Author Topic: IGT Video Poker (1994) - Help Needed (Read 21667 times)

mrSidX · « **Reply #20 on:** April 20, 2015, 05:50:11 PM »

This was the one that was originally in it when I got the machine... I do have a spare one that came in a dirty bucket of spare parts like hopper coin mech, bill bucket, and a 2's Wild board (yay!)

...

mrSidX · « **Reply #21 on:** April 20, 2015, 05:55:04 PM »

By the looks of it, it may appear I have the coin in wrong? ...

Thank you for clarification on the terminology.. I hate to add confusion

mrSidX · « **Reply #22 on:** April 20, 2015, 06:02:53 PM »

Quote from: rokgpsman on April 20, 2015, 05:48:41 PM

Below is a picture of a coin comparator. It probably isn't your exact model but it will be similar. It shows how the sample coin or token is in the comparator. If no sample coin is installed then no coins or tokens are accepted.

Also, so we use the right terminology and not cause confusion, the coin acceptors that use power and electronics are called coin comparators. The older purely mechanical coin acceptors are call coin mechs or coin mechanicals or similar. A popular line of coin comparators are the "CC-16" models and there are several variations of them for different brands and models of slot machines due to voltage and other signal requirements.

OK! Success! I got the machine taking quarters now.. I had the coin in the wrong slot location... But now the hopper Coin-Out timeout occurs... I think maybe it's jammed?

I have to figure a way to remove that bottom front panel to be able to get to the hopper.
...Arnold Says: "Git to dee Hoppa!" lol ...

Thank Rok for your pics, as that help tremendously!

rokgpsman · « **Reply #23 on:** April 20, 2015, 06:03:36 PM »

Quote from: mrSidX on April 20, 2015, 05:26:29 PM

img 3903 is from the RHS of the cabinet, with this stray connector with what looks like a ground wire, is a stray wire, that leads to the LHS you can see it wind up to the other stray black connector that im holding up in one of the pics. I am guessing this is for an external progressive maybe? not sure...

When I have the input diag self test up, I don't see the drop door toggle when I open and close it... I see there is a security sensor there, looks like a magnetic kind, not IR. you can see in the photos on the bottom, there is also a stray connector. These just might be aux to other add-on stuff maybe, I hope not important for the sake of running the thing back to originality.

A lot of times on older machines by the time you get it other people have worked on it, disconnected stuff, sometimes even removed things. For home use many machines can have some of the security features removed or bypassed, that eliminates nuisance and annoying errors that the home owner doesn't care about. So you might find wires that went to a security lock or door latch or cash compartment to be disconnected. As long as that particular machine will operate ok with that done all is ok. So it is possible that disconnected wires are not something to worry about. To know about that will take someone familiar with your particular machine. The casinos often remove the comm stuff that connects the machine to their network or their progressive jackpot system so they can use the stuff on other machines. You don't need that comm equipment to run the machine as a stand-alone slot.

Did you say that the game plays ok when you put credits on it manually by moving a switch with your finger?

Have you looked over the main system board (the MPU board) and looked for damage from a leaking battery, flood water, mice or whatever? If you can you post a good picture of the mpu board others here may recognize it and be able to give advice on operational problems you have.

rokgpsman · « **Reply #24 on:** April 20, 2015, 06:07:53 PM »

Quote from: mrSidX on April 20, 2015, 06:02:53 PM

OK! Success! I got the machine taking quarters now.. I had the coin in the wrong slot location... But now the hopper Coin-Out timeout occurs... I think maybe it's jammed?

I have to figure a way to remove that bottom front panel to be able to get to the hopper.
...Arnold Says: "Git to dee Hoppa!" lol ...

Thank Rok for your pics, as that help tremendously!

Coin hoppers can definitely cause problems with coin jams, bent knife, foreign stuff like screws and wrong size coins in the hopper. Since you just got the machine it might be good to remove the hopper and carefully look it over. You may find jammed coins under the hopper knife or in the dispensing chute where the coins leave the hopper. As always, take a picture of the hopper showing us anything you find or have questions about. As you've seen a photo can make it much easier for both sides of this to see what's going on.

