Bally 1114 full restoration

[David Walz]

I just received the parts for the slot machine. 

Anyone who deals with Monti Slots is always going to get great service guaranteed. Every part I have received is A+, and the packing is A+ every time. I can say that with confidence since I have a few dozen packages from him. 

Tomorrow I will be busy for sure, the reel tapes will take awhile to install, since I want it to be perfect. I have the reels prepped and ready for installation. 

[David Walz]

Working on the reel tapes, setting the "7" on the reel tapes. A lot of other calculations going on in setting the reel tapes in place.

[David Walz]

Contact plate wiring.
Interesting that this drawing for the Bally model 1114 is different than this machine I am working on, however it is not unusual for them being different, this machine is factory and nothing was changed.

[wolftalk]

huh ... your drawing shows the wiper boards all have a different number of rivet columns.

the bally drawing says there's 13 columns.  You have 13, 14 and 15.

I don't recall a game that used more than 10 slot depths on the index disc, so on almost all machines only max 10 of the 13 columns were used.  Many games used much less than 9 slot depths.

there's oddball games like the 929 that used dual wipers on each reel, so it used more than 10 columns of rivets, but the index discs only had slot depths 1-6.

if you got the p-684-[305, 306/347, 307] index discs from monti, the reel wiper boards must be wired per the diagram or the payouts won't work right.

remember the slot depth positions the wipers on the reel boards and that connections the pay circuits. 

[David Walz]

huh ... your drawing shows the wiper boards all have a different number of rivet columns.

the bally drawing says there's 13 columns.  You have 13, 14 and 15.

I don't recall a game that used more than 10 slot depths on the index disc, so on almost all machines only max 10 of the 13 columns were used.  Many games used much less than 9 slot depths.

there's oddball games like the 929 that used dual wipers on each reel, so it used more than 10 columns of rivets, but the index discs only had slot depths 1-6.

if you got the p-684-[305, 306/347, 307] index discs from monti, the reel wiper boards must be wired per the diagram or the payouts won't work right.

remember the slot depth positions the wipers on the reel boards and that connections the pay circuits.

This is the original drawing of the 13 columns (  my chicken scratch), I was obviously not counting on the other drawing. 
I am using the P-684-305, 306, 307 index discs
I am using the M-239-4, 5, 6 reel tapes
The wipers are original with their model number 1114 and #1,2,3 written on them.

[David Walz]

huh ... your drawing shows the wiper boards all have a different number of rivet columns.

the bally drawing says there's 13 columns.  You have 13, 14 and 15.

I don't recall a game that used more than 10 slot depths on the index disc, so on almost all machines only max 10 of the 13 columns were used.  Many games used much less than 9 slot depths.

there's oddball games like the 929 that used dual wipers on each reel, so it used more than 10 columns of rivets, but the index discs only had slot depths 1-6.

if you got the p-684-[305, 306/347, 307] index discs from monti, the reel wiper boards must be wired per the diagram or the payouts won't work right.

remember the slot depth positions the wipers on the reel boards and that connections the pay circuits.

This is the original drawing of the 13 columns (  my chicken scratch), I was obviously not counting on the other drawing. 
I am using the P-684-305, 306, 307 index discs
I am using the M-239-4, 5, 6 reel tapes
The wipers are original with their model number 1114 and #1,2,3 written on them.

Contact plate says 1114 on them and nothing was resoldered.
I will check out the rivet pattern wear, wiring today.

The rest of the machine matches up with the 1114 drawings. I checked out the numbers.

Obviously the other reel tapes and the index disc were wrong, YOM 1979 25¢.and this is a $1.00 machine.

I don't know how much more research I can do on this machine, using the information provided. The original $1 tapes, $1 index disc are 1977, they are matching up with the year, coin amount and model.

[wolftalk]

the dollar 1114 could be ordered from the factory with at least two configurations:

97.46% payback - tapes m-239-[4,5,6] and index discs p-684-[305,347,307]
94.50% payback - tapes m-239-[13,14,15] and index discs p-684-[305,306,307]

sounds like you're mixing 97.46% tapes with 94.50% index discs ... so the question is "what's the difference".

reel 1 tapes m-239-4 and m-239-13 are the same per the docs (same = same symbols in the same order, tho the graphic or background for the symbol may be different so they have a different part number)

reel 3 tapes m-239-6 and m-239-15 are also the same

reel 2 tapes m-239-5 and m-239-14 are different by one symbol.  At tape position 13, -5 is a bell and -14 is a bar.

