Author Topic: Hopper time out (Read 9007 times)

chuck300x11 · « **on:** May 31, 2015, 11:26:19 AM »

On a payout coins will get behind the knife stopping the hopper and generating a time out. I clear the coins, attempt to adjust the knife, get it to play for a while, then the coins will get behind the knife again causing another time out. I replaced the knife not too long ago. Are there any other adjustments to make to solve the problem?

Amechanic · « **Reply #1 on:** May 31, 2015, 05:48:13 PM »

Sounds like you might want to disassemble the hopper bowl and clean and inspect your hopper.. I would make sure everything is tight, including the motor mount screws.. The knife should lay flat on the coin wheel and rest on the shelve.. The IGT hoppers only use a 3 point hopper agitator and not a 6 point like in a Bally, so make sure that's correct..

rokgpsman · « **Reply #2 on:** May 31, 2015, 06:16:36 PM »

Are you sure you have the right knife for the coins you are using? Sometimes a machine is converted from one coin denomination to another and they forget to change the hopper knife. It will sorta work but not reliably.

What coins are you using in the machine?

chuck300x11 · « **Reply #3 on:** May 31, 2015, 06:19:10 PM »

I'm using quarters at the moment but I would like to switch to tokens.

rokgpsman · « **Reply #4 on:** May 31, 2015, 06:27:15 PM »

The quarter-sized tokens are very close to same size as a quarter. So if you get the hopper working ok with quarters then quarter-tokens should work ok too. When you bought the replacement knife was it said to be one for use with quarters? If so then the problem is likely just an adjustment as Amechanic mentioned.

Many hoppers also have a "Coin Separator" part to keep a clump of coins from suddenly arriving at the knife and causing problems. Depending on the hopper model this coin separator can be a metal strip or a rubber part with a slit that only allows one coin at a time to pass. You might check this area on your hopper.

Is it possible for you to post a picture of the knife area in the hopper? We might see something that helps with figuring it out.

Here is a picture of one hopper model, it won't be exactly like yours but can give an idea of how the knife is located:

Amechanic · « **Reply #5 on:** May 31, 2015, 06:33:00 PM »

If you wanting to switch to tokens, the .984 are just slightly larger and should work without and changes except to the coin acceptor. You would need to buy one for the .984 tokens, usually around $20.. I like the Black Monex ones. Less moving parts. If the tokens you buy end up being metallic based, all you have to do is pop out the small round magnet in the Monex acceptor and your good to go. If you have a comparitor then you just change the coin in it..

chuck300x11 · « **Reply #6 on:** May 31, 2015, 06:41:55 PM »

Here are 2 pics of my hopper

rokgpsman · « **Reply #7 on:** May 31, 2015, 06:56:04 PM »

With the hopper out of the machine you can turn the hopper motor shaft and watch to see if the jammed coins happen and get an idea of what is going on. At the back of the motor you can grasp and turn the shaft (or sometimes you can apply turning pressure to the coin wheel itself), you will have to release the motor brake that is mounted on top of the motor so it will turn. The brake is usually a little plastic floppy piece that can move downward or upward. Only turn the motor in the direction that causes the coin wheel to revolve counter-clockwise. See if you can cause the problem to happen.

It looks like from your photo that the coin counter is a rocker arm type. There is an adjustment on it that limits its travel as the coin passes under it and moves the rocker up. Although not likely, the rocker arm might be adjusted too far and putting too much pressure on the coin and keeping the coin from easily passing by. Also there is a coin separator, make sure it is not bent upward from the coin wheel so much that 2 or more coins can pass at the same time.

As Amechanic said, the knife needs to be laying on the coin wheel and the point should be right at the pickoff point of the rotating wheel. The knife mounting screws usually allow for adjustment in knife position. If the knife has been bent by a coin jam you may need to bend it back, don't want any space between the knife and the coin wheel.