Also, if the hopper is out of coins and still trying to finish a payout you will get an error. Just need to put more coins in there.

rokgpsman · « **Reply #25 on:** April 20, 2015, 06:20:31 PM »

Below is a hopper knife, they come in many different shapes and sizes. The job of the knife is to pick each coin off the rotating hopper wheel (also called the hopper disk). The coin rolls up onto the knife point, then follows the top edge of the knife over to the left where it goes by a coin counter. The coin counter can be a mechanical lever that moves up and down or it can be an optic sensor. After passing the coin counter the coin goes to the dispensing chute and falls into the tray for the player. Now on a sitdown machine like yours (also called a slant top) the hopper will likely be somewhat different since it probably has to send the coins upward to the coin tray. So I think they will have an elevator chute or something to get the coins up there.

Anywhere along the coin path there can be a jamup and cause problems. If the machine is expecting to payout a certain number of coins and it doesn't see that happen in a short period of time then it will cause an error. Typical hopper problems are a bent or broken knife, multiple coins stuck under the knife or in the dispensing chute, wrong size coins or tokens in the hopper, loose screws or other stuff that fell into the hopper and caused a jam, etc.

With the hopper out of the machine you can rotate the motor shaft by hand to see how it is working. Need to only turn it so the coin wheel rotates CCW. On the rear of the hopper motor you should be able to twist the motor shaft to turn it. There is usually a little brake assembly on top of the hopper motor, you will need to release this brake by lifting upward (I think, just take a look at it) in order to turn the motor. You might be able to turn the hopper coin wheel by just pressing directly on the front of it but you will still need to release the motor brake. When you get it turning you can see and understand how it works. This is how it's done on an upright slot, yours may need to be done a little differently since it's a slant top. Be sure you do this with the hopper unplugged from electricity, that motor usually runs off 115vac.

rokgpsman · « **Reply #26 on:** April 20, 2015, 07:00:38 PM »

Quote from: mrSidX on April 20, 2015, 05:50:11 PM

This was the one that was originally in it when I got the machine... I do have a spare one that came in a dirty bucket of spare parts like hopper coin mech, bill bucket, and a 2's Wild board (yay!)
...

below is your photo with notes.

yes, that round black slide door has to be moved over to the left nearly covering the coin. Usually there is a spring that moves the door to the proper position, but the screw may have been tightened holding the door out of position or the spring is broken. Also, the edge of the coin must be in the slot so the coin is in the right position.

If this is the coin comparator out of your slant top then notice the model number on it. If the comparator in your Game Magic is a different model then you can't swap them around.

These comparators have a sensitivity adjustment. For home use most people turn it all the way CCW for the least sensitivity so you won't have coin rejection problems. In a casino they set it as high as they can get away with to reject all fake coins but you will get nuisance rejections if you do that.

mrSidX · « **Reply #27 on:** April 20, 2015, 07:36:01 PM »

K, Rok,

That is exactly what my problem was, so I reseated it and is now taking the coin...

Also, I did notice that when I got the machine with spare parts there is a 25cent hopper, and I must have had the 5c hopper in at the time (tested with quarters)..

I managed to find the latch for the bottom front door, and I am now able to move the board and hopper in and out... I replaced the current hopper with the 25c hopper and now it is working just fine... At first the coins would get stuck in the comparator then I moved the little knob up a bit and this now takes them in ok...

The other board has tested and has a dead battery which I will need another, but I was able to swap chips and replace Joker poker with the bonus poker, which guy said was 2's wild, bummer... I like 2ces wild...

So as of now, it appears to be working with the 25c configuration, so now I will have to test the 5c hopper once I get a bunch of nickels together...

I want to say this is completed to my liking, and I want to thank you guys a megaton for helping me out...

Now if that friggin GameMagic would be as easy, they just taking forever to ship my batteries!

thanks again guys!

CVslots · « **Reply #28 on:** April 20, 2015, 08:02:39 PM »

Awesome!!!

rokgpsman · « **Reply #29 on:** April 20, 2015, 09:39:58 PM »

Glad you got it going. It may need some good general cleaning, from the looks of those coin comparator optics boards there's been a lot of dusty old air move thru it. Maybe you'll find some old coins in there!