you'd therefore expect that the slot depth at position 13 is different for p-684-347 and p-684-306 - and you'd be right.  Those two index discs are identical except position 13.  -347 (goes with tape -5) is slot depth 4 (bell depth) and -306 (goes with tape -14) is slot depth 5 (bar depth).

you can't use a m-239-5 tape with a p-684-306 index disc.  The bell symbol at position 13 will behave like a bar symbol.

if you had to hack in a change - and you could cut or plug the index disc slot to a correct depth and curvature - you could make index position 13 the right size of make it an unused slot depth like 7 and wire the wiper board to make slot depth 7 the same as slot depth 4.
 
since cutting/plugging an index disc is not the simplest solution and making a tape isn't ideal, I'd see if monti has either:
-  index disc p-684-347 to match your m-239-5 tape
-  m-239-14 tape to match your p-684-306 disc.

if someone converted your machine to 25c, they probably wanted to lower the payback percentage.  That would require changing tapes, index discs and possibly rewiring the wiper boards. 


 

[David Walz]

the dollar 1114 could be ordered from the factory with at least two configurations:

97.46% payback - tapes m-239-[4,5,6] and index discs p-684-[305,347,307]
94.50% payback - tapes m-239-[13,14,15] and index discs p-684-[305,306,307]

sounds like you're mixing 97.46% tapes with 94.50% index discs ... so the question is "what's the difference".

reel 1 tapes m-239-4 and m-239-13 are the same per the docs (same = same symbols in the same order, tho the graphic or background for the symbol may be different so they have a different part number)

reel 3 tapes m-239-6 and m-239-15 are also the same

reel 2 tapes m-239-5 and m-239-14 are different by one symbol.  At tape position 13, -5 is a bell and -14 is a bar.

you'd therefore expect that the slot depth at position 13 is different for p-684-347 and p-684-306 - and you'd be right.  Those two index discs are identical except position 13.  -347 (goes with tape -5) is slot depth 4 (bell depth) and -306 (goes with tape -14) is slot depth 5 (bar depth).

you can't use a m-239-5 tape with a p-684-306 index disc.  The bell symbol at position 13 will behave like a bar symbol.

if you had to hack in a change - and you could cut or plug the index disc slot to a correct depth and curvature - you could make index position 13 the right size of make it an unused slot depth like 7 and wire the wiper board to make slot depth 7 the same as slot depth 4.
 
since cutting/plugging an index disc is not the simplest solution and making a tape isn't ideal, I'd see if monti has either:
-  index disc p-684-347 to match your m-239-5 tape
-  m-239-14 tape to match your p-684-306 disc.

if someone converted your machine to 25c, they probably wanted to lower the payback percentage.  That would require changing tapes, index discs and possibly rewiring the wiper boards.

Right now I have a issue with the wipers that have been wacked off.
The wiring is spot on.
All of the symbols are correct except for one.
We're not going to modify anything, it has to be 100%.

[David Walz]

Since the wiring is 100% correct, were past that barrier. 

On to the next issue at hand, the wacked wipers and they are not a big issue. 

[David Walz]

 
Easy peasy!
We're going to get this beast running 100% correct, 100% factory original wipers. 😊

[David Walz]

if someone converted your machine to 25c, they probably wanted to lower the payback percentage.  That would require changing tapes, index discs and possibly rewiring the wiper boards.

Thankfully they didn't hack the wiring, it matches up 100%. We're going to get through this  problem and do it right.

I have to get moving on to the coin bowl assembly. Lot's of things to do.

[David Walz]

You know this could be a great soap opera, Stanford and son.

[wolftalk]

changing the payback percentage can be done by changing the payout amounts or changing the number of times each symbol is on a tape.  'course, changing the payouts requires different glass.  I guess it's what's easier ... changing tapes/index discs or changing the glass.

the harness wire connections on the reel wiper boards are not normally changed unless the payouts are changed.

the spaghetti wire connections to the rivets and connections between rivets could be altered if an index disc with more slot depths was swapped on and the same tape symbol was mapped to multiple slot depths.

if the discs that were on the game when you got it only had slot depths = the number of unique symbols on the tapes, then it's the straightforward case of a 1-1 mapping between a symbol and its slot depth and no change to the reel wiper wiring would be needed assuming the payouts were the same. 

in any case, ya got the point that there is a problem with what you have? ... you can't do what you said you are doing:

"I am using the P-684-305, 306, 307 index discs
I am using the M-239-4, 5, 6 reel tapes"

and you can't fix that with reel wiper wiring.  The -5 tape won't work with the -306 index disc.

if you have reel wipers with the wrong configuration of fingers connected together, it's ok it cut the bridge connections between fingers and reconnect the fingers how you need with wires.   No need to scrap wipers with good fingers/contacts just because the cut bridging is wrong for a particular machine.

