1088-2 Tilt Light On, Hopper Not Working

[Karloz25]

Hi guys, I went back, and with pics that DavidLee shared and info Wolftalk advised, I was able to get the Coin In relay working again. There was a leaf contact that was not making contact all the way.
Also the Coin Switch at the door was buggy too, I jiggled it a bunch and kept triggering the metal bar back and forth, and it finally triggered the relay, I’m guessing it was stuck somehow. I might just buy a new one and swap it out.


Another problem now, well one that I’ve noticed before.
I played it for a while, and never really won anything?!
I feel the reels are offset? Or I don’t know where the actual payout line is?
The logos don’t really land all the way on the line. Maybe it was my angle? Well I sat down on a chair and tried my luck, the first reel#1 is significantly not lining up on the pay line. Reel 2 and 3 barely touched the line.
I hit a couple cherries and received zero payout.
I finally hit 3 berries, and only receive 4 quarters!
Another odd thing was when I moved reel #1 by hand, it triggered the hopper motor a bit. Is this normal? It felt like it was short of making the pay line, so moving it towards the pay line, it triggered the motor on the hopper.


I have 2 short videos:


Little to no payout on wins
https://youtu.be/SHHg_6_apfg


Weird hopper interaction with reel #1
https://youtu.be/aCbDSRiJv-0

Here is another video after the blueberry win, moving the reels


https://youtube.com/shorts/2ZV4CrI2XoU


Here is the reels out and placement of reels, after blueberry win


https://youtube.com/shorts/nOG-AAKyGc4


I’m so close!
I received the diodes in the mail this weekend, just waiting on the resister that broke on the hopper to arrive to install them all, and remove the paper clip jumper on the hopper relay.


Thanks guys.

[DavidLee]

Good to hear you’re making progress.


Regarding the coin switch, I think I mentioned, if the trip wire drags or is bent this creates problems.
There also could be a slight build up of debris inside the switch.


Regarding reel symbol alignment.
Most likely the tapes have slipped out of position.
If this is the case, find the deepest cuts in the index disc. These are attached to the side of the reels.
Most likely each index disc has only one deep cut. This would be for the highest jackpot to be paid out.


To do this pull the index arms back, spin the reel until the deep slot is aligned, then in gauge the arm.
When all the reels have be re-aligned on the deepest cut, check the front of the reels.
There should be three 777 or bars.
Put the reels back into the machine, one of the symbols might be close to center cross line on the glass.
From here the others will need to be re-aligned.
Mark the reel tins in accordance with the center line on the glass.


Sometimes the tapes will side without un-crimping, if not the crimps need to be slightly lifted,
to align the tapes.  Re-crimp with small pliers or make a special tool as to achieve a factor look.
But plies will do the job, but just go easy.


Caution, the reel tin edges a sharp and could result in blood getting on the tapes.


One more thing, this would be a good time to apply some cream wax-cleaner.
Always test a small area first for any unwanted side effects before applying any cleaners.

[wolftalk]

the 1088's appear to be one of the exceptions for the index disc slot depths.  My docs say your reel tapes are M-231-[1,2,3] - see chart below if you want to verify the symbols on your machine.


for those tapes, the matching index discs are p-684-[294, 295, 296].  Those numbers are sometimes stamped onto the discs.  Definition is second pic below.


if that's what you have, the deepest slots on reel 1 are at positions 7, 13 and 21 and those are cherries.


in your last video that shows the index discs, reel 1 is on a plum (blueberry :-)) which is a depth 3 slot.  Looks right.


third image below is the reel contact plate diagram, and everything checks.  Wipers are at a depth 3 position, the drawing says that's a plum.


when you rock the reel up/down, you push the wipers towards a lower/shorter slot depth ... which would be an orange and that shouldn't cause a pay, so the implication is either the wipers are slightly misaligned on the rivets, the rivets are cruddy, or a wiper isn't pressing down on the rivet well and shifting the wiper helps.



before doing anything else, wiggle the whole reel mech to see if the issue is a poor plug connection. 


if that doesn't help, you can set up the three plums and pull the reels.  Set meter for resistance and stick one probe on wire 91 on reel 3.  Other probe on wire 41 on reel 1.  You should have almost zero ohms.  If not, push down on wiper fingers in the path and wiggle them on the rivets to see which is flaky.


as usual, resistance checking may not find a problem.  If just cleaning all the rivets and making sure the wipers are pressing down on them okay doesn't fix things, then you need one meter probe on wire 70 and the other along the path through the reels from wire 91 to 41 checking where the 50V disappeared. 