Here's your photo #2 with some notes:

Amechanic · « **Reply #8 on:** May 31, 2015, 07:54:22 PM »

From what I am seeing is that your knife looks to be for a Bally hopper. The ones I've seen in the IGT hoppers are usually a hard solid black plastic knife. That could be your problem, but I'm not 100% sure. You could attempt to bend the knife to lay flat. You don't want any room for a coin to try to get under neath the knife.

UNIMAN · « **Reply #9 on:** May 31, 2015, 08:08:45 PM »

Here is a pic of a Bally hopper.
Noticed the wheel has vertical tabs to separate the coins. Does not IGT have horizontal tabs?
Is this a Bally hopper and not IGT/Sircoma?

chuck300x11 · « **Reply #10 on:** June 01, 2015, 08:13:03 AM »

I didn't think that Bally and IGT would ever play nice. I bought the machine this way a few years ago. It wasn't working at all back then. Two board repairs later and it is working and even has sound. I bought a new (used) knife thinking that might be the issue (it is the knife in the hopper now). Could a Bally hopper really work in an IGT machine?

Amechanic · « **Reply #11 on:** June 01, 2015, 09:24:44 AM »

The two hoppers look a lot a like. By the shape of your coin bowl the way it's notched in the front tells me its IGT. The Bally hoppers either have a circuit board or a wiper board with contact fingers, (EM) machines. Your hopper won't have either.. It should just have the switch that counts each coin as its paid out. The plug on the IGT Fortune 1 hopper has I believe an 8 pin plug, where the Bally usually had 18... I would try to find a correct hopper knife, that should fix your problem. Check Rudy's for your knife, or a WTB ad here..

Gary

rokgpsman · « **Reply #12 on:** June 01, 2015, 12:22:35 PM »

Quote from: chuck300x11 on June 01, 2015, 08:13:03 AM

....... I bought a new (used) knife thinking that might be the issue (it is the knife in the hopper now)........

The old knife you took out looked the same as the knife you bought & installed?

chuck300x11 · « **Reply #13 on:** June 01, 2015, 04:02:00 PM »

Yes. It looked exactly like the one I removed.

Neonkiss · « **Reply #14 on:** June 01, 2015, 06:36:14 PM »

Chuck, looking at the pictures it looks like the leading sharp edge of the knife is about a 16th of an inch above the shelf wheel. This should be at the level of the shelf wheel. Also the machine does not have an agitator star wheel and someone used a bunch of washers to stir up the coins.

chuck300x11 · « **Reply #15 on:** June 02, 2015, 04:55:52 PM »

That pic is a little blurry. The knife has a lower edge and an upper edge. The lower edge is resting on the shelf. What you are referring to is the gap between the two edges. Should the two edges be pinched together?

Amechanic · « **Reply #16 on:** June 02, 2015, 05:17:29 PM »

Your knife just doesn't fit right. It should lay flat on the coin wheel. Your is down on the wheel about an inch back from the tip. The point or tip should test on the shelve wheel. That how your getting coins under the knife jamming your hopper. I would think its being caused because that's not the correct knife for that hopper.

chuck300x11 · « **Reply #17 on:** June 02, 2015, 05:30:04 PM »

I saw a knife/agitator combo on rudy's site. I should go order it.

Amechanic · « **Reply #18 on:** June 02, 2015, 06:03:00 PM »

That might be the smart bet.. Here are two pictures of an old Fortune 1 hopper I have. You can see the black knife laying flat on the shelf wheel and the 3 pointed hopper star/agitator. You can see in my one pic how the hopper bowl is notched like yours.

chuck300x11 · « **Reply #19 on:** June 03, 2015, 05:34:16 PM »

All parts ordered. Will post results.

UPDATE: All parts received and installed. Played for a half hour with no issues. It is now accepting tokens as well. Thanks for all the help and parts leads.

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Author Topic: Hopper time out (Read 9007 times)