809 N with chattering noise from hopper

[Phan000]

Greetings,
I got a beautiful 809-N at an estate sale.   No keys, did not turn on when plugged in.  It was a gamble.


Turns out, everything is in nice shape, and worked pretty well after I drilled out the lock.  It plays and pays, center reel spins a little slower than the others.

The first issue that I noticed is a clicking/grinding noise in the reel mech.
Sounds link it's coming from the lower back of the reels.   Ill post a video of the sound here as well as a couple of photos.   Obviously this machine needs some lube a cleaning, but does anyone have a though on this specific grinding noise?







Here are the videos
https://youtu.be/MwPKEW1q57Y


https://youtu.be/_-aaWCWH_Hw

[Phan000]

I took the reel mech out, tried to clean and lube.  I also cleaned and lubed the wiper boards.


The chattering noise seems to have  away.





The middle reel still seems sluggish compared to the outer two and will occasionally stop spinning after the third reel.


What is the best way to address this?


Also the hopper overflow is intermittently buzzing.  Is there a way to fix this, short of clipping the wire?

[off-track]

The middle reel still seems sluggish compared to the outer two and will occasionally stop spinning after the third reel.

What is the best way to address this?

Sounds like thhe index lever is sticking on the shaft.  Pretty common case of old lube gumming things up.  Spray some cleaner on the shaft and work the arm back and forth to free make sure it moves freely on the shaft.

[wolftalk]

hopper overflow = coin diverter (the thing changing where the inserted coin goes)?

buzzing coils are usually caused by wear in the armature plate and/or the coil top.  If the armature plate has dimples worn in, you can try whacking it with a hammer to smooth them out.   Rarely works, but when it does it's satisfying.

The coil number should be an FE-33-2600.  There may be an old coil number on the thing someplace which may be easier to find, or the slot parts guys probably know what to supply.  Like this:
https://www.ebay.com/itm/Pinball-Coil-FE33-2600-Bally-NOS-Solenoid-Flipper-FREE-SHIPPING/174404725208

other options include running an emory board (fingernail file) or similar between armature and coil top while holding the armature down, sticking electrical tape on the coil top, and earplugs.


you've got an odd machine. 


The 809's were 20 stop 5 coin multipliers - yours has been modified to only take three coins.  Looks like a conversion to a  22 stop 1090 model ... especially since 1090 is stamped on the reel 1 index disc and that disc doesn't look like an original bally one :-)


the 809-N originally was a "lightning" model for kelley's nugget casino.  The lightning models were jackpot only, with only 7, 5-bar and bar symbols. 


if you get a chance to take pictures of the lamp panel behind the top glass, the wiring side of the reel wiper boards and the payout counter disc, that'd be interesting to see. 

[rdaniel]

I have found that by sanding the grooves made by the coil into the armature to a smooth, flat condition that will quiet the noise. also electrical tape will help.

[DavidLee]

It appears the ratchet wheel mechanism is dragging on the blue spring.
This also may be causing the reel mechanism to malfunction.

[Phan000]

Thanks for the suggestions.  What is the best cleaner/lube for the reel mechanism?  Also, what should I use on the switches?


I am considering trying to clean the reel strips in place with just a light water/soap solution.  They are pretty faded, but I’d hate to wreck them.


The vertical fluorescent bulbs behind the “all jackpots paid by machine” and the “play one to three coins”, are burned out.


The numbers on them are illegible.  They seem just under 6” long.  Any idea the size, or where to source these?  I’ve attached a photo.

[DavidLee]

If the reel strips have tar, nicotine and oily grime on them.
Soap and water might clean them. I’ve used automotive cream wax/cleaner and it works well.
Best to test a small portion first when cleaning and be careful of the metal crimped edge, it is sharp.

[rdaniel]

After carefully looking at the symbols on the reel strips, I was wondering if they are paper with the symbols stuck on as decals. I have seen reel strips like that. If they are paper with decals I caution about using too much liquid to clean. If they are plastic with the symbols embedded in then then there is no problem. 

[DavidLee]

Lamp F4T5 Cool white

Lamp excluding the pins is 5.25 inches.

[off-track]

What is the best cleaner/lube for the reel mechanism?  Also, what should I use on the switches?

