S+ 4TH OF JULY FREEZES THEN CONTINUES

[scottf11961]

Hello everyone, I apologize if I'm posting in the wrong area
 I picked up a 4th of July machine  S plus,That needed a power supply. I got the machine really cheap, and had an old power supply laying around. after switching out the power supply and doing a Ram clear and set up my validator, I was up and running. but after a few minutes, the game freezes and then continues. It happened a few times, so I shut the machine off, check to made sure the MPU was seated correctly, and tried again. Same thing happened. I'm trying to upload a video, but here's a link I uploaded to you tube in case the video doesn't upload. Thanks for any suggestions!!

[Tilt]

That's pretty odd.  I think the first thing I'd check is the power connector on the motherboard for signs of oxidation/overheating.

[scottf11961]

I was thinking in those same lines, but the board looks clean. I don't see any signs of anything on it at all

[Stayouttadabunker]

There's a harness coming out of the left side of the power supply that runs to the front of the floor located motherboard.
The location of the white Molex power connector housing is at [J8].
Pull it straight up off of the pins and turn it around to veiw the back of the housing.

Click on any photo below to enlarge if needed...>>>

[scottf11961]

Both sides look clean. No signs of burnt pins, but...it was very loose. Maybe when I cleared the machine and replaced the battery..I may have loosened it or hit into it. So good catch on checking that! Thank you! I can't power it up and test it tonight, but will in the A.M. ( My mother in laws bedroom is directly above the gameroom, and I don't want to wake her). Will report back tomorrow

[scottf11961]

Checked the connector and pins. Everything looks clean. Made sure it was secured tightly, and tried again. Same thing. Plays and freezes. Anything else I can check?

[lookes]

Check optics and door alignment. Does it stop in the middle of a spin? After it stops is there a delay before it runs again?

[scottf11961]

Here's the update. My 'Spin Till You Win' takes the same S+ board. So, I swapped boards and chips to see if the problem followed to the other machine. I didn't think it would, but still had to at least try to narrow down the problem.  So far..BOTH machines are working as they should.  Not sure why or what the issue was. If it happens again on the 4th, I'll bypass the optics and try that approach..but right now I have some games to play..
Thanks for the suggestions!!

[jay]

With the S+ and PE+ (video poker) - you pay about 10 games 100 spins - the machine pauses (very briefly) and then continues again.
** Had to correct my post *** Thanks to 6CardMark for correcting me !!
What is going on is that there are two CMOS chips - one is on the motherboard (small board that the MPU plugs into) and the other is on the S+ main board.

Both chips are written to simultaneously.  If you were to pull the power mid spin. Then plug it back in again - the machine would complete the play just as if nothing had ever happened.
The reason for the dual chips is to ensure the integrity of the machine at all times for the gaming regulators.
Everyone has seen the sticker that says "Malfunction voids all plays and pays" this isn't just the greedy corporations putting that on for their benefit - the regulators can look at both chips and determine if someone has been messing with the machine.

On that 10th 100th spin - There is a checksum that goes between these two chips to ensure that they are aligned.

My speculation is that the CMOS EEPEOM is aged and is slow to write/read.

You wrote "My 'Spin Till You Win' takes the same S+ board. "  ....  Any S+ can become any other theme. They all take the same board. Just swap SP (game) and SS (reel) chips and you change the behavior (glass and reel strips to match of course).....

What you might try is to swap the CMOS chips between the two machines and see if the problem moves.  Given that the problem didn't move when you swapped boards I would suspect its the chip on the fixed mother board that you would need to swap.

You will actually see that a machine with a SP731 chip has a shorter pauses than the ones with SP1271 - as the latter has way more accounting information.

[Pitts256]

Just had the identical issue with an S+. It was the main door photo eyes needed to be cleaned and aligned.

If that doesn't solve the problem then I'd also reseat the following connectors:
1) Motherboard J/P3 & J/P10
2) Backwall chassis J/P203
3) Just behind the coin hopper plug J/P210
4) Both of the eye plugs J/P170 & J/P171

Also the photo emitter or receiver may be weak and sending an irregular pulse to the CPU.



 

[scottf11961]

Thank you you that information.  I always learn something new here.  Now the update to the update... My Spin till you Win is now having the same problem.  4th of July Works fine. So by Jay's calculations,  it's the CMOS on the motherboard that's causing the issue..and I should test that by swapping the CMOS chip ONLY and see if the problem goes back to the 4th.
Is that correct?

[jay]

If you moved boards and the problem moved. Change the cmos on the MPU. If the problem remained with the chassis then swap the cmos on the mother boards. All are socketed.

The question you’re trying to answer is if the CMOS is behaving badly.
Once again this is just speculation until you prove/disprove through swaptronics.

[knagl]

The CMOS pause that Jay described is not what your video showed. It does not interrupt the machine mid-spin and blank out the displays which was happening with your machine.

In your video, either the door optics are not quite aligned properly, or there's a power issue. The candle which we couldn't see would help to troubleshoot the issue. If the bottom segment of the candle starts flashing when the machine stops spinning, that would indicate that it thinks a door is open.

The more I think about this, though, if it thought the door was opening mid-spin, it should result in a reel tilt where the reels all start spinning slowly. Since that's not happening and the issue followed the board to a different machine, I suspect that it's not a door optics alignment issue. There's something going on with the problem board causing the issue, but I'm not an expert when it comes to board-level repair.

[lookes]

Yes it is down to the MPU now. I can simulate the problem on my test fixture by flipping the door switch quickly. Even during a spin it goes dark and delays while resetting and comes back up mid spin with no errors. I'd have thought it would have errored out. Probably something in the optics transmitter or receiver circuits on the MPU.

[jay]

Have you checked for shorts. Specifically I am thinking about a wayward coin under the motherboard.
You recently moved this unit so its possible something shook loose, at least enough to be aggravated by the vibration of the wheels spinning.

[knagl]

Yes it is down to the MPU now. I can simulate the problem on my test fixture by flipping the door switch quickly. Even during a spin it goes dark and delays while resetting and comes back up mid spin with no errors. I'd have thought it would have errored out. Probably something in the optics transmitter or receiver circuits on the MPU.

This is good information here. 

[Stayouttadabunker]

Error with the MPU would be an easy thing to check?

I would run a 3 foot piece of wire between the purple wired pin on the door emitter optic to the red wired pin on the cabinet receiver optic.
If the machine runs game spins without any loss of power, then you can rule out the MPU.

[Tilt]

He had another working S+ so he put the MPU from the bad S+ into the good one and the problem followed the MPU.  The MPU from the good S+ also worked in the bad S+ so it's not a problem with the cabinet optics, it's on the MPU.

[Stayouttadabunker]

oh okay...I missed that Reply. 
I just read it all....not sure swapping the CMOS will solve the problem, but it doesn't hurt to try swapping the Game & Reel chips as well.
I do like Lookes suggestion too...that's also beyond what I can do.
You'd have to have a true understanding of the MPU circuit board schematics, to figure that one out.
My guess is a failing triac on that line...which one? No clue.
I'd love to see a hi-resolution photograph of the MPU circuitry.

[Pitts256]

One thing I missed earlier that I'd like to throw out there is the micro switch for the cash-box door. That switch has given me fits before so now I'm doing the bypass. The main door photo eye receiver (located on the chassis) provides feedback to the MPU through that micro switch. Try taping the switch down, taping the door shut or better yet cut the wires off the switch, pull them out the back, strip twist and cap.