Early on you mentioned that the screen looked like it could use degaussing. TV and electronics stores used to have degaussing coils that you could use for that. It can help to remove color impurities on the screen due to portions of the screen getting magnetized over time. On the back of the crt itself, running in a big loop circle near the four corners of the back of the crt you should see a thick coil of wire about the size of your finger. This coil is usually covered in a plastic insulation. This is the degaussing coil that crt manufacturers put in their crt monitors. The coil will connect by a plug to the monitor board.

When the monitor first powers up this coil gets voltage for about a half second or so, causing it to generate a strong magnetic field that helps to degauss the screen. There is a little circuit on the monitor board that switches the power to the degaussing coil off after a brief time, often it is done with a relay and a control circuit. Anyway, if someone has unplugged this coil or if it is broken or burned open then that could allow the screen to get those color splotches. Other guys here like cowboygames have worked on a lot of monitors and can give better advice than me. With power off you can inspect the back of the crt and see if the coil is not connected or missing. If the coil isn't working you can degauss the screen manually with a degaussing coil yourself and possibly improve the screen image. Be aware, that even with power off the crt can have high voltage stored in it so be careful about touching any bare wires or the crt body itself around the anode connector (usually a large red wire).

rokgpsman · « **Reply #30 on:** April 20, 2015, 10:50:26 PM »

Quote from: mrSidX on April 20, 2015, 07:36:01 PM

.......So as of now, it appears to be working with the 25c configuration, so now I will have to test the 5c hopper once I get a bunch of nickels together...

If you decide you like the nickel hopper better you could use nickel-sized tokens, that way you wouldn't have a bunch of real money in the machine or in a bucket that might disappear over time when friends come over.

To do that you can buy some nickel tokens from ebay or elsewhere, maybe even those Japanese pachislo gaming tokens would work. I use quarter tokens in my machine and it has a similar coin comparator that you have. If you do this you might want to check with others here to make sure if the tokens have to have magnetic property or not (ferrous metal). I don't think so, my tokens don't stick to a magnet, but seems like I read something about this somewhere. Also it is better if you get all of the tokens from the same place at one time so they are identical, that way the metal properties will be the same.

mrSidX · « **Reply #31 on:** April 21, 2015, 12:16:29 AM »

Awesome, Rok,

good insight..

I've got to tinker around with the 5c hopper and it's kinda quirky at first. It coin-out timeouts very quickly, where as the quarters seemed to have some time to allow them to flow up the shaft. I also had a few issues with the nickels getting jammed up more so on me on the comparator, but good news is that there was included a nickel "mouth" piece that I could put on to avoid quarter entry. I since changed it back to quarters and it seems to be more solid... Ran a ton of quarters through, and only jammed once.. I may have to mess with the comparator inlet or something to make it more reliable..

I ended up going downtown with my brother and played a little at the D, intended to get a ton of quarters for change... So I got about 120$ in quarters and gave my brother 20 to play... We both started putting a little in and each won tripple sevens with a double and a tripple multiplier one on each of our machines... Came home about 50$ ... not bad

Now, I have a good amount of quarters to play for that machine, or at least to cover if someone else likes to play in the home..
lol Now watch it might backfire because the machine seems very loose... !!!

Hahah so how often do friends come over and clean out your slot machine?!

rokgpsman · « **Reply #32 on:** April 21, 2015, 12:59:32 AM »

Quote from: mrSidX on April 21, 2015, 12:16:29 AM

.......Hahah so how often do friends come over and clean out your slot machine?!

Although they can insert real paper money bills or play with tokens they only win tokens so they tend to leave them in the tray.

I like the "D", especially upstairs. That old-school room reminds me of when I first started going to Vegas. Their old Sigma Derby machine is a blast, we used to play the one at Luxor, it had camels instead of horses and the jockeys were dressed like Arabs with the capes on their headpiece. Was too cool. There was one at MGM also and another at the Hilton.

