Bally Gold Rush - Runaway Hopper

[big_e]

Hey guys, I have a Baslly Gold Rush.  I can setup any number of pays and it will pay like normal, the WINNER PAID light comes on, but then the hopper will continue to run and turn.  No coins come out but the motor runs.  This will happen for about 30-60 seconds then it stops.
I am baffled.  Its like there is a timer or something that counter revolutions of the hopper.  Sometimes it never stops.  But it always pays right, and light comes on indicating such.
E

[off-track]

I can setup any number of pays and it will pay like normal, the WINNER PAID light comes on, but then the hopper will continue to run and turn.  No coins come out but the motor runs.  ... <snip> ..  But it always pays right, and light comes on indicating such.

I'm a little confused by the statements "pay like normal", "no coins come out" and "pays right".  How can it be normal and right if no coins come out or, are you just referring to the machine recognizing that it should pay out but doesn't?  If that's the case, have you verified that the coin wheel is turning and that there isn't a jamb under the knife.  I had that problem with my Bally nickel machine once and it turned out to be a penny somehow made it into the hopper and created a jamb.

[big_e]

Sorry for the confusion.  The game pays as normal, then the WINNER PAID light comes on.  Then the hopper continues to run and turn, and no more coins come out.  The hopper knows it paid correctly and stopped spitting out quarters.  But the motor keeps turning.
If I interrupt it and play again it will stop.  Then do the same thing if I win.
E

[GOS]

sounds like there is a mixer relay on this hopper - do not have the wire diagram for this model so someone else can chime in

[Amechanic]

Sorry for the confusion.  The game pays as normal, then the WINNER PAID light comes on.  Then the hopper continues to run and turn, and no more coins come out.  The hopper knows it paid correctly and stopped spitting out quarters.  But the motor keeps turning.
If I interrupt it and play again it will stop.  Then do the same thing if I win.
E

Can you post a pic of your hopper... I don't see how it can continue to run and not feed out coins? The games too new for the early style hopper with the solenoid and diverter..

[big_e]

Thanks.  I am at work and will snag a pic of the hopper later.  It does have a diverter so as soon as winner paid light comes on, it continues to run and diverter releases and coins fall back into hopper.
Mixing relay?  This would explain why my continental occasionally runs for no reason.  I figured something was messed up with that too. lol
E

[big_e]

OK I still have not made it home, but have been thinking about this long and hard.  One thing I was messing with was this little micro switch on the side of the payout cam.  Looks like it toggles every 5-10 increments of the payout board.  It was cracked, so I put a new one in and adjusted so it actually clicks each time it hits a dip in the cam wheel.
I also looked at my continental schematic, not that its the same but maybe its close.  I do have a coin override that puts the coins back into the hopper after a payout.  And this functions correctly.  So if you look at the schematic, the payout relay MUST drop out, because the override solenoid does also.  But the motor keeps running.  So what in this circuit would do that?
I am curious how this delay relay works.  IF i somehow could be stuck closed.
Ill post more when I get home, but I cant stop thinking about this.

E

[Amechanic]

Check the operation of your hoppers payout relay. The spacer that keeps the contacts separated can melt if your is the white plastic type. It’s possible that you just need to clean and adjust the hopper relay.

[Jim]

that small micro switch resets the safety timer motor. depends where the timer is set, on a large payout it needs to be reset or if it isn't ,it will shut down the entire machine. this was put in place to prevent the hopper from paying out everything . If the timer is allowed to reset, it removes all power from the machine and puts that red neon lamp on, then when you press the bar that runs underneath the hopper. it will reset the timer and restore power.  This typically happens on large payouts and not enough coins in the hopper to cover it. the safety timer motor also works in conjunction with turning on and turning off the hopper motor.

Jim

[big_e]

Can you post a pic of your hopper... I don't see how it can continue to run and not feed out coins? The games too new for the early style hopper with the solenoid and diverter..

Here are some Hopper pics.  I watch this happen and it runs for about 10-20 seconds then the relay on the FRONT pic drops out and it stops.

[DavidLee]

Check the payout relay on the upper left back side of the hopper. This is one point where the higher voltage is switched to run the hopper. Possible motor contacts need to be adjusted slightly apart.


The machine pays correctly and the hopper keeps running, but no coins cycle through. I’ll have to double check this, but if the hopper keeps turning I believe coins will be dispensed. It’s the motor brakes job to halt the hopper which in turn promptly stops the hopper from over payment.

[Amechanic]

David,

This is the early style hopper without a motor brake. It has the solenoid coin deflector to keep the coins in the hopper once the payout has been reached. Sounds like the coin deflector is working correct, but the hoppers not shutting off. That’s why I was wondering if the white plastic contact spacer is melted or worn allowing the contacts to not open.

Gary

[DavidLee]

Thanks Amechanic,


I didn’t look at the photos. Thought I read it was the new style hopper in one of the post.

[big_e]

Thanks for the help guys.  This is pretty frustrating, and I am about out of options.  I bought this game with this issue, so it could be any multitude of issues.
I have cleaned the contacts on the pay relay.  I even put a meter on it while it runs and see the power drop off at the same time that winner paid light comes on and coin override drops out to spill coins back into the hopper.  It seems to function correctly.  Contacts are spaced right and clean.
Amechanic, I did look at the plastic and it doesnt appear to be worn, or melted.  See pic below.
What I keep going back to is this issue has a time delay to it.  SO after the game pays the hopper runs for a while.  A random amount of time.  What in this hopper is influenced by time?  No timing relays.  Could a capacitor cause this?  Its not a discrete issue, its one that varies with time each time I play it.  Its very odd.
E

[Amechanic]

You might want to pull the reel shelf beau plugs for the cabinet and check those wires. This is where extention cables come in helpful to watch things work out of the cabinet. I’ve never worked on one of these before, so I’m just guessing myself at this point.

[DavidLee]

On the hopper unit, check every component that has the WHITE / BLUE trace wire connected to it.
Check the related contacts in there normal open positions for no continuity


On the earlier machines the diverter and hopper are wired in sink. When the power is cut, both are deactivated.  See photo

[big_e]

DavidLee, the hopper runs because of the relay on the front of the hopper.  It runs until that relay kicks off.  It also has another relay it controls on the right side.
The wires that power this relay (the one in front) are orange, and orange blue.  I trace them to the contacts on the pay relay.
I think this is a mixer relay..... but have no idea.
E

[GOS]

mixer relay!!!

[smoothgrh]

I owned the nickel version of this machine in the 1990s. Beautiful machine! My main gripe was that it was super hard to get the 50-coin payout!

[Amechanic]

mixer relay!!!

Where is the Mixer relay? I didn’t see anything marked mixer? What tell the mixer relay to cycle?