Check the sitcky "Link to OldReno's Troubleshooting Tips" at the top of this forum topic.  There is a LOAD of useful information there.  Specifically, this post addresses the reel mechanism.  http://newlifegames.net/nlg/index.php?PHPSESSID=41f332193115885d8d14ac18b57bd44f&topic=19336.0

Light sewing machine oil with a needle point applicator for metal on metal and bearing surfaces.  By switches I'm assuming you're referring to the blade switch contacts?  They are cleaned with isopropyl alcohol and possibly a Flexstone (if that doesn't do it).  They must be dry, there is no lubricant.  OldReno mentions a light application of oil to the wiper board buttons but I use a very light coating of PBR contact grease on my EM machines.  Flexstones and contact grease (along with a bunch of other useful stuff) are available from http://www.pbresource.com.

[Phan000]

Thanks for all the helpful advice.  Did a lot of lube and cleaning this weekend.  Running much more smoothly.  The chattering noise returned & turned out it was coming from the hopper gears.   Cleaned and lubed, and the noise abated.


I still cant get rid of the buzzing from the coin diverter, even with sanding and electrical tape.  I will be replacing that coil.




Yesterday I replaced the two vertical florescent tubes.  The left one went in easy, worked great.   The right one was hard to get in, but did light up.... for a minute.  Two minutes later the ballast smoked.


I have an old ballast, that is pretty similar, but has slightly different amperage.  Can this be used as a replacement, or should I try to source an exact duplicate?



original

















Replacement??











Another thing I noticed, is that the 3rd reel seldom lines up with the payline.   It always seems slightly off.  Is there a way to adjust this?








Thanks in advance- John

[wolftalk]

the F4T5 is a 4 watt lamp, so your replacement ballast should be fine.


if nothing is frozen up on the reel 3 indexing arm and the arm is going all the way into the slots on the index disc, I think your only option is to move the tape on the reel tin.  If the arm is frozen, you'd probably see differing alignment depending on the symbol (slot depth in the index disc).


you could try loosening the screws that attach the tin and the index disc to the hub and see if there's enough slop in the screw holes to alter the alignment.

[Phan000]

Thanks for the tip Wolf,   I loosened  & adjusted the 3rd reel.  Lines up perfectly now.

My spare ballast was no good.  Any thoughts on where to buy another?


The main problem noise has returned & it's definitely coming from the hopper.   I thought it was a mechanical sound, but it may be electrical.   The top finger of a switch has a tip broken off.  There is a ton of electrical arcing as seen in the video attached.


How do I source a replacement for this part, and does it make sense that it would be the cause of this noise?
https://youtu.be/9ttWOTdA1ms

[wolftalk]

are you sure the ballast is bad and not the starter?   


the ballasts are pretty generic and the slot parts guys should have them.  However, I'd be inclined to toss the ballast and use a LED replacement tube - you have to get rid of the ballast for those anyway, and they are probably cheaper than a ballast.


the short switch blade isn't really a problem.  It's unlikely the blade will slip off the peg when the payout counter steps up, but you can push down the solenoid plunger and make sure.  If you want to replace the blade, it's a standard pinball part.  I probably have lots of used ones that would work fine.


the arcing you need to fix!  Do you know which switch is doing it so you can clean and adjust the thing?

[Phan000]

I think I have isolated the arcing from this hopper switch.


It appears to be missing one of the blades, but I'm not positive how it is supposed to look.


Any repair/ source suggestions would be greatly appreciated. 


Also, if you happen to have a photo of how the functioning switch should look, that would definitely help.

[wolftalk]

It appears to be missing one of the blades, but I'm not positive how it is supposed to look.

yup.  There should be a long, flat (no contact) blade there.   The plastic disc on the reset arm pushes that blade, which pushes the two with the white cylindrical spacers to open those two switches.


sounds like the disc may be pushing the spacers directly, but not enough to open the switches.


swiped below pic from an ebay listing for a payout counter.  If nobody volunteers the pieces in the next couple days, I'll see what I can scrounge up.  The $50 for then entire unit on ebay is kinda overkill for what you need.

[wolftalk]

found a switch stack with the piece you need.  PM or email me your mailing address to slotpics@cdyn.com and I'll send it to you.  I'll dig around for a step-up arm switch blade too ... should have something off a bingo machine that may work.

[Phan000]

Pm sent, thanks Wolf!

[Phan000]

While messing with the Florescent lights, I ended up causing a short & burning up the coin lockout coil.




Does someone happen to know the number of the coil?