PE PLUS POKER

[gametech2]

Hello all!
 I am a TOTAL NEWBIE, an old technician from the late 80's, early 90's, and I buy and restore older electrical equipment as a hobby in my retirement days.
I just this morning picked up a couple of late 80's games from a gentleman who had a buddy with a gambling problem, who years ago had him come remove them from
his presence in an effort to quit gambling so he said.
 I got a nice IGT  PE PLUS POKER machine model B 107CC, dated 9/89. it had a lot of tokens/coins jammed in the coin slot area, and all over the inside of the machine.
 It had a fuse broken off, (the middle fuse on the main power area), so I disassembled the unit, replaced the fuse holder, and checked all the fuses. all checked good with a fluke meter.
This got it to light up the fluorescent tubes in the front panel, and the top light flashing rather fast, but nothing else seems to work. I checked the output of the door lock infrared LED with my phone camera, and it is producing light on the door side. No other lights, switches, or monitor works.
 without any kind of schematics, I do not want to tear into it very much!
I do not have enough rank or status to be able to view the downloads section, and I assume from a previous post there is a set of schematics available there.
 ANY help or ideas what to look for greatly appreciated!  Thanks in advance.........jb

[Tilt]

 

Does your monitor work so you can see any error messages?  If not, it will be hard to do much else until you get it fixed. 

Since the candle is blinking that shows that the MPU board has some signs of life. 

[gametech2]

Does your monitor work so you can see any error messages?  If not, it will be hard to do much else until you get it fixed. 

Since the candle is blinking that shows that the MPU board has some signs of life.

No, the monitor is hammer dead! These guys did not take good care of these machines, both were full of tokens, and they were scattered all over the machine.A lot had to
be dug out from around the power supply, and he had said he had plugged it up, and all he heard was a "thump" sound. He obviously had no clue! I am assuming some of the
coins shorted out some of the power supply, and one of the busses is dead.
 do you happen to have a layout of the power/data bus plug in the bottom left hand of the monitor?  I could start there if I knew what voltage to expect on this plug, and trace back. Or perhaps what voltage should be present on the three fuses. It's been a day or three since I worked on video games for a local vendor here in my town. Kinda rusty, but still loving the challenge!!
 thanx...............jb

[Chris-socal]

Hi Jb
Welcome to NLG
There is a schematic for PE+ in the file system. It would be visible if you are a contributing member, even if you make a one-time contribution the file system will open to you for a month I believe. I consider it one of my most rewarding monthly expenses!
The file system will be very useful to you, especially as you get into your monitor which is likely a Ceronix 1492. If you don’t hear static on screen when you start the machine the monitor likely needs service.

The PE series of machines is pretty straightforward so you are on the right track of checking the voltages.

The game board only needs 24v AC to boot, the transformer mounted to the tray and onboard voltage regulators take it from there. At the very least, if you have that rail and a working monitor you would get a call attendant error on screen.

You can post pictures any time, we all like to see progress, beginning, progress, end, etc. individual files must be 500k or less and total attachment per post is 1MB.

We look forward to working with you.


Chris

[gametech2]

Thank you very much for the reply.
 I will go look at the contributor section.

[Tilt]

Here's a couple to get you started.  Fixing the CRT will probably be the most challenging task ahead of you.  You should be able to find a schematic diagram for it by googling the make/model of it.

[gametech2]

Thanks!!
jb

[Tilt]

Glad to help.  Good luck!

[Chris-socal]

JB:  in follow up to your question on the other thread,  1492's don't need a lot of caps and I can tell you with 90% certainty that only a few will cause severe enough issue to shut the board down.
I order my caps from therealbobroberts.net. They are old school, you email them what you want and they send you a $ total. You mail a check. LOL
I bought their most common assortment and put them in a parts bin and I keep it refilled with their bulk caps.  You do NOT need to replace the filter caps, I have only ever seen one bad and it had leakage from another component. They don't work hard on this board.

Here are the critical caps (based on my experience...I work on 2-3 1492's every week):

286  This is critical to power management.
191  Vertical Video
Check ESR on 201, 216, 225. Replace if above 5 ohms or so.
I can just about guarantee 230 and 233 have a high ESR. Replace if so.
If you are having weird color issues check 125,126, 127.
You can also check the 1000uf's but I almost guarantee they aren't enough out of tolerance to prevent having an image.

If your board is shutting down check the Vertical IC, if any shorts replacing it while you have that capacitor out is good timing. Listen for chirping, there is a difference between fast chirp and slow chirp.

If your board isn't chirping let me know, I can tell you how to check XRC5184 for shorts.

I will send you the caps list when I get home. I have a sheet.

Chris

[gametech2]

thanks Chris.
 I worked on arcade monitors and systems a long time ago, back in the 80's!
It's been a minute or two! I have forgot a lot since then, but still enjoy this stuff.
It is just difficult to pick out all of the caps from the lists and schematics.
sorry if I hogged the other post, just trying to be helpful.

[Chris-socal]

No worries at all. We try to keep to the issue at hand so future readers don't mistake the conversation for the wrong monitor. It's all good.

