuals - http://bingo.cdyn.com/slots/bally_manuals/ - you'd want the bally 100 revised, 1000a and the intro, troubleshooting manuals.
 
what's the full model number on the plate underneath the handle (top number is the model, bottom is the serial)?  I have more paperwork that hasn't been processed yet, so I'll check if you have the number ... or at least can suggest which of the other few hundred 742A models are close to what you have.


for the 742A's, triggering the coin switch should cause the coin relay to trip.   Coin relay is on the left side of the reel mech at the bottom. 

one of the switches on the coin relay will turn on the "coin accepted" light.  Another switch on the relay - an SPDT with blue/red wire on the center/pole blade connecting to black/yellow wire when relay is untripped - is the only thing besides the coin switch that is in the circuit ... except the plug connections. 

It's usually a good idea to yank the reels and hopper and see how cruddy the plug pins are.  Cleaning the pins can make a bunch of intermittent issues go away.

it's pretty common to need to clean dried up lubricant off the mechanical parts and relube.  The manuals have some info on what they used back in the 1970's, but you can use more modern stuff.

wrt to interpreting the schematic, the following will help things make sense and is location of some of the pieces:

1] the coin relay and handle release relays are trip relays.  When the coils power, the relay armature is released and all the switches change state and stay changed when the coil power is removed.  Those relays are mechanically reset during the reel spin.

2] the coin lockout coil is behind the coin mech, and it pulls a tab out of the mech when powered to allow coins to be accepted

3] the payout counter on many games - including the 742A's - is mechanically stepped up by a coin ejecting from the hopper.  The payout counter is electrically reset.

4] the coin relay is on the left/rear side of the reel mech.  The reel mech A, B and C switch stacks are above the coin relay.  A is vertical near the back, C is vertical closest to the front.  B is horizontal in between.

5] payout relay is under the hopper with the payout counter.

[nullvalue]

what's the full model number on the plate underneath the handle (top number is the model, bottom is the serial)?

Thanks for all this great info! I'll start by cleaning up the pins. I have a can of DeOxIt contact cleaner which should work well.
It looks like the full Model # is 742A-10. ("742A-" is printed, and the "10" is stamped). It appears to have a mfg date of 3/24/1969.

[nullvalue]

UPDATE: So the pins looked very clean to me, but I cleaned them anyways. Put it back together and started playing - wow! i thought that was too easy... then same problem started happening after about the 10th pull. So cleaning those pins didn't help. Is it possible the coin relay is bad/going bad? Can it be easily replaced? I see how it controls the armature which changes the switch states. If I engage it manually, then put the mech back in, I am able to do 1 pull.

[nullvalue]

Another update: I probably should have done this at the same time, but I used the contact cleaner on all of those switches.. Things seem to be working much better now.. done like 100+ pulls now and it keeps working. Even spits out the right payout.

I seen a video on how to hold the flywheel and align to whatever you want the end result to be. Jackpot works.. but silly question... other than a power reset, how do you reset after a jackpot? Bell keeps on ringing..

[nullvalue]

I also have a bit of an annoyance that the reels do not seem to line up with the horizontal line - you can kind of see this in the picture I took. They are above the line - can this be adjusted so they stop more in line?

[wolftalk]

according to my list, the 742A-10 left the factory with tic-tac-toe reel strips and went to the Sands casino.


sometimes when the games were sold off by the casinos, part of the deal was to make them generic machines.   Sometimes just a reel tape and glass change, sometimes a more significant change to alter the payback percentage.


the game could also be assembled from various pieces, but if done right the payout will be consistent with the glass. 


all you know at the moment is where the cabinet came from.  Stamped onto the slotted reel index discs should be P-484-xxx numbers, and the payout counter contact plate should have an M-645-xxx number on it.  If you are really lucky, someone wrote model info on the reel mech and/or hopper, and the reel wiper boards or wiper arms may have numbers on them.  If you get a chance to look for those, that'll help narrow it down.   It you write down or video the reel tape symbols from top down (top is where the visible tuck under line is), that'd help too.


unless the machine locks up for a hand pay - you glass says it doesn't -  the jackpot bell usually stops as soon as the payout is over.  If the hopper empties before that happens, the bell will keep ringing.  Does yours keep ringing until you spin again? 


wrt the reel tape alignment, I don't remember how much you can move the reel tins relative to the index disc.  Phan000 just did it tho, so you may want to pm him -
http://newlifegames.com/nlg/index.php?action=profile;u=7118

maybe the glass is sitting too low?   There's other guys with way more experience with the machines that'll hopefully be able to tell you.

[nullvalue]

The payout does in fact seem consistent with the glass. Regarding the jackpot bell, that's probably the problem - I don't have it loaded with enough quarters to spot out the full jackpot.
 
 The payout counter contact plate is marked, M-645-96. I couldn't find anything like you described stamped into the discs other than "1M H". I did however find a tag attached to reel mech.. it says E537-272 CABINET Su 19 #1-G. On the other side it says 1348 B. P.
 
 Both the hopper and reel mech are marked 1-G. On the hopper there appears to be a number handwritten, I think it says 2082.
 
 Hope this all means something.. thanks!

[wolftalk]

it'd be really nice if you decided the serial number plate said 742A-1G instead of 742A-10 :-)


the 1-MH in the index disc is the "stamp" value for the -1G game.   The stamp value was bally's abbreviated code for the model of the game.  MH was "money honey".


below is part of a page of reel tape specs.  The -1G used either [33,34,35] or [33,34,36]  - you can count the number of lemons on reel 3 or look at the symbols per the spec to see what you have.  The index disc for reel 3 should say 3-MH or 3A-MH


changing two bell symbols to lemons changed the game percentage from 82.475% to 80.67%


unfortunately, I don't have paperwork for the -1G.  The reel tapes, index disc and payout counter disc diagram is the same as the 1J on the bingo web site.  The reel wipers and schematic are different.  The 1J schem should be really close, and it's possible the main difference is removing the obviously added things on the 1J schem.  Since the schems were hand drawn, they normally took a previous one and modified it to make a new one.  Some schems you can see the erasures or white-out and a scanner picks up what was originally there :-) 


The reel wipers I don't know.  If ya get bored and want to take as many pics as you like of both sides of the reel wipers/contact plates and email them to slotpics@cdyn.com at as high a resolution as possible, that'd be great.  You can post here too, but the size limits can be a problem. 


reel wiper pics a bit awkward due to the spacing.  On the wiper side need the wiper left edge to see which fingers are connected together, and the wiring side need to see the wire colors attached at the top and which rivets they connect to (as best as the angle allows).


Also a pic of the entire payout counter including the wire colors attached around the edges to see if the connections are different than the drawing since they used the same disc on many different games.

[nullvalue]

it'd be really nice if you decided the serial number plate said 742A-1G instead of 742A-10 :-)

Haha you're absolutely right, I misread it. It does say 742A-1G! I'll get those pics up here.

[DavidLee]

Regarding the reel tape alignment.
Reel tapes loose within the crimping retainers will gradually slide out of position.
It might be possible to slide them back into position using lite pressure with your fingers.