When using nickels the coin pathways may supposed to be changed in some ways to keep the coins from bunching and jamming. I've not seen how the coins get from the hopper to the tray on a slant top but that coin shaft/chute might come in 2 different styles or sizes so nickels would work better but I'm not sure about that since I'd think they would have given any such pieces to you because they gave you the other nickel operation parts (nickel hopper, nickel coin entry (mouth piece)).

Since this is a video machine it is more modern, does it have settings in the menu that you can change things and maybe affect that hopper timeout problem?

So is your slant top working pretty much completely? How about a picture of it, lit up and working?

mrSidX · « **Reply #33 on:** April 21, 2015, 03:40:34 PM »

Ok, Hey Rok,

I was able to upload some photos of my monitor, I don't recall seeing a degausing coil already on there?

Also, I looked at degaussing coils and they are about 40-50$ ... errrrr

Trying to find a cheap used one hopefully..

bigdps · « **Reply #34 on:** April 21, 2015, 04:11:47 PM »

I can't help you with anything video coin thingamagy but I sure can help you degauss your machine the cheapest way possible.

Do you have one of those Weller solder guns? You know the type that you can press the trigger and have 2 different heat settings?
Well a very bright friend of mine told me one day that they make the best degaussing machines. I thought he was making fun of me. I had told him about the rainbow effect on my old arcade CRT screen. So not telling him at first, I did press the trigger and rubbed the black casing around the "rainbow" and sure enough. The rainbow was gone!!!!

Now Keith has been my electronics mentor ever since that day. Try it and you'll see, it makes the cheapest tool to have.

Amechanic · « **Reply #35 on:** April 21, 2015, 04:51:57 PM »

It looks like you have a Ceronix chassis. From what I have read in the Ceronix manual, they don't used the degaussing circuit on the 1492 chassis when installed in an IGT machine? That's one of the things they ask you to do when setting up the 1492 Ceronix for IGT.. I have seen it on the RGB Chassis but not Ceronix.. If you know anyone who does electronic repairs might have one you can borrow? It only take a minute to use. I have seen them cheaper then $40-$50.

FYI.. Here is a like to the manuals at Ceronix. The 1492 chassis schematic is on the bottom. The other is on the top of the CRT section.

http://ceronix.com/content/17-lcd-specs-manuals-schematics.html

Gary

mrSidX · « **Reply #36 on:** April 21, 2015, 06:16:36 PM »

Quote from: bigdps on April 21, 2015, 04:11:47 PM

I can't help you with anything video coin thingamagy but I sure can help you degauss your machine the cheapest way possible.

Do you have one of those Weller solder guns? You know the type that you can press the trigger and have 2 different heat settings?
Well a very bright friend of mine told me one day that they make the best degaussing machines. I thought he was making fun of me. I had told him about the rainbow effect on my old arcade CRT screen. So not telling him at first, I did press the trigger and rubbed the black casing around the "rainbow" and sure enough. The rainbow was gone!!!!

Now Keith has been my electronics mentor ever since that day. Try it and you'll see, it makes the cheapest tool to have.

Thats what I like to hear. I am all about cheap effective tools. Not saying I'm all about cheap tools, but hey, there are some very cheap tools that do just as good as the expensive ones, so by all means why not!? Also a fan of multipurpose means to Magyver, or should I say alternative means thats more economical.

Thanks for the tip bigdps!

I don't know anyone personally that would have one..

The Soldering iron trick might work, as it's easier to come by... But then again, I'm using a gas iron as my primary, and don't know where the elecronic ones are... gotta search.