It's still possible the problem is in the plugs. The other end of wire 41 is on the 14 trace on the payout counter, so the penultimate goal is to see 50V between wire 70 and the 14 payout counter trace.   If you have that, you have to keep following the 50V thru the payout counter wipers onto wire 93-5 which goes to the payout relay coil.  Powering the payout relay is the ultimate goal.

if the reel shaft is locked forward in the notches and the index arms are going all the way into the slots when the reels are stopped, then the only thing that matter is the position of the reel wipers on the rivets.   Getting the tapes lined up is cosmetic. 


you may be able to loosen the screws attaching the index discs to the hubs to shift the reel tins a little to change the symbol positions or possibly the reel glass is installed too low due to missing plastic edge protectors if it normally had those,  but david's info on shifting the tapes is likely the right answer and he's definitely got way more experience on this problem than I have.


a 4 pay for plums is wrong, but to deal with that you'll want to look where the wipers are on the payout counter disc when pay ends.  For 3 plums, they should be one step off the end of the 14 trace.  Cruddy traces or a payout counter that isn't resetting all the way will give you an underpay and/or no win detect.

[Karloz25]

While cleaning the payout unit, I took it apart, but I couldn’t remember the start position?!?
I have it on 2, starting off point... first click, stays at 2. Is that correct? Also I wound the unit one whole turn. Then locked it in. Hopefully that’s correct.
Also what is the “C.O.” and “F” before the 2 ?
Thanks.


https://youtube.com/shorts/iZSm1xu41qM

[DavidLee]

Two steps should be off the 2, 5 steps should be off the 5 and so forth.
The unit was returning a little slow, might need a wipe of oil on the contact board.
And the cam carriage / armature should be lubed.
Plus a drop of oil on any moving parts.


Very nice cleaning on your part.

[wolftalk]

the usual tension on the torsion spring wound around the ratchet is 2 turns.   Spin the wipers clockwise until they hit the reset stop, remove the spring and put it back on.  You can adjust tension +/- 90 degrees  by changing which hole the short end hook into, but anything more than that and the problem is elsewhere.


the wipers need to reset quickly from 2 steps and step up 200 times (720 degrees).  Oiling per david's info will help with that.  3-in-1 oil in the blue can works, and a lot of "electronic cleaner/lube" products are primarily a pure mineral oil.  Just smear a drop over the surface with your finger to leave a film and the wipers should whizz back to reset.  If they don't and the ratchet/hole is clean, the usual problem is excessive tension of the wiper fingers onto the traces.


I wouldn't lube the ratchet shaft or the spiral groove ... plastic on metal doesn't really need lube.  It won't hurt, but it will gum up eventually.

[Karloz25]

So here is a bit of news...


Thanks for your replies regarding the payout unit, it gave me more confidence to disassemble it further!
I took apart the Payout unit again, recleaned it again, removed all the grease and oil. I was now confident enough to take it more apart, so I removed the spring coil, cleaned that up and added lube to most moving parts, including the bake board with the metal payout numbers. I turned the spring as far as it went without breaking it, then went back a full turn so it rested on the "2". I clicked the weighted solenoid and locked it in place. Reattached everything, and plugged it back in.
I played it for a while and it payed out perfectly every time! I counted the quarters to match the "Dollars" on the marque, and yes it was perfect. Every winning combination payed out just fine. I didn't get to test the Jackpot "3 Bars" because I never hit it, plus I don't know if I had a hundred quarters in there...?


Next, I will continue to wait for the resistor to arrive so I can install that. Regarding the resister (1watt, 47ohm, -/+10%) Can I use a resister with 1watt 47ohm -/+5% ?
If so, amazon has 1 day shipping and I can continue repairing the machine and not have to wait another week for it to arrive.

[DavidLee]

Great, everything is working good for now.

[Karloz25]

Davidlee and wolftalk, send me your PayPal or Venmo and I’ll send you some beer money, you guys have been wonderful and patient.
I’m also going to donate to the site again.

[DavidLee]

Karloz,


Thanks for the offer, reward enough just helping out and get a machine up and running.

[wolftalk]

yup, thanks for the offer, but the pics have been plenty or reward!  'course, if you ever get some paperwork that I don't have, I'll nag ya for a loan of the stuff so I can scan and post it :-)

the resistor tolerance is how far off the labeled value the resistor can be when it's new, so a 5% resistor is guaranteed to be closer to 47 ohms (at 25 degrees C) than a 10% one.  Either works fine in this application as exact resistance isn't critical.

there used to be a larger price difference for lower tolerance resistors, but with better manufacturing these days the cost difference only matters if you are buying very large quantities.

[Karloz25]

Hi guys, a bit of a update here:


I was able to fully have my machine working again.
Taking Davidlee and wolftalks advice.

Cleaning all the relays and old grease,
And changing out the resisters and diodes fixed the issue.
I was able to unsolder the ones in the hopper and solder new replacements.
Tilt light went away, and payouts are precise.


Big thanks to this group of guys here in this great forum!


I’m now hunting Craigslist and offerup and marketplace for my next machine!

[DavidLee]

Good to hear everything is working.


Yes, you need a another machine to keep your machine company.