[David Walz]

changing the payback percentage can be done by changing the payout amounts or changing the number of times each symbol is on a tape.  'course, changing the payouts requires different glass.  I guess it's what's easier ... changing tapes/index discs or changing the glass.

the harness wire connections on the reel wiper boards are not normally changed unless the payouts are changed.

the spaghetti wire connections to the rivets and connections between rivets could be altered if an index disc with more slot depths was swapped on and the same tape symbol was mapped to multiple slot depths.

if the discs that were on the game when you got it only had slot depths = the number of unique symbols on the tapes, then it's the straightforward case of a 1-1 mapping between a symbol and its slot depth and no change to the reel wiper wiring would be needed assuming the payouts were the same. 

in any case, ya got the point that there is a problem with what you have? ... you can't do what you said you are doing:

"I am using the P-684-305, 306, 307 index discs
I am using the M-239-4, 5, 6 reel tapes"

and you can't fix that with reel wiper wiring.  The -5 tape won't work with the -306 index disc.

if you have reel wipers with the wrong configuration of fingers connected together, it's ok it cut the bridge connections between fingers and reconnect the fingers how you need with wires.   No need to scrap wipers with good fingers/contacts just because the cut bridging is wrong for a particular machine.

I'm working on the $1.00 re-assembly, from what I can see, from what I have worked on, this 1114 machine nothing that's been hacked, nothing has been rewired, nothing has been cut, nothing has been changed, excluding the reels, real tapes, wipers. As I said before, the contact disc wiring hasn't been changed, it's still factory, the wires match up 100% with your 1114 document.

The belly glass is factory for $1.00 coin G-359-149 for this 1114 machine, not the other generic one.

Regarding the reel tapes, the index disc, contact disc, I ran the second and third reel with only 1 symbol on the second one that was different, simple fix.
Some of the wiper fingers have been cut off, the new ones are being ordered, and will be correctly installed as per W-1041-2694, 2695, 2696 diagram.

I'm following your documents 100% on this 1114 machine. So far everything on your 1114 documents is matching up with this 1114 machine, the sheet didn't say anything about what Index Reels or Reel Tapes belong with each other, I just assumed that they were interchangeable. I'm really grateful that I have all the information on the 1114  machine, it's invaluable, and I make a lot of mistakes along the way. 


 

[David Walz]

Well, I just got finished with the removal of the Formica and tomorrow I will install the new piece matching it up to the cabinet.

Today:
Working on this Bally 1114 EM slot machine, it's strictly a mission I'm on, and not just a day in the park. I just realized that I spent 6 hours working on this 1114 EM machine, I came inside, took a shower, now its my nap time.

It's all about taking pride in restoring this 114 EM machine 100%. It will run indefinitely after I get done with it, just regular maintenance needed in the future.

[David Walz]

Moving on, here's the pictures of the coin bowl assembly.  Anyone who has this type of machine, knows about the rust issue with this assembly.

Don't flame me, however the rust issue prevented me from leaving it original.

[David Walz]

the dollar 1114 could be ordered from the factory with at least two configurations:

97.46% payback - tapes m-239-[4,5,6] and index discs p-684-[305,347,307]
94.50% payback - tapes m-239-[13,14,15] and index discs p-684-[305,306,307]

sounds like you're mixing 97.46% tapes with 94.50% index discs ... so the question is "what's the difference".

reel 1 tapes m-239-4 and m-239-13 are the same per the docs (same = same symbols in the same order, tho the graphic or background for the symbol may be different so they have a different part number)

reel 3 tapes m-239-6 and m-239-15 are also the same

reel 2 tapes m-239-5 and m-239-14 are different by one symbol.  At tape position 13, -5 is a bell and -14 is a bar.

you'd therefore expect that the slot depth at position 13 is different for p-684-347 and p-684-306 - and you'd be right.  Those two index discs are identical except position 13.  -347 (goes with tape -5) is slot depth 4 (bell depth) and -306 (goes with tape -14) is slot depth 5 (bar depth).

you can't use a m-239-5 tape with a p-684-306 index disc.  The bell symbol at position 13 will behave like a bar symbol.

if you had to hack in a change - and you could cut or plug the index disc slot to a correct depth and curvature - you could make index position 13 the right size of make it an unused slot depth like 7 and wire the wiper board to make slot depth 7 the same as slot depth 4.
 
since cutting/plugging an index disc is not the simplest solution and making a tape isn't ideal, I'd see if monti has either:
-  index disc p-684-347 to match your m-239-5 tape
-  m-239-14 tape to match your p-684-306 disc.

if someone converted your machine to 25c, they probably wanted to lower the payback percentage.  That would require changing tapes, index discs and possibly rewiring the wiper boards.

