873 - Third reel occasionally doesn't spin

[frenchmarky]

On my 873, once in a while the third reel won't spin at the kickoff.  It just free floats (barely spinning) so it's not engaged by either the contact disc lever or the reel kicker lever.  The reel's contact disc lever is engaging at the end of the spin, just like the other two reels.  It's as if maybe the kicker lever hadn't actually fallen in a slot but was instead just sitting on the point between two slots so it didn't actually deliver any spin, but it is basically impossible to catch this in the act because it happens rarely... like if I could notice that the reel didn't rise up a little bit along with the other reels as you pulled the handle down so I'd know yeah, the kicker arm is in a slot.  Anybody have suggestions on what could be causing this?

[Pinballwizard55]

Possibly some old grease inside the mech that has congealed, try some solvent, just sayin. The wizard.

[frenchmarky]

I've had everything freed up with oil/grease for quite a while and can't feel or see anything sticking.  One thing is the 3rd index wheel definitely has more wear on it than the other two, I'm guessing the other two reel's index wheels are probably replacements.  I went around and cleaned up the rough worn-in edges of all the #3 index slots with a dremel but no change in the frequency of the issue.  Is it a big deal if the 'points' between the slots aren't nice and sharp anymore like the other two reels?

[Pinballwizard55]

The blunting of the gear edges may affect the way the lower arm grips the gear to fling it, so to speak. also check to see if the reel axle is locked securely in place on both sides of the mech. some times that spring loaded arm wears down and the whole bundle can shift slightly. Good luck, the wizard.

[DavidLee]

Index arm reel kicker is gummed up an or not returning all the way into the index slot.
Or the maybe slow getting out of the when the reel is kicked.
With the reels out compare the 3rd to the 1st and 2nd index arms by manually operating them.
Also check the ratchet wheel. All ratchet wheels should spin freely.

My experience is the 3rd reel index assembly needs cleaning a few time.

[frenchmarky]

<<Or the maybe slow getting out of the when the reel is kicked.??

You mean the contact disc arm is slow getting out of the way at the kick, or the kicker arm itself is slow getting out of the way after it kicks the reel?  As far as the reel speed, they are all oiled and spin fast and the 3rd reel may even be the fastest. 

For now I'll keep poking around and watch how the levers work and see if I can come up with some more results.  Other than this rare glitch, no other issues with the operation.  Only happens once about every a week or two and I play this sucker all the time so it's just impossible to notice where the 3rd reel was positioned every time I pull the handle where it might point me to a particular cause, real aggravating.

[DavidLee]

The index arm has to move back out of the slot.
When it clears the reel is kicked.
Some machines have adjustment holes in the lower linkage.
But since it happens occasionally I would not adjust the linkage.
The reels aren’t at fault in this situation as they spin freely.
It’s the mechanics from the clock shaft levers and beyond.
There’s a little oval shape piece that trips the kicker.
Make sure it moves freely also all shafts and bushings should move freely.
Bushings should have movement side to side.
Check the index arm roller for proper function and that it has not worn down.
Index arm spring and knee action functionality as compared to the others.
Also take note of the temperature when this problem occurs.

[frenchmarky]

Will do, thanks!  Now I noticed that the kicker arm isn't supposed to actually go into the slots but just floats between the 'points' on the index wheel and then kicks, so the worn points could be a factor depending on how bad it is.

[wolftalk]

Will do, thanks!  Now I noticed that the kicker arm isn't supposed to actually go into the slots but just floats between the 'points' on the index wheel and then kicks, so the worn points could be a factor depending on how bad it is.

the kick arms can go into the slots.  They are spring tensioned so if the slot happens to be shallow, they don't wedge.  If the slot is deeper tho, the kicker will go in a good bit.

there's bad video where you can kinda see it at:

https://bingo.cdyn.com/slots/videos/Reel_kick_slo.mp4
https://bingo.cdyn.com/slots/videos/How_reels_spin.mp4

make sure the kicker arms move easily and the rollers on the arm ends spin on the peg.

when the arms go into deeper slots, you can usually see the reel turn a little backwards before the kickoff.  If the kicker is going into the shallowest slot, and that slot is worn, I guess it might not spin the reel very well. 

maybe manually position the reel a few times so the kicker goes into all the shallow spots and see if one is bad.  If the arm can't move freely or something is wrong with the spring tension, it may not grab the shallow slot ears very well.

[frenchmarky]

Looking into the mechanism while partially cranking it, I examined it at all 22 positions.  Even with the worn-down points on the wheel it sure looks like it should always work.  With the long distance the kicker roller travels across the reel when it kicks, I just can't see a tiny bit of wear at the point tips affecting it to where you'd get a free-wheeling reel but no spin.  I've done some more lubing on the little latching levers down there and see how it goes for now.

[DavidLee]

The points on the index slots will be a little shiny from contacting the roller.

On the 3rd reel linkage use some penetrating oil on all the related moving parts.
Capillary action will pull it in between bushings and the shafts.
Work it into the parts for a while.
Wipe clean then apply penetrating oil again as to wash out any old lubricant.
Clean again and then apply light machine oil like 3in1 or sewing machine oil.
Work the linkage to remove excess oil then wipe clean.

Just did maintenance on a machine that the 2nd and 3rd reels would not spin 60% of the time.
Using the procedure as described. Machine works like new, good spins, solid stops with a little knee action.

[frenchmarky]

After making sure I hit every single joint in the reel mech with oil and working them sideways back and forth, the problem has not reoccurred, looks like it fixed it.
I also noticed one contact finger on reel 1 was cracked and had very little tension left so I replaced that whole set of fingers with a new one.  Also on both reel 1 & 2 the contact boards were warped from age enough that it was noticeably not putting enough tension on the outer fingers (lifted up higher from the contacts than the inner fingers).  So I slightly tweaked the metal ledges that the boards are screwed into to tilt the top of the boards a little closer to the reels.

[David Walz]

Take the reel assembly apart and scrub all of the parts, if not you will have issues all of the time. Check all of the springs, they collect grease.

[frenchmarky]

Still hasn't had a single hiccup in over a month, I think I have everything working smoothly now. 

I did finally (after 20 years!) discover my machine was missing the long felt plug inside of the big extension spring on the reel mechanism that is shown in the parts diagrams.  I dug around in my junk and found a short scrap of round tubular foam used for weatherstripping that fit in there perfectly.  I was so used to the loud -brrrang- of that spring at reel kickoff, but now with the foam in there it is *absolutely* silent.  On the first pull I thought either I went deaf or something was broken!