Also, couldn't you use any old soldering iron? Not sure the magnetic science of the degauss but I'd imagine its something to do with the coils of the iron??
... any soldering iron? Gonna see if I can find an old weller as I am sure there was one in this house sometime or another.

~~~~~ Time goes on...

I managed to find an old Weller in the Garage! Woot!

I did manage to use it on the monitor via the aux power plug by the power switch in the machine and I have to say, it does work ... wonderfully!

There are a FEW very fain splotches in the sides and corner, but over all its much much better!

Thanks again bigdps for that tip!

Also thanks to everyone helping me out with this venture... I am posting pics for you to see it now...
The left most light behing the banner on the slant top is burned out.. came on once or twice but its mostly out.. maybe a bad connection... It rattles on the condenser when I nudge it gently...

Other than that the machine is about 90% complete I should say! yay!

rokgpsman · « **Reply #37 on:** April 21, 2015, 06:36:22 PM »

Quote from: mrSidX on April 21, 2015, 03:40:34 PM

Ok, Hey Rok,

I was able to upload some photos of my monitor, I don't recall seeing a degausing coil already on there?

Also, I looked at degaussing coils and they are about 40-50$ ... errrrr

Trying to find a cheap used one hopefully..

Hey! that machine looks good!

I was gone all day and into the evening, just now saw your post but you got good advice and suggestions from the other guys. I agree that it looks like your monitor does not have a degaussing coil, that may be why you have some color splotches after all the years of use. Below is one of your photos with the approx location that the degaussing coil would be in if it were installed. Based on what the others said it probably wasn't removed by someone, just wasn't there to begin with.

I guess Ceronix had their reasons for not having one. Possibly they figured that since a casino slot machine is powered continually all day & night, every day, until taken our of service there is no need to install a part that only operates for a half-second when power is first applied. The slot machine would not be switched off and then on again regularly so the degaussing coil would practically never be turned on except the first time the slot was powered up. Saves the cost of the degaussing coil plus eliminates the chance of it failing and causing a problem. Just a guess...

Anyway, I don't think I'd pay $50 for a hand degaussing coil that I'd only use seldomly. You live in a big city, maybe someone there in a tv repair place will let you borrow one for the few minutes it takes. Even if you have to leave a deposit to ensure you bring it back. If you do this get a little instruction on how to use it from the tv guy. They aren't used much anymore since everything is going to lcd or whatever, degaussing only applies to crt (picture tube) monitors and tv's. Or maybe the Weller soldering iron will take care of the problem, worth a try. You'll have to decide how bad the screen purity is and whether you want to do something about it.

When using the degaussing coil you turn the monitor on and let it stabilize a minute or so. Then you hold the degaussing coil close to the monitor screen while the coil is off, then you switch the degaussing coil on. You'll see different color spirals appear on the screen due to the strong magnetic field the coil gives off. Then you move the coil in the air in circles in front of the screen, keeping the coil perpendicular (flat) toward the screen and always keep the coil moving. You can concentrate your circles in the screen areas where the color splotches are, moving the coil in smaller circles. But end up making bigger circles that cover the entire screen and gradually back away from the screen so the coil is further and further from the screen, keeping the coil moving in circles all the time. Make sure you don't switch the coil off until you are over on the next street behind your house.

[actually you can switch the coil off when you are far enough away from the monitor that the coil no longer has any effect, the farther the better]

mrSidX · « **Reply #38 on:** April 22, 2015, 12:16:26 AM »

Cool ! I wasn't about to pay that much for a coil degausser!

We have a lot of OLD electronic stuff in our back garage that belonged to the old home owner who owned the house, was actually a stage electrician for sigfried and roy back in the 70's-80's i think, died and left a lot of his stuff and tools to our new landlord (sister-in laws mom)... Theres a ton of old components in organizers in the back for lighting and old electronic switches resistors etc, so I just knew there was an Old Weller somewhere in the garage... Luckily found it in a very overlookable spot, and Score!

When I used it, I just did a sweep of the screen about a half foot away, from one side to the next, and it seemed to "squeegy" off the rainbow effect...
I am going to keep this old iron around for this use, as it's casing is kinda busted up.

Great tip! Saved me 40-50$,..

Thanks again on that one

bigdps · « **Reply #39 on:** April 22, 2015, 03:08:08 PM »

Feel free to give me a karma point or two...LOL

Seriously, the tiny spot you have on the screen could translate to either a magnetized piece of metal or you just have to rub the Weller gun a bit more on the screen and probably wouldn't hurt to rub the frame. Just weird that a Weller gun using EMF to heat the tip would actually suck whatever amount of EMF is around it. But hey, it just works!

Glad you kept that $$$ in your pocket and you can enjoy a beer or two while you play your machine! And when you do, think of me.

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Author Topic: IGT Video Poker (1994) - Help Needed (Read 21667 times)