I'm looking for a solution to the second reel FUBAR, either another reel tape, another index disc, or my son can laser cut another index disc for me.. 
I'm getting new wipers since the fingers were wacked off.
I have ran the second reel and third reel cherry payouts before I figured out the wipers were wacked off, and the cherries are on target, everything is working, cherry payouts are spot on.
Now I need to wait for the new wipers and align everything up according to my plan, and your drawings. I'm thinking the 1st reel was screwed up due to the missing fingers, and alignment.   

[David Walz]

I was trading emails with Monti's slot inquiring about the IKE $1 Coin Mech, since I can't find anything about the IKE $1 coin Coin Mech on the internet.
He has a few of the IKE $1 Coin Mech with the scavenger assembly and sent me a picture of it, it is exactly like mine.

Monti's slot said that these IKE $1 Bally slot machines are scarce, people just don't want the IKE $1 slot machine. Frankly speaking, I think they are cool as 💩.
I will probably purchase the untouched IKE $1 Coin Mech from Month's slot, keeping it with the machine.

[wolftalk]

if you can't get a tape to match your disc, or a disc to match your tape ... and assuming you don't want to make a tape or modify one ... then you only have a couple options.

your disc has a depth 5 slot at position 13 and you need a depth 4 slot.

1] weld in a plug and cut it to the correct shape to make a depth 4 slot ... or the cheesy way is bolts, washers, etc. to change the slot depth

2] cut a new disc.  If you do this route, see if you can get the cnc files that the cutter and make them capable of supporting all 10 slot depths.  I dunno about hardening the plate tho.

3] cut your existing depth 5 slot at position 13 to depth 7.  The specs are on the p-684-270-307.png document for the curvature and depth needed, then wire the rivets to the depth 4 rivets so depth 4 and 7 are the same.  If you are really patient, you could drill, cut and grind this by hand.   Grind off the p-684-306 number since you have a custom disc.

I don't recall pics of your cut wipers ... did you post any?  Per the diagram, you don't need all the fingers since some rivet arcs are unused.

the reel wiper wiring diagram does not match the schematic.  Per notes on the wiper diagram, they moved some rivets down onto unused arcs nearer the bottom to deal with payout issues if the wipers aren't aligned properly on the rivets.  There's a bulletin about the change in the 1090 docs.  I dunno if that change was made on 1114 machines, tho I guess you said your machine matches the wiper diagram.

[David Walz]

if you can't get a tape to match your disc, or a disc to match your tape ... and assuming you don't want to make a tape or modify one ... then you only have a couple options.

your disc has a depth 5 slot at position 13 and you need a depth 4 slot.

1] weld in a plug and cut it to the correct shape to make a depth 4 slot ... or the cheesy way is bolts, washers, etc. to change the slot depth

2] cut a new disc.  If you do this route, see if you can get the cnc files that the cutter and make them capable of supporting all 10 slot depths.  I dunno about hardening the plate tho.

3] cut your existing depth 5 slot at position 13 to depth 7.  The specs are on the p-684-270-307.png document for the curvature and depth needed, then wire the rivets to the depth 4 rivets so depth 4 and 7 are the same.  If you are really patient, you could drill, cut and grind this by hand.   Grind off the p-684-306 number since you have a custom disc.

I don't recall pics of your cut wipers ... did you post any?  Per the diagram, you don't need all the fingers since some rivet arcs are unused.

the reel wiper wiring diagram does not match the schematic.  Per notes on the wiper diagram, they moved some rivets down onto unused arcs nearer the bottom to deal with payout issues if the wipers aren't aligned properly on the rivets.  There's a bulletin about the change in the 1090 docs.  I dunno if that change was made on 1114 machines, tho I guess you said your machine matches the wiper diagram.

I'm only going to do this by the books, it has to be 100% factory original no matter what.
Second reel, 13 position is a small bump in the road, it can be dealt with without hacking the disc, I have several options.
I have new wipers coming in from Monti slots and I will use the old wipers as a guide, only the fingers are wacked off, so matching the new wipers and getting them exactly like the old ones will  not be a problem. 
The reel contact disc wiring on this 1114 machine, matches up with the W-1041 2694, 2695, 2696 diagram.