1492 monitors (and 1793, 2093. etc) are different than the early arcade chassis'.  Ceronix does a lot of power management with advanced components (for the time) like XRC5184 and switching. They run much cooler and only consume .5 amp or so. Color is managed by XRC5346 and the PRA boards. There is one PRA for each color and 3 transistors for each color. These transistors all need to be checked. If one goes out it causes all kinds of image issues because the sync and contrast controllers are trying to balance all the colors.
There are no sync or contrast adjustments, it's all managed by the IC's.
If I had your board in hand I could probably spot problems within a few minutes. I occasionally get one that stumps me and I have to consult our Guru member "Badbaud". But most fall into one of these primary failures:

Capacitor #286
Vertical IC (Only pin 1 should short to ground)
Cap #191 (Vertical)
Caps: 201,230,233
PRA-H board or the 10uf surface mount cap. We replace them with radial caps: Works great, cheap, looks funny.
PRA-B Color boards
#130 12v regulator
Flyback. None available unless you are willing to pay. If your FB is out it's better to buy a working board or a parts board.
If something got shorted and the board is dead check #295, 160v zener diode.
XRC5184 occasionally dies or gets killed in a short circuit. I can walk you through a passive test to spot for obvious problems.

As you mentioned it's a good idea to ramp up using an isolated Variac, listen for chirping. The type of chirp tells a story, it will usually kick in around 60-80v and go into shut down around 100v....or if you fixed the problem the board will start up around 105. 

[gametech2]

thanks...
I will check all of that tomorrow, just got home about an hour ago.
I do appreciate your help, we will figure it out soon.
thanks again.......jb

[Chris-socal]

1492 cap list attached

[jay]

We should put this in our archives.

[Chris-socal]

I will. I will scan it as a pdf tho.

[gametech2]

Thanks, Chris!!
 This will save me a lot of henpecking, trying to sift through the schema.
I appreciate this a lot.
Haven/t been on here at all till just now, had to replace a window regulator in my better half's blazer.
wont try that again!!!
thanx again.........jb

[Chris-socal]

Let me guess....it's only 4 bolts.
But the 4 bolts on the new part don't line up with the 4 bolts on the new part and you already had the door panel hanging by the wire loom after removing 15 clips, one of which was stubborn and didn't pop out correctly so it will have a rattle. Then you found out there was a version B of the regulator that GM issued mid-year so you had to call someone to find out the correct part is in the next town and won't arrive until tomorrow, I'm sure your phone call required you to wait on hold for 30 minutes until your important call was answered. In the meantime someone bumped the car door and the panel that was hanging from the loom go smashed in the door and will have a permanent line in it.
The battery also went dead because the door was slightly ajar all night.
I know those projects well.

[gametech2]

HI all.
 Chris, you were right, C286, C191,and C195 were the main culprits. Actually I went through the list you sent me, one at a time, trying it after each cap! It finally fired off after changing out C195!!
I haven't had much time to work on the machine yet, but I do have a screen now, with a low battery message, and lots of retrace lines, pink screen.
set it to the side until now, have a few other caps ordered, should be in tomorrow.
I did a recap on the machine, but some I did not have the exact ones. I ordered a cap set off of Amazon, they doodled around for several days, till I finally just cancelled.
But I re ordered some individual caps today, made sure they would overnight them this time (PRIME.....YEA...RIGHT!!!)
Anyway, we will see. I haven't even tried to adjust the g2 on the flyback down any, just was too tired at the time, then life kicked in, I had to get busy again!! LOL.
Tomorrow should be interesting,
I noticed something ..C286 is listed as a 50 volt cap, but was a 25 volt instead. Seems odd.
I will try to post a picture of what I have on the screen.   ((well Linux saves the files in a size too large! I will post later after converting them.))
    thanx......................jb

[gametech2]

Let me guess....it's only 4 bolts.
But the 4 bolts on the new part don't line up with the 4 bolts on the new part and you already had the door panel hanging by the wire loom after removing 15 clips, one of which was stubborn and didn't pop out correctly so it will have a rattle. Then you found out there was a version B of the regulator that GM issued mid-year so you had to call someone to find out the correct part is in the next town and won't arrive until tomorrow, I'm sure your phone call required you to wait on hold for 30 minutes until your important call was answered. In the meantime someone bumped the car door and the panel that was hanging from the loom go smashed in the door and will have a permanent line in it.
The battery also went dead because the door was slightly ajar all night.
I know those projects well.

LOLOLOL...I just re read this reply in its entirity. 2FUNNY!!
 No not QUITE that bad, but bad enough! I only punched 2 holes in the speaker with the stupid hanging door panel, broke off one top clip, and got that NASTY STUPID STUFF that seals the door water barrier all over me and everything else. Oh yea, some GENIUS engineer at GM decided that these bad boyz should be riveted in with HUGE steel rivets!!!  Fun fun stuff getting those out, and even more fun putting them back in. Glad I had my old pnuematic riveter, and it still worked!!
anyway, GOTrDUN!!
Still trying to figure out how much to post in pictures. Don't want to overload the system, but took a lot of pictures as I went along with this monitor project. (I always do.)
thanx................jb

[Tilt]

Pictures have to be less than 1MB in size in order to post on the forum.  So resize as necessary to get under that limitation and post away.